Confirmed with Link: Schmid and Holtz traded to VGK for Paul Cotter and 2025 3rd rounder

[ninetyeight]

Michael McLeod also only scored 0.5 PPG in the AHL, off the ice issues aside would you have preferred Holtz over McLeod? And if anything Cotter is on a more upward developmental trajectory going from 4th round pick in 2018 to NHL regular on a playoff team vs Holtz who was the 7th overall pick in 2020 still struggling to keep an NHL starting spot on a team that dealt with a ton of injuries and had little depth last year.

I mean McLeod was pretty bad before his breakout season and everyone here wanted him gone. What this guy is and what you hope he'll become are two different things. His defensive metrics suck, even Holtz has better one. McDermid is also physical, but is he good? Do we want our bottom6 full of physical guys who cant play? The reason this team was so fun in 23, was all the skill.

 

[Saint Beaurivage]

I am fine with the Cotter move but will admit our GM hasn't been a very sharp one, in a matter of fact he sucks. I think he is giving away the farm so he can stay here another year. These short-stick trades can create another 5 year cycle of bad teams.

 

[NJDevs26]

People are in love with the idea of what Holtz can be, not what he actually is

Well that and people talked themselves into believing management screwed him, just give him another chance with Keefe while ignoring the biggest non-believer in Holtz was still here (the GM).

You could say the same thing with Schmid too, plus the fact he'll be a cult hero forever makes it more of a gut punch he's gone barely a year later.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Yeah and he's been WAY worse this year, 7 goals in 70 something games. He's also been a 0.5ppg player in ahl his whole career while Holtz was ppg in his first full year. Holtz has gotten better each year, this guy is already declining. You are delusional if you think he's better. Holtz will score more next year than this guy in his whole (short) stint in the Devils.

Literally the only reason you’re anchored to the idea that Holtz has some special potential to unlock is that he was a high pick. If he was a 3rd round pick you wouldn’t give a whiff about this. And if Cotter was a former 1st, he’d be a future power forward.

 

[TrufleShufle]

I mean McLeod was pretty bad before his breakout season and everyone here wanted him gone. What this guy is and what you hope he'll become are two different things. His defensive metrics suck, even Holtz has better one. McDermid is also physical, but is he good? Do we want our bottom6 full of physical guys who cant play? The reason this team was so fun in 23, was all the skill.

Skill didn't go anywhere, what changed was all the speed. Injuries aside, we got much slower and less energetic.

 

[Nocashstyle]

They're probably ecstatic just after seeing the freakouts in this thread lol

I mean, I’m not freaking out, and I’m usually one of those laughing at the overreactions. I just personally don’t think it’s a good trade. That’s okay

 

[Bleedred]

At this point I wish the Sharks just took Holtz and left us Zetterlund.

But I'd imagine the reaction here at the time if we traded Holtz and a 1st round pick for Timo would have been approaching ''OMG! WE LOST ALEX URBOM! THE CAPITALS CLAIMED HIM! WUT TERRIBULL ASSETTE MANIJMINT!'' levels of biblical proportions.

 

[NJDevs26]

BTW if Holtz was 'the odd man out' in the bottom six and presumably Cotter wlll play then who else goes by the wayside for him, Bastian?

 

[Triumph]

I mean, I’m not freaking out, and I’m usually one of those laughing at the overreactions. I just personally don’t think it’s a good trade. That’s okay

I mean, it's not a good trade. It's not ever a trade that fans will ever like to trade two guys who've shown promise for a guy that nobody has heard of and a 3rd round pick in next year's draft. But I think it's fine. You cannot keep young players around forever.

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

BTW if Holtz was 'the odd man out' in the bottom six and presumably Cotter wlll play then who else goes by the wayside for him, Bastian?

Bastian moves in the Colton deal

 

[NJDevs26]

I do think we're kind of missing the fact that Cotter is just 24 himself, we're acting like Fitz just brought in another 32-year old with zero upside.

 

[Triumph]

BTW if Holtz was 'the odd man out' in the bottom six and presumably Cotter wlll play then who else goes by the wayside for him, Bastian?

Cotter is an LW and Holtz is an RW. So I think it's a positional change, as well.

 

[NjDevsRR]

URBOM

 

[ninetyeight]

Literally the only reason you’re anchored to the idea that Holtz has some special potential to unlock is that he was a high pick. If he was a 3rd round pick you wouldn’t give a whiff about this. And if Cotter was a former 1st, he’d be a future power forward.

Holtz is already better than this guy in every way except skating and physicality. Both his scoring and advanced stats are better. And you don't think potential and upside matters? There's a reason Holtz went top10 and this guy didn't. And if I'm stuck on potential, you are grass is always greener on the otherside. You love to have scapegoat on the team and love to hate our non-top players. Like all the other teams have elite bottom6s but we just have shit. There's is literally no one outside our board who thinks Devils won this trade or that Cotter is better than Holtz.

 

[MasterofGrond]

I do not love this, from an asset management point of view.

 

[BostonDevil]

Everyone in the league was trying to pry Cotter from Vegas. I think McKenzie had him #1 on his trade target list.

Stop trying to rationalize this guy into being something he isn't. It's a nothing player that anyone could have gotten off the street.

You can tell me how Holtz and Schmid were never going to play here, but I'll be shocked if Cotter isn't a much worse version of Miles Wood.

 

[Devils Trap]

Everyone in the league was trying to pry Cotter from Vegas. I think McKenzie had him #1 on his trade target list.

Stop trying to rationalize this guy into being something he isn't. It's a nothing player that anyone could have gotten off the street.

You can tell me how Holtz and Schmid were never going to play here, but I'll be shocked if Cotter isn't a much worse version of Miles Wood.

Cotter is not worse then Miles Wood, and even if he was Holtz and Schmid are worth NOTHING and we turned them into a good bottom 6er and a 3rd rounder

 

[SteveCangialosi123]

Holtz is already better than this guy in every way except skating and physicality. Both his scoring and advanced stats are better. And you don't think potential and upside matters? There's a reason Holtz went top10 and this guy didn't. And if I'm stuck on potential, you are grass is always greener on the otherside. You love to have scapegoat on the team and love to hate our non-top players. Like all the other teams have elite bottom6s but we just have shit. Theirs is literally no one outside our board who think Devils won this trade or that Cotter is better than Holtz.

I do not care about what others are saying about the trade and I don’t really care if we “win” in the end. Hope Holtz has a good career. It wasn’t happening here and probably isn’t happening period.

He’s better than Cotter in every way except skating and not being one of the league leaders in hits? Two attributes we wanted! I also doubt this guy could be worse away from the puck than Holtz in general. That’s tough to do.

I also don’t care much about “advanced stats” when we’re talking about a guy playing 10 minutes a game in Holtz. There’s a reason he wasn’t playing more.

 

[Lou Bloom]

I mean McLeod was pretty bad before his breakout season and everyone here wanted him gone. What this guy is and what you hope he'll become are two different things. His defensive metrics suck, even Holtz has better one. McDermid is also physical, but is he good? Do we want our bottom6 full of physical guys who cant play? The reason this team was so fun in 23, was all the skill.

People thought McLeod was bad because they blindly believed the same player cards you're basing your entire opinion of Cotter on, which goes to my point that just reading these analytics cards and basing you're entire opinion of a player on it is incredibly faulty.

The Devils are clearly making a bet that Cotter is more than just a physical guy that brings nothing else, they're betting on Cotter being a guy that can become a solid bottom 6 contributor. Whether that comes to fruition is to be determined but you could also say the same thing on betting on Holtz developing his game also.

And the Devils weren't just so fun to watch because they were all skilled. They were fun because they were also fast and tenacious on the puck which is something the 2024 team lacked and with Cotter they're making a bet on him becoming a player that can add those qualities.

 

[Captain3rdLine]

I do not love this, from an asset management point of view.

I mean that’s the point of view it makes the most since from.

Holtz’s value was just gonna decline.
Schmid was gonna be sitting in Utica having to compete with our other goalie prospects who might be favoured to him.

Get rid of them bring in a useful asset/player and a pick for next year or to be used in a trade.

 

[BostonDevil]

Cotter is not worse then Miles Wood, and even if he was Holtz and Schmid are worth NOTHING and we turned them into a good bottom 6er and a 3rd rounder

Hope you're right

 

[pkbrux]

I am fine with the Cotter move but will admit our GM hasn't been a very sharp one, in a matter of fact he sucks. I think he is giving away the farm so he can stay here another year. These short-stick trades can create another 5 year cycle of bad teams.

Given away the farm? Who has he traded away that constitutes "giving away the farm" in this offseason? Kevin Bahl, Alex Holtz, John Marino, Akira Schmid and a 11-32 first round pick? Man, if that was our farm, we were going to be hungry regardless if we gave it away or not.

 

[Forge]

Interesting that ESPN actually gave us the better grade in this trade lol (obviously, the means nothing...espn once gave the 49ers a C- grade for trading for Christian McCaffrey, but interesting nonetheless)

 

[jkrdevil]

I do not love this, from an asset management point of view.

The mistake from an asset point of view was draft Holtz #7 to begin with. His value hit empty more than a year ago (even SJ didn’t want him in the Timo deal). It wasn’t going to get better. Once it got to that point he was a sunk cost.

 

[Jets012]

Don't even hate this. But I think Holtz sucks.

The league clearly agrees though