GDT: Senators @ Flames | 9PM | TSN2, SNW, RDS | The Turnstile of Turncoat Turnarounds Edition

[Korpse]

…4 straight cup finals…3 and 1 in those finals…or is it 3 straight?

Holy shit that's an incredible dishonest response. It's not like benching his best players has been routine.

 

[AchtzehnBaby]

2015 during the Hamburglar run

Same score …same date

 

[Pierre from Orleans]

How has that worked out for Tampa? Not to mention the situations are in no way comparable. Benching players are a tool and it's one that DJ has used. It's not to only way and not something you can do over and over. Brannstrom gets scratched not because of accountability, rather he just isn't effective enough to warrant a spot in the lineup.

And Dylan Gambrell warrants a spot in the lineup?

 

[Korpse]

And Dylan Gambrell warrants a spot in the lineup?

I mean he's been scratched more often than Brannstrom. The only reason he is playing so much recently is lack of competition at C.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Holy shit that's an incredible dishonest response. It's not like benching his best players has been routine.

He’s clearly a coach willing to do it. And his players know it and have known it

 

[Micklebot]

He’s clearly a coach willing to do it. And his players know it and have known it

And when he actually did it, it backfired.

He's also the same coach who got swept in the first round after winning the president's trophy.

How much of his record is him, and how much is the roster, did the coach get them swept, or the roster, did the coach get them to the SCF or the roster?

 

[Burrowsaurus]

And when he actually did it, it backfired.

He's also the same coach who got swept in the first round after winning the president's trophy.

How much of his record is him, and how much is the roster, did the coach get them swept, or the roster, did the coach get them to the SCF or the roster?

Like many things. Or even all things. Both.

 

[Cosmix]

How do they take responsibility when nobody holds them accountable? I am sure they don’t like losing and they are actually trying to do too much sometimes.

The bottom line is, DJ is not doing what the good coach should be doing. Accountability is one of many things on that list. I pretty much would bet anything that this group would be in a playoff sport had they have someone like Trotz as their coach as of May last year.

I think we need to replace Dorion as soon as the new owner is in place. Let the new GM hire his own coaching, scouting and development staff.

 

[Union2017]

I think we need to replace Dorion as soon as the new owner is in place. Let the new GM hire his own coaching, scouting and development staff.

That's probably what will happen, I think. But I could be wrong. I also wonder what Alfie's relationship with Dorion is like.

 

[Cosmix]

It's because of plays like this....



10 seconds left in the period. You are out for a d zone face off and you make a half ass play like that on the boards. If this team wants to take the next step, it doesn't matter who the coach is when the players are the ice are making plays like that.

I think it was Stutzle who made that feeble panic clearing attempt along the boards. I like Stutzle and he is certainly skillfull. He would learn a lot from a competent coaching staff.

That's probably what will happen, I think. But I could be wrong. I also wonder what Alfie's relationship with Dorion is like.

I do not know what Alfie's relationship with Dorion is, nor what type of position and role he would want with the team. I think it would be best if he started as an assistant coach or assistant GM to learn first before taking on more senior roles. Perhaps even those assistant roles might be too much too soon for him.

 

[Cosmix]

The #1 role of a coach to me is get the most out of the roster you have. To do that you gotta motivate players to get better and shelter them effectively to build and regain confidence. Put systems and assignments in that you know the players on your team can play too.

Coaches need to educate the players too, telling them what they expect from them and holding them accountable if they do not do things as requested.

 

[Korpse]

I think it was Stutzle who made that feeble panic clearing attempt along the boards. I like Stutzle and he is certainly skillfull. He would learn a lot from a competent coaching staff.

I think he has learned a lot from this coaching staff and could learn more from others. There’s somethings you don’t need to be told as a NHL player though. It’s a selfish play. He didn’t want to take contact. That shits got to go. If they want to take the next step an on ice leader like Stutzle has to play like one. Doesn’t matter who the coach is.

 

[Cosmix]

I think he has learned a lot from this coaching staff and could learn more from others. There’s somethings you don’t need to be told as a NHL player though. It’s a selfish play. He didn’t want to take contact. That shits got to go. If they want to take the next step an on ice leader like Stutzle has to play like one. Doesn’t matter who the coach is.

I agree. As he is quite young I think he will improve in the future.

 

[Xspyrit]

Many teams would kill to be painted into this corner. Cannot fault Dorion for the core he’s put together. Two top centers. 3 top pairing d men. 2 elite wingers.

Dorion hasn't done much, despite the public belief. He didn't mess up the Tkachuk, Stutzle and Sanderson picks I guess (4th, 3rd and 5th OA). Keep in mind we didn't have our 4th OA pick in 2019 (Byram? Cozens? Zegras? Boldy?). We also screwed up on the 10th OA pick in 2021...

Rebuilding from earth scratch is not very hard, you sell your assets as high as possible and make sure you don't mess up your lottery picks

Dorion was in an extremely enviable position when the rebuild started (January 2018 in Barbados?). All these other teams rebuilding wish they had some Karlsson, Stone, Duchene, etc level assets for trade with an already good prospect pool (Chabot, White, Batherson, Formenton, Paul, etc)

Adding Giroux was one of the most profitable moves (some would say we were lucky there). Getting DeBrincat and Chychrun was great but HIGH 1st round picks are pretty damn valuable nowadays. We paid very decent prices but no other team would be able to beat these pieces in quality

Anyway, we'll see if the make up of the team is enough to win but as of now, despite all the talent, it doesn't look very promising. Maybe a new coaching staff will change everything

 

[boxbox]

Well clearly brannstrom has the shortest leash. In game no but like in the room or practice.


Yeah it does. And the future will too lol. So I don’t understand the “what other coaches are out there?? You seriously think ANYONE can do any better?” Sentiment. Yes there are other coaches out there. I beleive that others can do better. And he’s the coach. I’ll change the coach before changing the core of the team

If someone that does not follow the Sens or the NHL in general, dove into the content on here, they would most likely assume this team was a lock to win the cup this year, had it not been for the teams highly unqualified coach the Sens gm found in a cereal box the team fell 1 win shy of 66 for the season; a slight improvement from the 33 wins a season ago, all players wore ear pods through out games/practices as they completely tuned out the coach, Norris retired from hockey after being convinced hes a non factor to the teams success.

So you believe others can do better? fair enough....so then you believe the Sens should be a lock for the playoffs ? have more wins since coaching is that bad ? Like what does "better" look like for a team in the position/phase they are inn ? would you want change if the played well but kept losing ?

 

[boxbox]

We scored how many on Chicago, Vancouver and Calgary. Let’s not pretend we are Oilers here.

bad road trip it happens...there are good and bad stretches, it would be more worry-some if every good game was followed by an awful one, all streaks come to an end...it is not enjoyable for sure... sens goaltending is awful this season; like laughable bad, when the goalies play steady with slightly above .905 save % and GAA of slightly bellow 3, the results are great, theres been very few instances this season where the goalie has great stats in loss...some very ugly numbers in some loses...

Can't blame the rookie goalies, good lesson/experience, and can't really fault Talbot for being made of glass, I'll just blame the coach and gm

 

[Burrowsaurus]

If someone that does not follow the Sens or the NHL in general, dove into the content on here, they would most likely assume this team was a lock to win the cup this year, had it not been for the teams highly unqualified coach the Sens gm found in a cereal box the team fell 1 win shy of 66 for the season; a slight improvement from the 33 wins a season ago, all players wore ear pods through out games/practices as they completely tuned out the coach, Norris retired from hockey after being convinced hes a non factor to the teams success.

So you believe others can do better? fair enough....so then you believe the Sens should be a lock for the playoffs ? have more wins since coaching is that bad ? Like what does "better" look like for a team in the position/phase they are inn ? would you want change if the played well but kept losing ?

Do you think there’s a difference between how much you lose and how you lose? I do? I expected this team to be right where it is. But with acceptable defence. We have not seen acceptable team defence.

 

[boxbox]

Dorion hasn't done much, despite the public belief. He didn't mess up the Tkachuk, Stutzle and Sanderson picks I guess (4th, 3rd and 5th OA). Keep in mind we didn't have our 4th OA pick in 2019 (Byram? Cozens? Zegras? Boldy?). We also screwed up on the 10th OA pick in 2021...

Rebuilding from earth scratch is not very hard, you sell your assets as high as possible and make sure you don't mess up your lottery picks

Dorion was in an extremely enviable position when the rebuild started (January 2018 in Barbados?). All these other teams rebuilding wish they had some Karlsson, Stone, Duchene, etc level assets for trade with an already good prospect pool (Chabot, White, Batherson, Formenton, Paul, etc)

Adding Giroux was one of the most profitable moves (some would say we were lucky there). Getting DeBrincat and Chychrun was great but HIGH 1st round picks are pretty damn valuable nowadays. We paid very decent prices but no other team would be able to beat these pieces in quality

Anyway, we'll see if the make up of the team is enough to win but as of now, despite all the talent, it doesn't look very promising. Maybe a new coaching staff will change everything

You can't say high 1st round picks are valuable and then if they don't pan out blame the team for screwing up. No pick is really ever guaranteed. 1st overall and 2nd usually are sure bets, 3-5 safe bets, 10 th you will most likely get an NHLer down the road but how good will they be no one knows. Not forgetting how long they will take to develop. The risk aspect will always be there. So giving up 1st round picks for proven commodities like a top pairing D man entering his prime and a player who is top 5 in the NHL in total goals scored the last few seasons is a great return (I know it was more then than just one pick)

The way you present this leaves out a lot important info. Like for example all the drama around the team at that time with EK wife being directly involved in some of it, EK being the captain of the team let personal drama into the locker room, all of it being on public display...but hey thats on Dorion right....

There have also been multiple scenarios where it simply came down to the player refusing the trade because of the destination.

EK is a great talent but byeond personal achievements he has very few team ones. The return was fair considering the bagage EK carried at that time. SJ went from contender to lottery favorites under EK and of course he has his best season in year in the most meaning less team season. Majority of the rebuilding teams all had multiple picks in the top 3 and some even multiple 1st overall picks , while Ottawa had just the 3rd in 2020, not forgetting Ottawa losing draft position, Ottawa got lucky with Tim and Brady because those are the type of players 1-2 picks fetch. Ottawa is actually ahead of some of the teams with far fewer top picks.

Rebuilds are not easy, look at Buffalo, Edmonton, even NJ just how long it took to get it finally in what appears the right direction, and all those teams have multiple 1st overall picks (elite franchise type players)

More than anything the goal-tending needs to be reassessed and do whatever necessary to get it back on track. With steady goaltendng this team is a playoff team. With elite goaltending this team has the potential to be very good.

The team is winning, a few games over 0.500 is winning ? for all bad luck or whatever this season the experience from it all is something that cant be thought or bought

 

[boxbox]

Do you think there’s a difference between how much you lose and how you lose? I do? I expected this team to be right where it is. But with acceptable defence. We have not seen acceptable team defence.

I did ask you.... " would you want change if the played well but kept losing ?"

I do know the difference, but in the end the team that gets 16 wins lifts the cup and not the team with good breakouts from the zones...there is no style points

So if the defense was better ,do you think the team would have more wins ? thus exceeding your expectations ?

Defense is not the problem, look at the goalie stats for all LOSES this season. As a rookie he gets a pass but he still have a job to do. A good goalie can make an average defense look great, a bad goalie can make a good defense look worse

 

[Burrowsaurus]

I did ask you.... " would you want change if the played well but kept losing ?"

I do know the difference, but in the end the team that gets 16 wins lifts the cup and not the team with good breakouts from the zones...there is no style points

So if the defense was better ,do you think the team would have more wins ? thus exceeding your expectations ?

Defense is not the problem, look at the goalie stats for all LOSES this season. As a rookie he gets a pass but he still have a job to do. A good goalie can make an average defense look great, a bad goalie can make a good defense look worse

No I don’t think we would have more wins and if we did it wouldn’t be much more. And maybe we would have some more losses to even if out.

I did not think we would make the playoffs this year.

Well to your last paragraph I simply disagree. We break down defensively way too often

We don’t need a goalie that can make an average defence look good. We need a goalie who can make a bad defence (and I’m talking team defence not the d corps) look good.

Stats are stats. I’m watching the games. You’re watching the games. We are are terrible in our zone. Even the shots that can be stopped come off egregious defensive zone breakdowns. Like “goalie should have had that”. Yeah. Maybe. But why were there 2 guys wide open in our slot? And the sad thing is. Those guys are going to get open again and again and again and again and again. All game long. The odd man rushes this road trip alone lol… I meeeaaaannnnn. Cmon. Would you like a stop on some. Sure. But cmon. Help your goalie out. Sogaard has let in like 40 goals in his like 4 starts (yes I knooooow the number isn’t 40) but he’s somehow also made multiple incredible point blank saves lol. Which isn’t me defending sogaard. It’s saying that even with the goals going in. There are other ghastly breakdowns that DONT end up in our net.

I I think I can count all comfortable defensive zone possessions on this road trip on one hand.

And “let’s go get a goalie that can bail us out every game” is not sustainable and likely not even possibly.

 

[Burrowsaurus]

Someone on Twitter mentioned how much better our new players look as soon as they get here vs when they’re in DJs systems

Joseph. Chychrun.

Even debrincat at the start of the year was absolutely flying.

 

[boxbox]

No I don’t think we would have more wins and if we did it wouldn’t be much more. And maybe we would have some more losses to even if out.

I did not think we would make the playoffs this year.

Well to your last paragraph I simply disagree. We break down defensively way too often

We don’t need a goalie that can make an average defence look good. We need a goalie who can make a bad defence (and I’m talking team defence not the d corps) look good.

Stats are stats. I’m watching the games. You’re watching the games. We are are terrible in our zone. Even the shots that can be stopped come off egregious defensive zone breakdowns. Like “goalie should have had that”. Yeah. Maybe. But why were there 2 guys wide open in our slot? And the sad thing is. Those guys are going to get open again and again and again and again and again. All game long. The odd man rushes this road trip alone lol… I meeeaaaannnnn. Cmon. Would you like a stop on some. Sure. But cmon. Help your goalie out. Sogaard has let in like 40 goals in his like 4 starts (yes I knooooow the number isn’t 40) but he’s somehow also made multiple incredible point blank saves lol. Which isn’t me defending sogaard. It’s saying that even with the goals going in. There are other ghastly breakdowns that DONT end up in our net.

I I think I can count all comfortable defensive zone possessions on this road trip on one hand.

And “let’s go get a goalie that can bail us out every game” is not sustainable and likely not even possibly.

I don't get a chance to watch a lot of the games and I guess I am lucky in a sense as the majority of the few games I've seen featured very little in what you have described.

I never suggested that Sens need elite goaltending, I am of the belief they need goaltending that is dependable and consistent; keep things steady. This year its been anything but that, be it because of the injuries, bad luck or whatever else it might be, its been inconsistent and not dependable. Mix that with a young D group and the result will often resemble those of the last few games.

Maybe you have played organized hockey maybe you haven't. My guess is you have not because if you had you would know just how much impact goalies have on the players especially the dman. 50% of the game is mental and not knowing what version of the goalie will show up and knowing how bad it will be if the bad versions shows up, messes with the mind. Trying to hard to not screw up normally leads to screwing up even more, overthinking sets inn, followed by bone headed plays. The Sens d group is still relatively inexperienced as a whole so there will be growing pains... not solely blaming the goalies but far too often the d gets unfairly torched ...some of the goals that went inn the past few games have weeeeaaaakk...no matter how bad the d is an NHL goalie can't multiple games in a row with a SV% 0.850 and a GAA over 5...that simply a job not well done

As someone that does not get a chance to watch a lot of the games, I do look at stats of then, advanced stat more so these days. It pretty cool just how information is recorded and available to analyze. So I do use statistics as the basis of my opinions. I agree that watching the game on TV paints a different picture then the one recorder numbers on a piece of paper do; statistically the SENS are D group is not bad at all, but our goalies are....

 

[Ice-Tray]

Do you think there’s a difference between how much you lose and how you lose? I do? I expected this team to be right where it is. But with acceptable defence. We have not seen acceptable team defence.

There seems to be zero difference in here.

Let’s be honest, we lost most games in November by 1 goal, in games that we were in to the end, and look at the reactions in here. We had so many advanced stats in the top of the league, and yet lots of people gave up on the team.

These last losses have looked waaaaay worse, but the response in here is still the same.

 

[Silencio]

Someone on Twitter mentioned how much better our new players look as soon as they get here vs when they’re in DJs systems

Joseph. Chychrun.

Even debrincat at the start of the year was absolutely flying.

Giroux having his best season in years kind of ruins that theory.

 

[DrEasy]

Giroux having his best season in years kind of ruins that theory.

Giroux is immune to systems by now.