OT: Sens Lounge - Golf season edition

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Beech

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Nov 25, 2020
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I have had two male work colleagues that were married to women and had children, and decided/realized they were gay. Divorced. One now has a male spouse, the other serially dates only men. Both Gen X, one maybe late Boomer.
yup..my point.

so the 2.6% Baby Boomer rate... reflects somewhat of an absolute rate. And no longer contains societally restricted values (Or close too, there will always be restrictions)..

So why the sharp increases?? Why is the number not stable at 3-4%? Why did it hit 5, then 10 and now 20?

I believe that this increase has discredited that community and not re-enforced it.

The "we are born this way" argument... Fell... The "we are the way we are because nature made us this way", fell.

Members of that community need to be asking themselves: is homosexuality a toy for today's youth? A toy for society?

ANYWAY.. @Stylizer1 used the word FAD a few day ago!!!! I am beginning to wonder.
 

Masked

(Super/star)
Apr 16, 2017
6,834
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They got the donuts? Excellent....
The theats to safety and livelihood that trans people face are minimized by people with no stake in the game.

When it comes to safety, transgendered people have a far lower murder rate in the US and the UK than the general population.

Someone crunched the numbers in the UK for the rate of incarcerated sex offenders amongst various segments of the population. Females were at a rate of 3 per million, males were almost 400 per million but males who identify as transgendered were at rate of almost 2000 per million.

assennayo
 

dumbdick

Galactic Defender
May 31, 2008
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The Prager University Foundation, known as PragerU, is an American advocacy group and media organization that creates content promoting conservative viewpoints on various political, economic, and sociological topics. It was co-founded in 2009 by Allen Estrin and talk show host Dennis Prager. Despite the name including the word "university", it is not an academic institution and does not confer degrees.

Source: wikipedia.

Actually count, I'd highly recommend you read the full Wikipedia entry (PragerU - Wikipedia).

Media literacy is super important these days. Way too many people just search for evidence to support things they feel comforted by believing.
 
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Flamingo

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Nov 13, 2008
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When it comes to safety, transgendered people have a far lower murder rate in the US and the UK than the general population.

Someone crunched the numbers in the UK for the rate of incarcerated sex offenders amongst various segments of the population. Females were at a rate of 3 per million, males were almost 400 per million but males who identify as transgendered were at rate of almost 2000 per million.

assennayo
You think this demonstrates that trans women are more violent or generally criminally-minded? On complaint of the trans community is that police especially don’t take their safety seriously and even target them unnecessarily.
 

Flamingo

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Nov 13, 2008
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yup..my point.

so the 2.6% Baby Boomer rate... reflects somewhat of an absolute rate. And no longer contains societally restricted values (Or close too, there will always be restrictions)..

So why the sharp increases?? Why is the number not stable at 3-4%? Why did it hit 5, then 10 and now 20?

I believe that this increase has discredited that community and not re-enforced it.

The "we are born this way" argument... Fell... The "we are the way we are because nature made us this way", fell.

Members of that community need to be asking themselves: is homosexuality a toy for today's youth? A toy for society?

ANYWAY.. @Stylizer1 used the word FAD a few day ago!!!! I am beginning to wonder.
I really don’t follow your logic, Beech.
 
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AchtzehnBaby

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Mar 28, 2013
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TikTok has been downloaded over 3 billion times since its launch in 2016. TikTok gained 1.36 billion downloads (45% of total downloads) from Q1 in 2020 through to Q2 in 2021. TikTok currently has 1 billion monthly active users worldwide
 

Stylizer1

Teflon Don
Jun 12, 2009
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1692663874867.png
 

Micklebot

Moderator
Apr 27, 2010
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yup..my point.

so the 2.6% Baby Boomer rate... reflects somewhat of an absolute rate. And no longer contains societally restricted values (Or close too, there will always be restrictions)..

So why the sharp increases?? Why is the number not stable at 3-4%? Why did it hit 5, then 10 and now 20?

I believe that this increase has discredited that community and not re-enforced it.

The "we are born this way" argument... Fell... The "we are the way we are because nature made us this way", fell.

Members of that community need to be asking themselves: is homosexuality a toy for today's youth? A toy for society?

ANYWAY.. @Stylizer1 used the word FAD a few day ago!!!! I am beginning to wonder.
The fact that a person can transition later in life does not negate the reality that their are more obstacles to transition later in life than there are earlier, nor does it negate people develop many of their beliefs earlier in life.

You mentioned religion earlier, that's another variable that likely plays into things, as fewer and fewer people are identifying as religious. As recently as the 90s about 90% of Americans identified as Christian, that's not dropped to about 63% with a huge upswing of "unaffiliated". Not only has the churches stance on LGBTQ issues becomeore progressive, but fewer people are religious as well, that's going to have a big impact taking kids in particular

And again, nature and nurture work together in developing a person's identity, this idea that 40 years of nurture can be washed away because of 20 years of progressively more tolerance just doesn't align with the real world.
 

Nac Mac Feegle

wee & free
Jun 10, 2011
35,408
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What if they are benevolent and bring us technology that allows us to travel the stars? Fix our planet and Terraform Venus and Mars? Cure all diseases and stop aging?


I have asked this question to a couple people and its funny how the age determines the answer, but lets say two alien species appear on earth. One can cure your body so that it never ages, never fails and you are never sick again. Think Captain America in his prime forever. The other species offers cybernetics that can alter your body to do whatever you want. An eye that can zoom in 30 miles away, whatever you want.

Which do you choose?

Well, if life outside of Earth is anything like life on Earth, I seriously doubt a superior lifeform is going to power up an inferior one.

It would be nice, though. But at the end of the day, mystery martians aren't going to save us. We have to do it ourselves.
 

AchtzehnBaby

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Mar 28, 2013
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Well, if life outside of Earth is anything like life on Earth, I seriously doubt a superior lifeform is going to power up an inferior one.

It would be nice, though. But at the end of the day, mystery martians aren't going to save us. We have to do it ourselves.
I figure aliens are watching us like we are bacteria growing under a microscope.
 

thinkwild

Veni Vidi Toga
Jul 29, 2003
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I didn’t think nurture had anything to do with one’s sexuality. Seems all nature to me. But it does seem to be a worry, lets say, some have that all this acceptance and talking about it is causing the number of gay people to increase. Until eventually, as that hopefully sarcastic graphic of Bill Maher’s shows, everyone is gay. Seems ridiculous and transparent to me. But im no expert
 

thinkwild

Veni Vidi Toga
Jul 29, 2003
11,048
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Ottawa
I was listening to one AI expert suggest that we should start considering AI as a new species rather as a new technology. Some think the real life form is our genes and we are just their gene machines. Maybe our gene's ultimate goal is to eventually use us to construct an Ai that connects it with other similar advanced lifeforms :)
 

Laphroaig

Registered User
Aug 26, 2011
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The Town Fun Forgot
Two very interesting conversations happening here. On the alien issue I'd just like to remind people that Stephen Hawking opined that if aliens were to arrive on Earth that we would be the Indians. Be careful what you wish for.

On the trans issue I'll confess to being shockingly uninformed never having knowingly interacted with a trans person. I've probably learned a great deal about the issue from reading this thread. The whole subject is confusing and disturbing for me. Life was once much simpler. I have a lot of mixed feelings but my strongest emotion is one of revulsion towards the likes of Ron DeSantis and Kid Rock who revel in their demonization of trans people. No one deserves that.
 
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Ice-Tray

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Jan 31, 2006
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One thing I have noticed that I find curious is that most people who I talk to who like to talk about their ‘rights’, rarely talk about the associated responsibilities that come with those rights. They tend to feel that their personal rights some how transcend that of the majority in our society. It’s almost as though their ‘rights’ are some individual thing that comes from a higher authority that are unassailable. I wonder where this idea comes from?

My understanding is that those rights were created, amended, and are safeguarded by the democratic society around us, rather than some inner personal ownership. There are no ‘my rights’ there are a series of collective rights and responsibilities, and it is the various governments, and all of us who vote for them who are the only reason there is a Charter of Rights, and a legal system to protect and enforce them.

Each section of the charter also contains limitations on those rights, and explains when and how they can be superseded or denied. Nothing is an absolute right or freedom, they never have been.

To me there is a social contract between the individual and the safety of the collective, and that contract can change and evolve over time to suit the needs of the group. The idea that we would enshrine behaviours for all time and protect members from ever having to adapt to match the prevailing behaviours seems ludicrous. The right to bear arms in the US is a perfect example of how a poorly written/manipulated document can handicap a society for centuries past the expiry date of the spirit of the passage.

Random musings after a colourful conversation… :)
 
Jan 6, 2010
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One thing I have noticed that I find curious is that most people who I talk to who like to talk about their ‘rights’, rarely talk about the associated responsibilities that come with those rights. They tend to feel that their personal rights some how transcend that of the majority in our society. It’s almost as though their ‘rights’ are some individual thing that comes from a higher authority that are unassailable. I wonder where this idea comes from?

My understanding is that those rights were created, amended, and are safeguarded by the democratic society around us, rather than some inner personal ownership. There are no ‘my rights’ there are a series of collective rights and responsibilities, and it is the various governments, and all of us who vote for them who are the only reason there is a Charter of Rights, and a legal system to protect and enforce them.

Each section of the charter also contains limitations on those rights, and explains when and how they can be superseded or denied. Nothing is an absolute right or freedom, they never have been.

To me there is a social contract between the individual and the safety of the collective, and that contract can change and evolve over time to suit the needs of the group. The idea that we would enshrine behaviours for all time and protect members from ever having to adapt to match the prevailing behaviours seems ludicrous. The right to bear arms in the US is a perfect example of how a poorly written/manipulated document can handicap a society for centuries past the expiry date of the spirit of the passage.

Random musings after a colourful conversation… :)
'God given' use to be a concept understood by anyone with a sense of free will and self agency. 'Muse' yourself into your own arbitrary shackles - don't tread on me.
 

dumbdick

Galactic Defender
May 31, 2008
11,749
4,186
One thing I have noticed that I find curious is that most people who I talk to who like to talk about their ‘rights’, rarely talk about the associated responsibilities that come with those rights. They tend to feel that their personal rights some how transcend that of the majority in our society. It’s almost as though their ‘rights’ are some individual thing that comes from a higher authority that are unassailable. I wonder where this idea comes from?

My understanding is that those rights were created, amended, and are safeguarded by the democratic society around us, rather than some inner personal ownership. There are no ‘my rights’ there are a series of collective rights and responsibilities, and it is the various governments, and all of us who vote for them who are the only reason there is a Charter of Rights, and a legal system to protect and enforce them.

Each section of the charter also contains limitations on those rights, and explains when and how they can be superseded or denied. Nothing is an absolute right or freedom, they never have been.

To me there is a social contract between the individual and the safety of the collective, and that contract can change and evolve over time to suit the needs of the group. The idea that we would enshrine behaviours for all time and protect members from ever having to adapt to match the prevailing behaviours seems ludicrous. The right to bear arms in the US is a perfect example of how a poorly written/manipulated document can handicap a society for centuries past the expiry date of the spirit of the passage.

Random musings after a colourful conversation… :)
Good post.

Made me think of a recent conversation I had with a very sweet and caring older woman who enjoys shooting at the range. I asked her opinion about the idea that she should have to store her gun in a secure lock-up at her local range rather than be allowed to keep it at her home.

Her response was that it was a bad idea because it would make it inconvenient if she one day wanted to go to a different range.

I explained that this could be worked out, and that a lot of kids/grandkids get a hold of those guns at home and accidentally (or purposefully) off themselves. And it's a pretty simple mistake to forget to lock it up or to use a password on the safe that the kid gets a hold of.

i also told her that adults and teens can go through really short-lived bouts of depression, particularly during nights of heavy intoxication, and having that gun in the house makes a tragedy painfully easy to occur, even for the "good" gun owners.

So in considering this possible regulation, she was basically weighing (A) "her right" to not have the hypothetical inconvenience of having to transfer her gun from one range to another, against (B) literal dead children, possibly her own kids or grandkids.

Her response to all that was that she could possibly be okay with allowing that kind of change, while also raising vague hand-wavy concerns about other stuff she hadn't thought of yet that would probably still make it unworkable.

But what really struck me is the fact that this mild-mannered, caring and intelligent woman felt her "being okay with it" mattered in the slightest. That she believed decisions about new gun regulations shouldn't fall to society, but to the benevolence of gun owners and their willingness to cede some of their inalienable "rights" for the greater good.

It speaks volumes to where we are on things.

People have lost all concept of how a society is supposed to work.
 
Jan 6, 2010
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5,973
I explained that this could be worked out, and that a lot of kids/grandkids get a hold of those guns at home and accidentally (or purposefully) off themselves. And it's a pretty simple mistake to forget to lock it up or to use a password on the safe that the kid gets a hold of.

i also told her that adults and teens can go through really short-lived bouts of depression, particularly during nights of heavy intoxication, and having that gun in the house makes a tragedy painfully easy to occur, even for the "good" gun owners.
Bro. I'm hoping you know this lady on some substantial personal level cause that's some odd shit to be going off on in some random convo. She might be gripping on it even tighter after that.
 

Tnuoc Alucard

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Sep 23, 2015
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Source: wikipedia.

Actually count, I'd highly recommend you read the full Wikipedia entry (PragerU - Wikipedia).

Media literacy is super important these days. Way too many people just search for evidence to support things they feel comforted by believing.
Am well aware of what Prageru is, and when you can’t reasonably debate the content of the message, you attack the messenger, and try to delegitimize it ……. Everything in the video is factual, so why not try to debunk it, instead of summerly dismissing it?




By the way, there are some States that have already approved Prageru videos for use in their Educational systems, to balance the progressive leaning videos produced by Scholastic and others that are included in the Educational system already…. There are more than one (the progressive) side to every story….but progressives tend to do whatever it takes to ban opposing POVs
 
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dumbdick

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May 31, 2008
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Am well aware of what Prageru is, and when you can’t reasonably debate the content of the message, you attack the messenger, and try to delegitimize it ……. Everything in the video is factual, so why not try to debunk it, instead of summerly dismissing it?
*Summarily.

I'm not a scientist, so I defer to real scientists. You posted a video made by a conservative advocacy group masquerading as a university, started by a radio host. If you've got a paper you co-authored in Nature feel free to send it my way.

But more importantly, why would two mugs like us sit here and debate technical points about renewable energy scalability at all? Googling videos and papers as evidence to help our side pwn the other's? Maybe we can do the same thing about covid protein receptors or the impact of cloud cover on climate models too.

The fact that average joes think that's normal behaviour is a problem. We need a bit more humility.

My advice would be to stop drowning your brain in stuff just because it's contrarian or it aligns with the way you or your tribe would like the world to exist.

And maybe stop normalizing it by believing everyone should "do their own research" or other such nonsense. It's just code for "if you don't like reality, go find the facts that align with what you want to hear". But it ultimately just makes you easy targets for those wishing to steer you towards whatever opinion they want you to hold.
 

FunkySeeFunkyDoo

Registered User
Feb 3, 2009
5,198
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Am well aware of what Prageru is, and when you can’t reasonably debate the content of the message, you attack the messenger, and try to delegitimize it ……. Everything in the video is factual, so why not try to debunk it, instead of summerly dismissing it?
...
Okay, well I'll focus in on one point that is close enough to my field (electrical engineering) that I can comment on it: at about the 1:25 mark he describes the number of years it would take the Tesla battery plant to manufacture enough batteries to power the US (500 years is the claim, no idea whether it's correct or not).

But this is gross distortion, simply because the design of car batteries is so different from the design of batteries that would be used to backup the power grid -- the former has to be a certain (relatively small) size, shape and weight, while the latter is pretty much unconstrained (probably would be small buildings scattered throughout the city).

So the process and economics of manufacturing the two are so different that it makes no sense to compare them.

Really, from that point onwards you should be very skeptical about all the data presented.
 
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Micklebot

Moderator
Apr 27, 2010
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Am well aware of what Prageru is, and when you can’t reasonably debate the content of the message, you attack the messenger, and try to delegitimize it ……. Everything in the video is factual, so why not try to debunk it, instead of summerly dismissing it?
The issue is Prager U is so frequently pushing Content that is highly questionable in terms of being factually misleading at best and outright false at worst that it becomes unreasonable to expect anyone to take what they say at face value.

I mean, here's a list of debunked, misleading or just strange claims from their wind and solar videos, courtesy or ars Technica, I believe this is for the same video, it's possible they've put out more than one on the topic.

  • Mills complains that our best solar technology is only 26 percent efficient. But that's only true for silicon panels; our best, most expensive panels can clear 40 percent efficiency. The focus on efficiency, however, is also a distraction, because solar panel efficiency is already high enough for solar farms to be economical.
  • The same issue arises when Mills complains about the efficiency of wind turbines. Is it as high as we would like? No. But who cares? Wind turbines already generate power economically. Improvements would be terrific, but they aren't necessary to make wind and solar work cheaply in the real world.
  • Mills suggests that the only solution to the peaks and troughs (or "intermittency") of wind and solar is batteries. But there are plenty of additional options, like compressed air storage, pumped hydro, or even fossil fuel plants with carbon capture.
  • Mills focuses all his attention on what he considers to be the limitations of lithium batteries. But there is plenty of research on other battery chemistries that use different metals entirely.
  • Mills argues that the lack of batteries is why wind and solar power aren't producing more than three percent of the world's power. Note that he's using "power" to get this figure. If instead he used "electricity," wind and solar now produce over 10 percent globally, starting from zero a few decades ago.
  • Mills claims that lithium and cobalt are rare earth elements. They are not. This isn't important to his argument, but it's extremely sloppy.
  • Mills then says he has environmental concerns about the resource extraction needed to build solar panels, wind turbines, and batteries. This a valid concern to have! But it ignores the massive environmental damage caused by fossil fuel extraction and the production of equipment to burn it.
  • Mills does a similar thing with human rights abuses in places where these materials are sourced. Again, a worthy concern. But it remains a problem for fossil fuels as well.
  • Mills acts like it's not possible to recycle any of the hardware involved in wind, solar, and batteries. This is an area where work remains to be done, but as a blanket statement, it's certainly not true.
  • Mills calls our fossil fuel supply "almost inexhaustible." Come on. This is just obviously not true.
  • Mills compares the rate of oil extraction to the rate of power generation by wind turbines... for no obvious reason whatsoever.
 
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