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Saginaw Spirit 2022-23 Off-Season Thread

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donjohnson said:
I'd argue that we already did better than that in the Bloom trade:

While Hislop is probably a little better skill-wise...Gauvreau brings a toughness and they're both 03's so I call that a wash.

So, you're trading Bloom for a good '05 in Sima, (2) seconds and (3) thirds.

Mintuykov gets you an 05, (3) seconds and (2 or 3) thirds...it's a lot to ask but he is the best defenseman in the league and for those who haven't seen his offense, he's probably better than most team's forwards too.
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Yeah that return sounds about right at the high end. Almost want Clarke returned after WJC so Barrie goes all in. Them and Ottawa seem like the likely destination when you look what we expect back for him.
 
donjohnson said:
Mintuykov gets you an 05, (3) seconds and (2 or 3) thirds...it's a lot to ask but he is the best defenseman in the league and for those who haven't seen his offense, he's probably better than most team's forwards too.
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How about a two part trade with the Rangers:

Mintyukov to the Rangers for 04 import D Hamara (3rd round to Senators) and picks. Then in the off season, 04 D Brzustewicz (slated to go high in this year’s NHL draft) to Saginaw for those picks back.
 
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EvenSteven said:
How about a two part trade with the Rangers:

Mintyukov to the Rangers for 04 import D Hamara (3rd round to Senators) and picks. Then in the off season, 04 D Brzustewicz (slated to go high in this year’s NHL draft) to Saginaw for those picks back.
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If Kitchener wants to do that, absolutely.
 
Kingpin794 said:
If Kitchener wants to do that, absolutely.
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I’d propose a low amount of picks going to Saginaw in order to allow the Rangers to add a top scorer. But that won’t matter if the deal is ultimately Mintyukov for Hamara and Brzustewicz.

In getting two top four D for your run next year, we may even be looking at a pick or two extra coming to the Rangers, to even out the deal, once the dust settles.

To Rangers:
Mintyukov. 2nd. 3rd.

To Saginaw:
Hamara.
Brzustewicz.

Brzustewicz alone would be worth today’s Kyrou return next deadline.
 
EvenSteven said:
How about a two part trade with the Rangers:

Mintyukov to the Rangers for 04 import D Hamara (3rd round to Senators) and picks. Then in the off season, 04 D Brzustewicz (slated to go high in this year’s NHL draft) to Saginaw for those picks back.
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I think the Kyrou trade set the market for Mintyukov.
 
OMG67 said:
I think the Kyrou trade set the market for Mintyukov.
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Mintyukov is better than Kyrou and I dont think its overly close. Id throw out there Mintyukov might be the best overall player in the league. Obviously 2nd to Wright if hes sent back. Being an import limits his value some for sure but hes worth at least 2 more high picks. I still contend hes worth every bit of an 06.
 
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bcspragu said:
Mintyukov is better than Kyrou and I dont think its overly close. Id throw out there Mintyukov might be the best overall player in the league. Obviously 2nd to Wright if hes sent back. Being an import limits his value some for sure but hes worth at least 2 more high picks. I still contend hes worth every bit of an 06.
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I don’t think the statistics show that at this point. The fact he is an Import restricts the market value somewhat because many teams need to delete one of their existing Imports to make room. That needs to be factored in as well, which you have eluded to.

I think if you look at Xhekaj last year, that is a decent comparable as well OA vs Import. Both the Kyrou and Xhekaj are relatively similar in total value or at least in the same ballpark.

Although it is possible for an ‘06 to be included, I think there would need to be a significant bidding war for that to happen and it is unlikely at this point that happens.

I do think Saginaw is int he drivers seat with respect to shaping the return. If they want a decent ‘04 and less picks then I think they can drive that return if they so choose to. But, at this point, I don’t see two additional high picks (2nds and 3rds) being added for Mintyukov. Maybe a better body that fits their needs better next season but not additional picks.
 
OMG67 said:
I don’t think the statistics show that at this point. The fact he is an Import restricts the market value somewhat because many teams need to delete one of their existing Imports to make room. That needs to be factored in as well, which you have eluded to.

I think if you look at Xhekaj last year, that is a decent comparable as well OA vs Import. Both the Kyrou and Xhekaj are relatively similar in total value or at least in the same ballpark.

Although it is possible for an ‘06 to be included, I think there would need to be a significant bidding war for that to happen and it is unlikely at this point that happens.

I do think Saginaw is int he drivers seat with respect to shaping the return. If they want a decent ‘04 and less picks then I think they can drive that return if they so choose to. But, at this point, I don’t see two additional high picks (2nds and 3rds) being added for Mintyukov. Maybe a better body that fits their needs better next season but not additional picks.
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I'm not posting an essay here but yes, the stats do say so and it's not particularly close. Mintyukov is far and away more defensively responsible than Kyrou.
 
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Kingpin794 said:
I'm not posting an essay here but yes, the stats do say so and it's not particularly close. Mintyukov is far and away more defensively responsible than Kyrou.
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I’m not arguing that Mintyukov is the better player. I’m saying they isn’t a huge gap between them enough to satisfy the difference in picks suggested. Adding two high picks is like saying he is 50% better. I disagree he is that much better. Then factor in he is an Import and most teams would need to clear a spot for him. Imports and OA’s typically are lower valued for that reason. Limited spots leading to marginal upgrades on many of the top teams. A 19 year old like Kyrou simply bumps the #6 D-Man off the list with no other true considerations. Easier to accommodate.

Of course, a team like Ottawa has an open Import roster spot so it is much easier for them. But a team like Peterborough would have to drop an Import and a team like North Bay would be unlikely to even consider an upgrade because of their current Import situation. So, because of that it limits the number of teams in the hunt. Limit the number of teams, you limit the likelihood of a more exceptional return.

It is not necessarily a reflection on the player but the market. The Xhekaj and Kyrou trades are a solid market value indication based on what I am suggesting. It would also depend on what draft the picks are in etc.
 
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OMG67 said:
I’m not arguing that Mintyukov is the better player. I’m saying they isn’t a huge gap between them enough to satisfy the difference in picks suggested. Adding two high picks is like saying he is 50% better. I disagree he is that much better.
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Yes. The gap is that large. Doesn’t mean that’s what GM’s give but in a vacuum, he is worth a couple picks more or an 06 instead of an 05.

(That is not what we get though)
 
Kingpin794 said:
Yes. The gap is that large. Doesn’t mean that’s what GM’s give but in a vacuum, he is worth a couple picks more or an 06 instead of an 05.

(That is not what we get though)
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He’s kinda worth what you get …. That is how worth is actually determined. Not to belabour the point.
 
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OMG67 said:
He’s kinda worth what you get …. That is how worth is actually determined. Not to belabour the point.
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That’s not how worth is determined unless you’re being really really reductionist about it. GM’s know what players are worth before hand. They have to be pragmatic about things.
 
OMG67 said:
He’s kinda worth what you get …. That is how worth is actually determined. Not to belabour the point.
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Agree. Though you have said yourself being an import caps trade value a bit.

Kyrou and Thompson might be a better comparable. Xhekaj like Mintyukov this season, was by far the best D available.
Imports & OAs generally do not return 16 yr old first round picks.
 
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Kingpin794 said:
I'm not posting an essay here but yes, the stats do say so and it's not particularly close. Mintyukov is far and away more defensively responsible than Kyrou.
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i believe saginaw is telling teams the kryou return is what they are looking for. the import status takes away aspects of his value, they will get close to what kyrou got
 
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I have asked this before (maybe here or maybe on the Spirit board) and I don't know if I got an answer. If the Spirit were to trade Mintuykov would they be able to sign one of their 2 import picks from this year's draft? I think both were quite good players and it would be a nice added piece to the trade to keep our team at a higher level.
 
From your fan base what is the approximate cost for Mintyukov? Just would like to hear what the minimum you’d be happy to receive back for what appears to be the best D in the league and likely a full time NHLer in the next 2 years
 
donjohnson said:
I have asked this before (maybe here or maybe on the Spirit board) and I don't know if I got an answer. If the Spirit were to trade Mintuykov would they be able to sign one of their 2 import picks from this year's draft? I think both were quite good players and it would be a nice added piece to the trade to keep our team at a higher level.
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Yes we could and I’d hope that DD is working on getting Misiak over here after the WJC.

OHL4Life said:
i believe saginaw is telling teams the kryou return is what they are looking for. the import status takes away aspects of his value, they will get close to what kyrou got
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And that’s a fair/realistic asking price.
 
Kingpin794 said:
Yes we could and I’d hope that DD is working on getting Misiak over here after the WJC.


And that’s a fair/realistic asking price.
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misiak was waived once both imports reported to saginaw. they only can keep a player on a reserve listt if hes signed to an nhl contract or a 1st round pick that did not report
 
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