Speculation: Sabres Talk - Proposals, Speculation, Roster-shaping

[ryanbiggame*]

Douglas Murray
2nd Round Pick

for:

Drew Stafford

Hell yeah. He was awesome at Cornell. Had some up & downs in Cleveland but other then that SOLID defense play, great transitioning skills.

 

[Sabretip]

The solution to the Buffalo Sabres' biggest weakness is out there. Right now. He's available. At this moment. Right now!

His name is Ryan O'Reilly and he's a match made in Hockey Heaven for the Sabres' Coach For Life Lindy Ruff.

O'Reilly is a 6-foot, 200-pound, 22-year-old, two-way center who scored 55 points for the Colorado Avalanche last season.

While Hodgson and Ennis are young and have created goals on the offensive end, it's clear the Sabres are in need of a center who can play against the toughest assignments and still create and score. Unless they want to let 19 and 63 work it out and continue to give up goals at an alarming rate, that is.

Enter: Ryan O'Reilly.

He may be around the same age as Hodgson and Ennis, but his skill set is a much better fit for the Sabres' coach. O'Reilly is built in the mold of a Michael Peca or Chris Drury – he can play in all situations including offensive, defensive, power play, penalty kill and take on the league's best competition each night.

Last season, at age 21, he faced the second best competition on the Avalanche only trailing Gabriel Landeskog and performed exceptionally. When he was on the ice, his team was +11.98 shots per 60 minutes, when he was off the ice -0.46.

Keeping shots away from the net has been the Sabres' biggest struggle. They ranked 30th in the league in shots against per game with 33.9 – a rate they can not keep up if they plan to climb the Eastern Conference ranks. When O'Reilly was on the ice last season, the Avs allowed 25.3 shots per 60 minutes.

Did I mention O'Reilly's only 22?

The drawback, undoubtedly, is the price and his contract. However, the Sabres have defensive prospects such as Brayden McNabb and Mark Pysyk who could be moved as well as either Hodgson or Ennis and draft picks. The reported price is an NHL player and a highly-rated prospect. Done. As for his asking price of $5 million. Do it.

How important is it to have a two-way center in the NHL? The last five Cup winning centers are Anze Kopitar, Patrice Bergeron, Jonathan Toews, Sidney Crosby and Pavel Datsyuk.

http://www.wgr550.com/Advanced-Stats-Say-O-Reilly-Is-A-Match-Made-in-Hoc/15527098

Lots of statistical backup to a common sense argument IMO - and getting a gritty, tougher center in the model of a Peca/Drury that also embodies some strong leadership that is only 22 seems like a can't miss proposition.....if Regier is willing to accept the fact his roster is sorely lacking such a player. He may love the duo of Hodgson/Ennis as his future but, as many have accurately said, they're similar players...and Grigorenko/Girgensons are in the system as well.

It would be great if the Sabres could add a steady defenseman but getting a player like O'Reilly that brings a strong defensive, two-way game would be a coup. Granted, Collier's assertion that O'Reilly is a # 1 center or worth comparing to the likes of Crosby, Datsyuk or Toews is a stretch but O'Reilly would be a solid # 2 behind Hodgson.

If it's a roster player + prospect, I wouldn't pause one second to forefeit Ennis - heck, other than the top line and Grigorenko, the Avs can have any forward off the roster they want.

If the prospect had to be someone like McNabb or Pysyk, then the roster player would have to be the likes of Stafford or Gerbe.

 

[dire wolf]

Hell yeah. He was awesome at Cornell. Had some up & downs in Cleveland but other then that SOLID defense play, great transitioning skills.

Yeah, he was great at Cornell, but that was 10 years ago and ECAC hockey. At this point, I think the Regehr analogy is pretty good. Both guys were much more desirable 3 years ago. Murray hits hard as hell but is otherwise nothing special. If we are going to trade for a defensemen, we need to aim higher.

EDIT: BTW, not a bad trade proposal, I just don't think it gives us what we need.

 

[SECRET SQUIRREL]

Great plan, lets re-name Buffalo.... South Toronto...that way of thinking has worked so well for them over and over again......

Toronto is the black hole of suck the past decade and even they are better then us these days. Also, being aggressive worked out quite well for San Jose when they stole Thornton... Or Pittsburgh with Neal. Most trades are won by the team that gets the best player. O'Reilly is easily that. It baffles me that a large portion of fans haven't the slightest clue on what actually constitutes a good hockey player and how to build a contender...

 

[Sabretip]

Done in a heartbeat.

Murray is EXACTLY what our defense needs.Great proposal, too bad Darcy would never make a deal like this.

So you think adding another defenseman to act as a pylon for opposing forwards to skate around is the Sabres' top need? Murray's reputation for being tough is about as justified as the widely-acknowledged fact that his mobility and skating is below average by NHL standards.

As useless as Stafford is, dumping him to pick up Murray doesn't improve the team IMO.

 

[ryanbiggame*]

Yeah, he was great at Cornell, but that was 10 years ago and ECAC hockey. At this point, I think the Regehr analogy is pretty good. Both guys were much more desirable 3 years ago. Murray hits hard as hell but is otherwise nothing special. If we are going to trade for a defensemen, we need to aim higher.

EDIT: BTW, not a bad trade proposal, I just don't think it gives us what we *need.

*new coach, #1 DMAN, a non-rookie center?

TBH, I think Murray's better then Regehr. But I agree, we need to aim higher for a top D man like you said. Ha, pipe dreams man... Darcy's not doing anything this year.

 

[Jim Bob]

If the prospect had to be someone like McNabb or Pysyk, then the roster player would have to be the likes of Stafford or Gerbe.

I would drive Stafford and McNabb to Denver to get ROR.

 

[Jim Bob]

I wonder if the Yotes would shop OEL given his pending RFA status?

 

[RattleYourSabre]

Ennis is 23 years old and already averages 54 points a season. He put up 49 points as a rookie with under 16 minutes a game. The year prior he put up 9 points in his first 10 games, and led the team in scoring in the playoffs. This year he is on a 59p/82gp pace. Wishful thinking that Ennis will fail to improve offensively.

He hasn't even put up 54 points in a season, how is he averaging that?

In four NHL seasons (I'll use the term "season" even though he has just one full one under his belt) he's scored: 9, 49, 34, 10*. That's occurred in 154 games. That's .66 points per game. If he had played in 82 games every year, and he stayed at his projected rate (Which rarely happens. Does anyone think Vanek is going to get 78 points in a 48 game season? And if it were 82, 134 points. ) he would have averaged 54 points. The problem is, you really CAN'T use a projection to decide how many points a guy would have scored.

There are hot streaks and cold streaks.

* = current year.

 

[stokes84]

you don't remember?

No, apparently you don't either.

 

[Jim Bob]

http://prohockeytalk.nbcsports.com/...-says-avs-player-on-oreilly-contract-disupte/

Hopefully the fax machine is working...

 

[Zip15]

If the prospect had to be someone like McNabb or Pysyk, then the roster player would have to be the likes of Stafford or Gerbe.

Then the deal probably doesn't get done from Colorado's perspective. They've got the player that a lot of teams are going to want. I mean, I know you don't believe Gerbe as the roster player gets this deal done (unless the prospect is Grigorenko, and that isn't happening). And Stafford is a good buy-low option for many teams, but that's not buying him low if he's the roster centerpiece for ROR.

The Avs have nothing but time. They're not making the playoffs. What's a few more losses other than more lottery balls for MacKinnon or Jones? Teams wanting to make a push will start making better and better and offers as the deadline approaches. A lot of teams will want ROR, so leverage the **** out of that if you're Colorado.

*new coach, #1 DMAN, a non-rookie center?

TBH, I think Murray's better then Regehr. But I agree, we need to aim higher for a top D man like you said. Ha, pipe dreams man... Darcy's not doing anything this year.

I'm not inclined to agree. Regehr was once a top-pairing defenseman; Murray's never been anything more than a solid #4. Murray is actually the older player, too, and his style--like Rivet's and Regehr's--has started taking its toll. Murray is a player whose name has always exceeded his actual ability, IMO.

 

[sabresandcanucks]

My hunch is that neither McNabb or Pysyk qualify as top prospects in Colorado's eyes. Hope I am wrong though.

 

[Zip15]

No, apparently you don't either.

I'm not sure if this is what Jame was referring to, but this was a gem plucked from the thread about whether we should consider trading Ennis:

There is also the "in a package for Bobby Ryan". Bobby Ryan should be in a package for Ennis.

http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1218967&highlight=ennis

 

[Zip15]

My hunch is that neither McNabb or Pysyk qualify as top prospects in Colorado's eyes. Hope I am wrong though.

Who knows. Lake Erie is in Rochester's division, so I'm sure they've had good looks at Buffalo's prospects in Rochester.

 

[struckbyaparkedcar]

Who knows. Lake Erie is in Rochester's division, so I'm sure they've had good looks at Buffalo's prospects in Rochester.

They should especially be familiar with McNabb considering Hishon still hasn't come back from his concussion.

 

[Zip15]

They should especially be familiar with McNabb considering Hishon still hasn't come back from his concussion.

Yep. That could be...awkward. But he's a good prospect, and has the size and physicality many teams covet. In any event, I think Girgensons is the prospect Colorado would covet. I wonder if Buffalo would do Ennis + Girgensons for ROR + Pickard/Aittokallio?

 

[stokes84]

I'm not sure if this is what Jame was referring to, but this was a gem plucked from the thread about whether we should consider trading Ennis:





http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1218967&highlight=ennis

Yeah, that's not a prediction. Nice to see you guys tag teaming. Who has more points in the last 40 games? Who is younger? Who is on the cheaper contract? Who has more goals this year? Cool.

 

[Duddy]

Yep. That could be...awkward. But he's a good prospect, and has the size and physicality many teams covet. In any event, I think Girgensons is the prospect Colorado would covet. I wonder if Buffalo would do Ennis + Girgensons for ROR + Pickard/Aittokallio?

would be a great deal. I'd hate to lose Zemgus, but that deal would be too good to pass up.

 

[HockeyH3aven]

Well, Darcy's excuse that the trade market is still quiet is certainly out the window now. Nothing major, but it appears as if GM's are willing to deal now that they have an idea of what their team looks like.

 

[vcv]

Well, Darcy's excuse that the trade market is still quiet is certainly out the window now. Nothing major, but it appears as if GM's are willing to deal now that they have an idea of what their team looks like.

Darcy said that the trade market was soft. He further clarified that teams were willing to only make small deals.

I don't see any trades that have been made to suggest otherwise.

 

[Jame]

I'm not sure if this is what Jame was referring to, but this was a gem plucked from the thread about whether we should consider trading Ennis:





http://hfboards.mandatory.com/showthread.php?t=1218967&highlight=ennis

Stokes has been against trading Ennis for anyone... not for Bobby Ryan, not for Jordan Staal, and now not for Ryan O'reilly.

He has no credibility when it comes to Ennis... he's simply to in love.

 

[Zip15]

Yeah, that's not a prediction. Nice to see you guys tag teaming. Who has more points in the last 40 games? Who is younger? Who is on the cheaper contract? Who has more goals this year? Cool.

So what you're telling everyone is that you still think Bobby Ryan should be in a package for Tyler Ennis, and not vice-versa?

 

[stokes84]

So what you're telling everyone is that you still think Bobby Ryan should be in a package for Tyler Ennis, and not vice-versa?

That was hyperbole, but the idea that Bobby Ryan is worlds better than Ennis goes against facts.

 

[Jame]

That was hyperbole, but the idea that Bobby Ryan is worlds better than Ennis goes against facts.

Name on other 4x 30 goal scorer

have fun with your "facts" argument...