Proposal: Sam Bennett (CGY) for David Pastrnak (BOS)

[McFlyingV]

I agree about Pasta. But it's Boston... and that's a hell of a lot more then they got for Dougie/Seguin.

And Adam Fox has shown his skill level is too high to not be a great player in the modern game. He's the best prospect no one talks about.

Oh ok, so because of those 2 trades they're just going to hand the Flames another steal of a deal on their best young player?

If I wanted to hear about delusional dream trades and gushing over Adam Fox I'd head over to HF Flames or CP. The values not there for Boston plain and simple. If you can't see that then take a step back and try to look at it with a little bit of logic rather than your clearly clouded homer view.

 

[tony d]

Calgary definitely adds. Oliver Kylington and one of their defenseman plus Sam Bennett for Pastrnak. A Gaudreau Monahan Pastrnak 1st line though would be all kinds of good.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

I wouldn't deal Fox at all. He's a top 5 D prospect in my mind. That's exactly why I said I wouldn't want to deal Bennett for Pasta, the adds wouldn't be worth it. Bennett is going to be break out and be a damn good player in the mould of a Kadri/Kesler.

 

[qwerty]

and also well behind guys like Nylander and Ehlers who were chose right after him.

gotta tell both sides of the story

Well of course naturally there's always going to be players that jump ahead of higher picks. You think RNH is anywhere close to Mark Scheifele? The point I'm making is that he's still a full time NHLer who just had a sophomore slump season.

People need to relax. The day he becomes a Griffin Reinhart, or a Nikita Filatov, or a Scott Glennie, or a Zach Hamill, then you people can jump all over him. But at this moment, he's no bust. He's a full time NHLer with upside and plenty of time to grow and improve his game.

 

[madmike77]

Talent-wise this deal is obviously bad for Boston.

I'm also not sure it would work for the Flames. Pastrnak wants to be paid and longer-term the Flames are going to have a bunch of other guys who will want the same thing. Backlund next year. Tkachuk in the near future. Plus leaving room for Monahan and Gaudreau after their existing deals.

These days it's almost better to hold onto prospects and hope you can get a couple of years of cheap production, rather than trade for a big contract.

 

[jimslob]

That's not how you determine the slide of a player and you know it. You watched Paajarvi and Yakupov languish in a totally different way than the path Bennett is going down. As stupid as MacT's quote is about being "visually better", it actually has a facet of truth.

Those that watch Bennett has noted he has been improving at certain facets of his game. He however has struggled at 3C.

Paajarvi and Yakupov scored the points you noted on the wing without the same level of responsibility as Bennett. It's not a similar path. They regressed continuing to play wing. Bennett struggled playing C at the NHL for the first time in his NHL career. If Bennett fails at C, he can still carve out a decent career at wing. Bennett has shown improvement in many defensive aspects of the game. Management has praised him, the coach has praised him.

If you think Bennett will bust. Cool, we can differ in opinion. But note that your lazy reasoning is lazy.

And in case you're blind, no Flames fans are defending the proposal by OP. They however are defending Bennett in regards to the lazy reasoning made by a few posters that Bennett is a bust. There are reasons to be down on Bennett and reasons not to want him. Those are fine. The methodology you've employed though... lazy.

The Lazy hazy days of summer.

 

[lucaseider]

1. Larkin has shown more than Bennett for sure.

2. I would easily trade Larkin + Rasmussen + whoever you think our 2nd best is for Pastrnak.

Not interested in looking at the numbers, but the number of players who have put 30+ G and 70 pts (in only 75 games) at the age of 20 is VERY low.

Larkin has got a few more points with a ton more ice time with actual decent players, just look at the usage with pp and pk time. I have seen enough of bennett to swap him for larkin 1 for 1. As for your second point, I would swap anderson or valimaki for rasmussen easily, our prospect pool is garbage, the flames have 4-5 guys better than our best.

Larkin has not shown better, he just gets first and second line minutes and lots of pp time, things bennett doesnt.

 

[lucaseider]

This is what every fan think about their team's B prospects. Usually isn't reality.

Oh hey look, a leaf fan talking about something he is clueless about, how strange, B prospect lol

 

[CraigsList]

I wouldn't deal Fox at all. He's a top 5 D prospect in my mind. That's exactly why I said I wouldn't want to deal Bennett for Pasta, the adds wouldn't be worth it. Bennett is going to be break out and be a damn good player in the mould of a Kadri/Kesler.

For pasta I'd deal Fox. We'd be trading for an upgrade on our 1st line.

 

[Tkachuk Norris]

Oh ok, so because of those 2 trades they're just going to hand the Flames another steal of a deal on their best young player?

If I wanted to hear about delusional dream trades and gushing over Adam Fox I'd head over to HF Flames or CP. The values not there for Boston plain and simple. If you can't see that then take a step back and try to look at it with a little bit of logic rather than your clearly clouded homer view.

A) never said the value was there. Just said that's what I would offer. What was your fan base expecting for Nuge, Eberle and Hall? I forgot

B) you don't want to hear about people gushing about Adam Fox then don't come to a Flames thread.. or get used to it because he's really good.

 

[Johnny Hoxville]

For pasta I'd deal Fox. We'd be trading for an upgrade on our 1st line.

I honestly wouldn't. I feel strongly that Fox at worst, becomes a Ghost level of Dman. I actually think he's going to be better. Let's assume that Bennett becomes a 50pts, gritty good 2-way C (I think he's going to be in the 65pt range), it would really hurt to give up a guy like Fox. And I think Pasta is an 80pt sniper, basically the next Taresenko.

With our cap issues we will both Fox and Valimaki to play in our top 4 and displace one each of: Gio or Brodie & Hamonic or Stone.

 

[JetsHomer]

Pasternak/Gaudreau are probably closer value than Bennett+Fox or whatever other garbage has been suggested in this thread

 

[JetsHomer]

Bennett is closer that Pastnak than Yamamoto to Bennett.

I have not comment on the second part as those are overhyped prospects from respective team.

You can't be serious with this post....

I don't know how many times it needs to be emphasized that Pastrnak had 8 more goals than Bennett has total points

Bennett is a throw in on a Pastrnak deal. It would take another piece that is more valuable than Bennett at minimum.

 

[PatriceBergeronFan]

Adam Fox isn't a prospect you downgrade from an elite winger to acquire.

 

[East Coast Icestyle]

Adam Fox isn't a prospect you downgrade from an elite winger to acquire.

He's not really one you trade, either. I'm not saying he's worth pasta, but he's worth more to us than any other team. He truly is a fantastic young player, and the reluctance of flames fans to downplay him are because we are really excited to see what he can be.

To be quite honest, I think trading for pasta would help very much, but there's no middle ground between what we would offer and having the bruins gut us. He's too important to the bruins, and they don't have chia as a GM anymore.

 

[Figgy44]

The Lazy hazy days of summer.

Actually, my response was lazy as well. I didn't agree with loosely using point total patterns to claim similarity towards regression and bust, but the response I had was pure drivel.

Bleh, definitely disappointed in that last post I sent though. Lazy reply from me.


I really don't see how the two organizations would hash out a deal though. I'd assume the only way to keep Boston interested value wise is Ferland + Bennett ++ but that doesn't make sense from both orgs point of view. It really doesn't make sense.

1. Why would Boston want to go from Quality to Quantity?
2. The Flames have traded a lot of futures away for their blue line recently. They need those pieces more than they need Pasta. They especially need those pieces to be able to have a shot at the goalie market this coming year or the next year. Using assets to shore up G is more important than upgrading the 1RW. Management also loves the smaller pieces being moved, which means the conversation probably doesn't even start.

 

[belair]

Bennett is closer that Pastnak than Yamamoto to Bennett.

I have not comment on the second part as those are overhyped prospects from respective team.

No, no he's not.

 

[Flamesjustwin]

You can't be serious with this post....

I don't know how many times it needs to be emphasized that Pastrnak had 8 more goals than Bennett has total points

Bennett is a throw in on a Pastrnak deal. It would take another piece that is more valuable than Bennett at minimum.

Ok, so would you have said the same thing about Scheifele a few years ago before he broke out? If you say he wouldn't be a throw in like Bennett than you are being pretty hypocritical.

 

[JetsHomer]

Ok, so would you have said the same thing about Scheifele a few years ago before he broke out? If you say he wouldn't be a throw in like Bennett than you are being pretty hypocritical.

Scheifele had 8 more points in 18 less games than Bennett at the same age, but whatever. He would have been seen as a throw in for a deal for Seguin or Tarasenko who were young and putting up similar PPG paces as Pastrnak this season.

 

[McFlyingV]

Scheifele had 8 more points in 18 less games than Bennett at the same age, but whatever. He would have been seen as a throw in for a deal for Seguin or Tarasenko who were young and putting up similar PPG paces as Pastrnak this season.

Not to mention very few players see the progression Schiefele did. Sure it could happen just like it could happen to any young player, but until it does the odds of it happening are much much lower than the odds of it happening. If I were a betting man, I sure as hell wouldn't be betting on Bennett to make a Schiefele like progression.

 

[madmike77]

I can't see how Calgary could afford Pastrnak without depleting another part of the team. He's clearly a better player than Bennett, but I don't think the cap hit would work for the Flames anyway. His potential salary is a problem in Boston and it would be an issue in Calgary as well. The guy's looking for more than $6 million a year, which would make him among the highest-paid Flames.

I think it's better to keep the cheaper asset and hope for the best.

 

[Connor]

I honestly wouldn't. I feel strongly that Fox at worst, becomes a Ghost level of Dman. I actually think he's going to be better. Let's assume that Bennett becomes a 50pts, gritty good 2-way C (I think he's going to be in the 65pt range), it would really hurt to give up a guy like Fox. And I think Pasta is an 80pt sniper, basically the next Taresenko.

With our cap issues we will both Fox and Valimaki to play in our top 4 and displace one each of: Gio or Brodie & Hamonic or Stone.

IMO Bennett becoming what you outlined is unlikely.

Bennett is already going into his fourth NHL season and he is SO far from becoming that he would have to develop leaps and bounds. Most players reach their prime at 23 and stay there for a few years before declining. Bennett would need two massive leaps in development this year and next if he is compared to the standard development curve.

 

[East Coast Icestyle]

IMO Bennett becoming what you outlined is unlikely.

Bennett is already going into his fourth NHL season and he is SO far from becoming that he would have to develop leaps and bounds. Most players reach their prime at 23 and stay there for a few years before declining. Bennett would need two massive leaps in development this year and next if he is compared to the standard development curve.

First, it will be his third year.

Second, he is 21.

I might not love him like most, but 50 points isn't unrealistic. He has plenty of tools. He's also becoming pretty good defensively. If he doesn't reach that as a centre, he can be a pretty good physical scoring winger.

And for what it's worth, superstars reach their peak that early, not necessarily all good players. Look at Kadri, Little, Backlund, the list goes on. All much better players now than at 23.

Two massive development leaps wouldn't put Bennett at a 50 point 2C, which is what I think most flames fans project him as now. Two leaps would put him in good 1C/1W territory. You try being some offensive dynamo in your first year as a centre, between Versteeg and Brouwer.

 

[McFlyingV]

IMO Bennett becoming what you outlined is unlikely.

Bennett is already going into his fourth NHL season and he is SO far from becoming that he would have to develop leaps and bounds. Most players reach their prime at 23 and stay there for a few years before declining. Bennett would need two massive leaps in development this year and next if he is compared to the standard development curve.

I agree he's going to need some huge leaps in his development to become that, but its really only his 3rd NHL season (to clarify, I assume you're referring to the 65 points part of his post, I personally don't see 50 as being out of the question). Kind of unfair to count his injury shortened season where he only played ~10 NHL playoff games as an NHL season.

 

[DFF]

You can't be serious with this post....

I don't know how many times it needs to be emphasized that Pastrnak had 8 more goals than Bennett has total points

Bennett is a throw in on a Pastrnak deal. It would take another piece that is more valuable than Bennett at minimum.

Reading problem? Where did I say Bennett is equal to Pastrnak at this point?