Value of: Scandella or Brodin to Toronto

[scan15*]

I love how everyone trashing on Brodin is completely ignoring this post.

Uhh, it's nonsensical and full of cherry picked stats.

 

[roon]

Uh, I wouldn't be using that post to prove a point. Trust me.

Brodin's a good player.

Why wouldn't you be using that post?

Would you prefer to just post a Hero chart and call it a day?

 

[roon]

Uhh, it's nonsensical and full of cherry picked stats.

Everyone in here that has trashed Brodin has cherry picked stats.

The irony is hilarious.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

The thing with Brodin is that his seemingly poor advanced stats can be explained, but the explanations sound like excuses when they're not, they're valid reasons when you consider age, situations, prior development, etc...

But I also fully admit that if I didn't know much about him, and just looked him up on hockey analysis sites, I'd be fairly unimpressed.

 

[GuerinUp]

Nylander has played 22 games in the NHL. Not quite sure how you can make a blanket statement on a transition with not even 1 full season in the pros.

Also,

If you think im just trolling, id like for you to take a look at a former #1 overall that showed great transition his first 48 games. Nail Yakupov.

Im not stating Nylander is Yak, im stating you dont know what you have until you see multiple seasons from a player at the pro level.

 

[Sarge58]

Brodin has one thing you can't teach and that's having an extremely high hockey IQ. Physically I think he's going to be a late bloomer, I don't think he's even started shaving yet

 

[nickschultzfan]

Everyone in here that has trashed Brodin has cherry picked stats.

The irony is hilarious.

Yes, I like how Brodin's first three seasons in the league where he played top minutes are to be disregarded, but last season, when he had a significant injury and switched partners every 3 games because the Wild were one just dumpster fire, should be the measuring stick for Brodin as an NHL player.

 

[Brock Radunske]

Nylander has played 22 games in the NHL. Not quite sure how you can make a blanket statement on a transition with not even 1 full season in the pros.

I meant to the North American style rinks/game as we're comparing two players who did well in Euro leagues before coming over.

 

[Alberta_OReilly_Fan]

yet you just traded Hall for Larsson. Young, top 4 D with sane contracts have value. And Marner is a far cry from Hall.

obviously all it takes is 2 gm to make a deal... the rest of us dont get a say in it.

personally if my bruins had marner and were offered brodin... id work out the details and make it happen.

but if toronto fans would rather keep marner... thats their choice.

im reminded of buffalo sitting on noronen and biron for years... miller waiting in the wings... the fans turning down every offer

and the team turning them down too...

eventually miller became a good goalie but buffalo got nothing for the other 2.

we see this time and again... a team stockpiles one position and is unwilling to deal for what they need. 1 dimensional teams almost always suck. maybe minny needs to deal a dman? and maybe toronto needs to deal a kid forward?

 

[Cotton]

obviously all it takes is 2 gm to make a deal... the rest of us dont get a say in it.

personally if my bruins had marner and were offered brodin... id work out the details and make it happen.

but if toronto fans would rather keep marner... thats their choice.

im reminded of buffalo sitting on noronen and biron for years... miller waiting in the wings... the fans turning down every offer

and the team turning them down too...

eventually miller became a good goalie but buffalo got nothing for the other 2.

we see this time and again... a team stockpiles one position and is unwilling to deal for what they need. 1 dimensional teams almost always suck. maybe minny needs to deal a dman? and maybe toronto needs to deal a kid forward?

I'd be willing to part with Marner for the right deal, but Brodin just doesn't land you a prospect like Marner. Min and Tor don't make good trade partners.

 

[rynryn]

Not so bold prediction: TOR fans are going to be really, really disappointed with the return when it's finally time to admit they have to trade an "untouchable".

Wild fans, meanwhile, are already resigned to losing one of our top 4 D for nothing. Best prepare yourselves in advance.

 

[scan15*]

Everyone in here that has trashed Brodin has cherry picked stats.

The irony is hilarious.

I'm not trashing Brodin. I just don't think that you should give too much credence to oilerbear's posts either.

If you say that Brodin's a good defenseman, then I'll believe you. After all, you're the only people who actually bothered to watch Mike Yeo's snoozefests.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

I had the over/under for the first "boring" post at 35 1/2 posts. I was way off.

 

[NotYou]

Not so bold prediction: TOR fans are going to be really, really disappointed with the return when it's finally time to admit they have to trade an "untouchable".

Wild fans, meanwhile, are already resigned to losing one of our top 4 D for nothing. Best prepare yourselves in advance.

It's fairly likely that they actually won't have to. Unlike edm they have a high potential dman who has been playing well in the nhl. If Riley becomes a suitable #1 they can use other chips to get whatever complimentary dmen they need.

I can't believe wild fans aren't envious of Toronto's position. Tbh it's probably just a coping mechanism for a few of you. I'd trade our whole system for theirs in a nanosecond.

 

[Dr Jan Itor]

It's fairly likely that they actually won't have to. Unlike edm they have a high potential dman who has been playing well in the nhl. If Riley becomes a suitable #1 they can use other chips to get whatever complimentary dmen they need.

I can't believe wild fans aren't envious of Toronto's position. Tbh it's probably just a coping mechanism for a few of you. I'd trade our whole system for theirs in a nanosecond.

I'm envious of their top 3 prospects; I'm not envious of what they've had to put up with to attain them.

 

[rynryn]

It's fairly likely that they actually won't have to. Unlike edm they have a high potential dman who has been playing well in the nhl. If Riley becomes a suitable #1 they can use other chips to get whatever complimentary dmen they need.

I can't believe wild fans aren't envious of Toronto's position. Tbh it's probably just a coping mechanism for a few of you. I'd trade our whole system for theirs in a nanosecond.

What is this coping mechanism you speak of?

I'm also envious of the Oiler's position, having McDavid. Doesn't mean i would advocate emulating how they got there or offer to help them get to the next level with a disadvantageous trade. I'd love to see them appreciably boost their defense with these "other chips" you speak of when their firsts in the next couple drafts are apparently off the table as well. If you're talking about JVR, sure, but then they're really depending on all of their blue chip forwards knocking out crazy good seasons from the start. Good luck to you.

 

[gwh]

Uhh, it's nonsensical and full of cherry picked stats.

Highdanger scoring chance against on 5v5, normalized for zone starts is the best blueliner stat available.

You know, limit the other guys from scoring? Kind of what D man should be doing?

 

[NotYou]

I'm envious of their top 3 prospects; I'm not envious of what they've had to put up with to attain them.

Me either. That's why I put it that way . Still it would've been worth it though. Average does nothing for me

What is this coping mechanism you speak of?

I'm also envious of the Oiler's position, having McDavid. Doesn't mean i would advocate emulating how they got there or offer to help them get to the next level with a disadvantageous trade. I'd love to see them appreciably boost their defense with these "other chips" you speak of when their firsts in the next couple drafts are apparently off the table as well. If you're talking about JVR, sure, but then they're really depending on all of their blue chip forwards knocking out crazy good seasons from the start. Good luck to you.

Dealing with a team that looked poised to be a contender apparently falling to do so.

Toronto has at least a year to go before making any big moves imo. They'll have another high pick that could be dangled. If Riley pans out they'll be able to get a suitable dman in free agency. I'd totally advocate for how Toronto got out of their perpetual mediocrity. And yeah I realize they're less than mediocre now. Not edm but that's been beaten to death

 

[Halla]

Not so bold prediction: TOR fans are going to be really, really disappointed with the return when it's finally time to admit they have to trade an "untouchable".

Wild fans, meanwhile, are already resigned to losing one of our top 4 D for nothing. Best prepare yourselves in advance.

lol Nope. we have a solid top 3 in Rielly, Gardiner and Zaitsev already.
Edmonton had klefbom and...sekera?

our top 10 pick will be used to take an elite D prospect this year.
Matthews, Nylander and Marner will be kept, and not moved for a 2nd pairing dman

 

[gwh]

I'm envious of their top 3 prospects; I'm not envious of what they've had to put up with to attain them.

I am not even 100% sold on Marner. Also only 2D in the roster.

Looks like 2012 Oilers. Couple high end young forwards, but still in the basement until they about 3 top end defenders.

 

[rynryn]

Me either. That's why I put it that way . Still it would've been worth it though. Average does nothing for me

Dealing with a team that looked poised to be a contender apparently falling to do so.

Toronto has at least a year to go before making any big moves imo. They'll have another high pick that could be dangled. If Riley pans out they'll be able to get a suitable dman in free agency. I'd totally advocate for how Toronto got out of their perpetual mediocrity. And yeah I realize they're less than mediocre now. Not edm but that's been beaten to death

You'd advocate for it, but then again I doubt very much you'd find fans here as willing to pump money into the machine while it was busted, waiting for parts for years as they have in TOR.


edit: i was going to address coping mechanisms again but that's OT.

 

[rynryn]

lol Nope. we have a solid top 3 in Rielly, Gardiner and Zaitsev already.
Edmonton had klefbom and...sekera?

our top 10 pick will be used to take an elite D prospect this year.
Matthews, Nylander and Marner will be kept, and not moved for a 2nd pairing dman

i kind of see some of the problem now. top 10 pick does not = elite player.

 

[Halla]

I am not even 100% sold on Marner. Also only 2D in the roster.

Looks like 2012 Oilers. Couple high end young forwards, but still in the basement until they about 3 top end defenders.

Matthews,Nylander,Marner,JVR,Kadri > the 2012 oilers forward core by a lot

the oilers D didnt have anyone close to the talent of rielly,gardiner or probably even zaitsev.

they also Khabibulin in net

I like where the leafs are. better than being a mediocre team with no chance to compete with the big boys until they shed a lot of salary and infuse young talent onto a vet heavy roster

 

[Halla]

i kind of see some of the problem now. top 10 pick does not = elite player.

i see the problem here. you think elite prospect = elite player.
nope. I meant prospect, a guy that will be a likely top 4 with a shot at being a top 2.

usually those guys picked in the 5-10 range end up somewhere around there right? Rielly,Lindholm,Trouba and Dumba are decent examples, and thats 1 draft

 

[rynryn]

what's the timeline here...I guess that's important in figuring out why you even feel it necessary to get a top 4 defenseman when you'll have the next one next year.