Speculation: Sabres Roster Speculation - Pre-season 2023 Edition

[The Blunder Years]

Hellebuyck makes way more sense to go to a team like NJ, Carolina, Ottawa, Seattle, or Edmonton. They all want to win ASAP and don’t really have a goalie (prospect or on the roster) that would touch Hellebucyk. They also would be more willing to part with future 1st and top prospects.

Sabres aren’t in this boat, mainly due to Levi. We could definitely find a tandem partner with him through free agency or a smaller trade that makes more sense. Don’t need to trade premium assets for a player that will want 5+ years and top dollars on a contract.

 

[Ace]

It’s fine to believe that Levi will, one day, be a top quality 1A goaltender. I believe it. What I don’t believe is that he’s going to do it in the next couple years. Need a plan besides throw in fire, wait and see. For Levi’s sake…and for the teams.

Now…I just don’t happen to think it has to be Helle and the cost involved. But it can’t be what Adams has been doing either. In between those two ideas is literally every other goalie in the NHL. Let’s start there

 

[Diaspora]

I don’t want to trade what it takes to get him and then pay what it takes to keep him…but I also don’t want to see the concept of addressing goaltending (where they have nothing proven whatsoever) with one of the best goalies on the planet long term dismissed as a “shortcut”.

how long is this journey supposed to be that we’re still talking about shortcuts? If Levi is like every other goalie in the world and takes a few years to grab the role in a meaningful way…that’s…the only plan allowed? To waste half of the years on those contracts we’re handing out on a maybe that might never? That’s not a plan. And if it is…then yeah….it needs what youd call a shortcut. And I’d call a plan.

So, there's a half dozen elite goalies in the league, and there's evidence that an elite goalie can make the difference between a contender and an also-ran.

Levi may become an elite goalie, but no one in their right mind would say he is one now, or that he will be in three years.

Signing an elite goalie costs a lot, and if we signed one, we would come up against cap limits. This, btw, is the whole point of having a salary cap to begin with -- so one team can't afford to hoard all of the elite players.

To my knowledge, Hellebuyck is the only elite goalie that may be acquirable this off-season.

Can't runback Levi/UPL/Comrie next year. A non-elite goalie might not look any better given our defense issues.

Pick your poison.

 

[TheMistyStranger]

So, there's a half dozen elite goalies in the league, and there's evidence that an elite goalie can make the difference between a contender and an also-ran.

Levi may become an elite goalie, but no one in their right mind would say he is one now, or that he will be in three years.

Signing an elite goalie costs a lot, and if we signed one, we would come up against cap limits. This, btw, is the whole point of having a salary cap to begin with -- so one team can't afford to hoard all of the elite players.

To my knowledge, Hellebuyck is the only elite goalie that may be acquirable this off-season.

Can't runback Levi/UPL/Comrie next year. A non-elite goalie might not look any better given our defense issues.

Pick your poison.

Prior to this playoff season, I'd agree. But that first round raises a lot of questions about how much value an "elite" goalie carries compared to, say, elite team defense.

 

[Fjordy]

Right, if you add a top 3 goalie, you aren't going to overpay a bottom pair d-man. It's making choices.

Also do we have to pay Mitts? We are dabbling in hypotheticals at this point. We have 6 1st and 2nd round forwards in the last two years. None of whom have burned their 1st year of their ELC yet. Wouldn't the most effective thing here be to weaponize the young depth to so we can invest heavily asset and cap wise in areas like Goaltending where we aren't strong?




Yes it would be a shame if we ::checks notes:: made the playoffs every year like Florida has with Bobrovsky.

It's an opportunity to get the best goalie in the league in their prime still. If you add Hellebuyck and a top 4 d-man and revamp the bottom 6F group a bit, this is a playoff team next season and beyond. There are potential cap implications, sure. But it's not to the point it's untenable.

Florida doesn't make the playoffs because of Bob, he's been bad in Florida all these years and they didn't know how to get rid of him. Don't act like he's always played in Florida the way he's playing in the playoffs now.

Helle doesn't seem to be very good in the playoffs by the way. I'm not against Helle, but only at a reasonable cost and contract. As I understand it, you are ready to pay anything for him and him. We have a different approach.

 

[Fjordy]

Maybe just sign Jarry for 5M x 4Y , he has stable and normal stats in five season.

 

[Zman5778]

Prior to this playoff season, I'd agree. But that first round raises a lot of questions about how much value an "elite" goalie carries compared to, say, elite team defense.

Fix the team defense and the goaltending will fix itself. Possibly with no further immediate investment.

 

[Ace]

Fix the team defense and the goaltending will fix itself. Possibly with no further immediate investment.

It’s a nice thought…but we actually see these goalies play and this isn’t a video game. This is the Joker discussion over again. If everything around him has to be perfectly controlled…then upgrade already. We see UPL’s poor movement. We see Joker’s zero offensive and defensive IQ. We see Comrie…all of it. Those mistakes aren‘t magically washed away by usage and what’s around them. You’re just burdening the better players to cover for them. You’re just making them less effective.

Comrie and UPL is a wasted year. Because of them. Not because of whats around them

 

[Fjordy]

Fix the team defense and the goaltending will fix itself. Possibly with no further immediate investment.

I'm not sure about that, so I don't want to risk another season. I'm not sure about Comrie and UPL even with the best defense. As I said, Anderson was better than them with the same defense.

Fix defense and fix goalie

 

[Havok89]

It’s fine to believe that Levi will, one day, be a top quality 1A goaltender. I believe it. What I don’t believe is that he’s going to do it in the next couple years. Need a plan besides throw in fire, wait and see. For Levi’s sake…and for the teams.

Now…I just don’t happen to think it has to be Helle and the cost involved. But it can’t be what Adams has been doing either. In between those two ideas is literally every other goalie in the NHL. Let’s start there

You know it’s going to be UPL and Levi next season

 

[TheMistyStranger]

I'm not sure about that, so I don't want to risk another season. I'm not sure about Comrie and UPL even with the best defense. As I said, Anderson was better than them with the same defense.

Fix defense and fix goalie

Comrie did very well in Winnipeg, where they have much better team defense. I'm not ready to write him off based on one injury-riddled season. Fix the defense.

 

[Irie]

GMs know they are unlikely to see the end of the contract they sign. Not one of those GMs that signed those deals is still in that job. They care about winning now and that’s it. Desperate GMs do stuff…repeatedly. As you pointed out yourself.

Two way street.... a lot of GMs LOSE there jobs because they gave out a contract like those. Those types of contracts hamstring organizations moving forward and almost always cost the teams the flexibility needed to address bigger needs, undermines their future success, leading to those GMs' demise.

 

[Fjordy]

Comrie did very well in Winnipeg, where they have much better team defense. I'm not ready to write him off based on one injury-riddled season. Fix the defense.

In one season, less than 20 games, I don't want to risk that, so my opinion is to fix goalie and defense.

Comrie NHL stats all sesons 89,7% SV, 3.32 GAA

 

[TehDoak]

I mean, in the end, Re: Hellebuyck, it's a matter of what level of risk you are willing to take on this season.

I, personally, don't think it's worth the risk to simply go out and get him as a rental. I guess that could change depending on the cost. If it's a 2024 1st and UPL or both our 2nds and UPL....I think that is an OK risk to take, especially given that it pushes Levi to Rochester for the year, which I think is the proper place for him. But my guess is it's a 1st+ UPL + Top/Mid Tier prospect. Essentially the same as a high end rental at the deadline.

However, if you are willing to go out and pay the price AND extend him, getting 3-4 years of top 5 goaltending (and probably 3-4 years of very overpaid goaltending), it's a consideration.

I certainly think, cap wise, you could lock in a #4 d-man AND sign Hellebuyck long term, it's just a matter of being willing to let forwards (Like Mittelstadt) walk when they hit those expensive UFA years.

Basically, you would be making a choice now for immediate improvement in exchange for less flexibility later.

I think it SHOULD be a real consideration for the front office considering the immense upgrade it would be. However, I doubt we'll see much more than a price check in call.

 

[Irie]

It’s fine to believe that Levi will, one day, be a top quality 1A goaltender. I believe it. What I don’t believe is that he’s going to do it in the next couple years. Need a plan besides throw in fire, wait and see. For Levi’s sake…and for the teams.

Now…I just don’t happen to think it has to be Helle and the cost involved. But it can’t be what Adams has been doing either. In between those two ideas is literally every other goalie in the NHL. Let’s start there

First part, totally agree with. but the seond part, without a real defensive structure, 70%+ of the goalies in the league are going to be "comrie clones" when inserted into the Sabres net.

VejMelka, Hill, Gibson.... all just going to be more "swing and a miss" and add another problem goalie contract to the ledger.

Hell, I'd bet some serious cash that if Comrie was included in a trade for Hellebuyck, that Comrie's sv% back with the Jets would be higher than Hellebuyck's with the Sabres if coaching doesn't address the PK and defensive zone coverage.

 

[TehDoak]

Florida doesn't make the playoffs because of Bob, he's been bad in Florida all these years and they didn't know how to get rid of him. Don't act like he's always played in Florida the way he's playing in the playoffs now.

Helle doesn't seem to be very good in the playoffs by the way. I'm not against Helle, but only at a reasonable cost and contract. As I understand it, you are ready to pay anything for him and him. We have a different approach.

He's had one excellent year and a few meddling ones. He's certainly been overpaid. But...he hasn't been the reason they missed the playoffs yet either.

Maybe just sign Jarry for 5M x 4Y , he has stable and normal stats in five season.

His injury history is bothersome.

Fix the team defense and the goaltending will fix itself. Possibly with no further immediate investment.

If we had two veteran journeyman as tandem goalies, I'd agree with you. If our baseline was average goaltending, maybe it wouldn't be worth the price to upgrade. But our baseline is inconsistent, bad goaltending. So while fixing the defense will improve the goaltending numbers, far too many times were there just the back breaking goal against where you needed an extra save and didn't get it.

Comrie did very well in Winnipeg, where they have much better team defense. I'm not ready to write him off based on one injury-riddled season. Fix the defense.

Sure, goalies CAN get better. And it's not out of the realm of possibility that Comrie could be better next year. In fact, I don't mind keeping him as a backup if we get an established starter.

However, the fact that two goalie hungry teams claimed him off waivers, saw him up close, in practice, during games, and then put him back on waivers just really suggests there's a pretty low ceiling here. And it's probably "adequate backup". We need more than that.

 

[Fjordy]

His injury history is bothersome.

Ullmark also got injured in Buffalo, but now there are no problems.

Tristan Jarry Injury Updates - CapFriendly - NHL Salary Caps

There are mostly some minor injuries, day to day, week.

 

[Irie]

Helle doesn't seem to be very good in the playoffs by the way. I'm not against Helle, but only at a reasonable cost and contract. As I understand it, you are ready to pay anything for him and him. We have a different approach.

I think a lot of it has to do with the Jets team defense tends to fold under the heavy preasure the playoff's bring and Hellebuyck is not quite as elite in a situation where the chances are much higher (similiar to what goalies face when in the Sabres net).

 

[HaNotsri]

We are now in the path of last season's Devils. They got the parts they needed to get them into the playoffs.

Goalie
Top 4 D
Top 6 forward

I don't think Adams is going to change anything in attack, plus he has already traded for Greenway who I think still has the potential to become a decent top 9 forward. But goalie and top 4 D should probably be on Adams' mind.

I think Adams will repeat the no risk, no reward strategy this summer.

I'm actually not too optimistic about next season, I believe in the team and talent but it would be a bit lucky if they take another step forward next year. So much will rely on young players yet again but you can't expect 2-3 breakouts every year while no one regresses.

 

[Fjordy]

I think Adams will repeat the no risk, no reward strategy this summer.

I'm actually not too optimistic about next season, I believe in the team and talent but it would be a bit lucky if they take another step forward next year. So much will rely on young players yet again but you can't expect 2-3 breakouts every year while no one regresses.

Well, I hope he does the same thing that Devils did, at least the top 4 D and we need goalie. Moreover, Adams has already said that he is going to improve defense. We don't have any internal reserves there at the moment.

 

[Irie]

However, the fact that two goalie hungry teams claimed him off waivers, saw him up close, in practice, during games, and then put him back on waivers just really suggests there's a pretty low ceiling here. And it's probably "adequate backup". We need more than that.

Two teams where he played a combined 4 games, and two teams who had contract commitments to two other goalies. If your insinuation had even the smallest bit of merit, then the following stats would make absolutely zero sense.

2020-21 Devils
Eric Comrie sv% .909
Mackenzie Blackwood sv% .902
Scott Wedgewood sv% .900
Arron Dell sv% .857

 

[HaNotsri]

Well, I hope he does the same thing that Devils did, at least the top 4 D and we need goalie. Moreover, Adams has already said that he is going to improve defense. We don't have any internal reserves there at the moment.

Improving defense would go a long way.

Another factor is how we take care of goalies. Lehner was an insane gamble by Murray but he figured it out for a while on other teams. Ullmark dealt with injuries and his fathers illness. Then blossomed in Boston.
We need a goalie therapist.

 

[Fjordy]

We need a goalie therapist.

I don't really understand what that means?

 

[Chainshot]

Fix the team defense and the goaltending will fix itself. Possibly with no further immediate investment.

A little from column A and a little from column B. They have to start being more diligent in their own zone, the amount of high danger and cross-seam passes has to get cleaned up for sure. That goes a long way toward making it easier on whoever is in net.

 

[Weltschmerz]

Fix the PK.