Speculation: Sabres Roster Speculation - Pre-season 2023 Edition

[Jim Bob]

Do you think Ullmark will cost a ton? Grzelcyk didn't play that much last season and he has one year UFA, in fact he is defenseman of the third pair. I think he would look good with Boosh. The rights to Clifton are worth next to nothing. I would think something around UPL + Joki + pick maybe.

Samuelsson - Dahlin
Power - Clifton
Grzelcyk - Boosh
Stillman

Ullmark
Levi

Ullmark is a favorite to win the Vezina Trophy. I cannot imagine that he gets traded for less than a haul. And that is IF he gets traded at all.

I doubt Boston blows things up and trades their Vezina level goalie for futures.

To Gibson, I know Marty has expressed he thinks Gibson is washed repeatedly, even as recently as a few weeks ago at Duff's prodding. Since he works for the team and hasn't shift or silenced his stance, I suspect he's not on their shopping list.

I wasn't referring to Gibson as a realistic option as much as an example of a move where there were rumors that Adams and the Sabres had interest and nothing happened.

Kind of like Chychrun...

 

[Fjordy]

I think Boston could definitely get a significant return for Ullmark. Assuming he wins the Vezina, he's still signed for 2 years at a very reasonable cap hit. He's only had 1 season that he posted a save % below .913, and he did that playing mostly for the Sabres. He's been extremely consistent, and the only knocks would be his injury history and playoff performances though he's been fairly healthy in Boston.

Edit: I mean significant as far as goalie returns go, since half of them get traded for 3rd round picks.

I get it, but mostly I see Boston fans on CapFriendly selling Ullmark for 1st and that's it, not always even this draft.

 

[Chainshot]

Ullmark + Grzelcyk + rights to Clifton for ???

??? = more than Adams wants to give up.

Grzelcyk has been out of the lineup at times for Orlov after his acquisition which the punditry thinks is a sign he'll be part of their cap manipulations this summer. He also has the statnik knock that he was the guy who had the biggest drop in play from regular season to post season in the "does size matter" exploration article some of them did earlier this year and some work on bigger defensemen that was authored by Sabres' own Matthew Barlowe that is now lost to the interwebz (ie. I'm still looking for it).

 

[Dingo44]

I get it, but mostly I see Boston fans on CapFriendly selling Ullmark for 1st and that's it, not always even this draft.

Well New England fans are quite reasonable.

 

[Fjordy]

Ullmark is a favorite to win the Vezina Trophy. I cannot imagine that he gets traded for less than a haul. And that is IF he gets traded at all.

I doubt Boston blows things up and trades their Vezina level goalie for futures.

Yes, and he was bad in the playoffs two times in a row. Some fans think they should move on from Swayman's starter role and trade Ullmark for a pick. Apparently Boston just needs a place in the cap to sign the rest of the players. Just look at CapFriendly.

 

[WhereAreTheCookies]

I get it, but mostly I see Boston fans on CapFriendly selling Ullmark for 1st and that's it, not always even this draft.

Probably because he has a full NMC that shifts to a 16 team NTC on July 1st, so they would be selling him after the draft.

 

[Jim Bob]

Yes, and he was bad in the playoffs two times in a row. Some fans think they should move on from Swayman's starter role and trade Ullmark for a pick. Apparently Boston just needs a place in the cap to sign the rest of the players. Just look at CapFriendly.

Just because fans think that does not mean that the GM thinks that.

 

[Fjordy]

Grzelcyk has been out of the lineup at times for Orlov after his acquisition which the punditry thinks is a sign he'll be part of their cap manipulations this summer. He also has the statnik knock that he was the guy who had the biggest drop in play from regular season to post season in the "does size matter" exploration article some of them did earlier this year and some work on bigger defensemen that was authored by Sabres' own Matthew Barlowe that is now lost to the interwebz (ie. I'm still looking for it).

Well, we can just trade Ullmark + rights to Clifton.

Just because fans think that does not mean that the GM thinks that.

I know, but that doesn't mean it won't happen. They need a place in the cap, and Ullmark is an obvious candidate to trade for futures.

 

[Jim Bob]

I know, but that doesn't mean it won't happen. They need a place in the cap, and Ullmark is an obvious candidate to trade for futures.

Ullmark has a full NMC today that drops to a 16 team No Trade List on 7/1/2023.

Ullmark has full control over whether he goes anywhere today and has a huge hammer even after 7/1 as he can just list teams that are not going to trade for him as the only teams he would accept a trade to.

Hurricanes & Panthers Highlight The Value of Defensive Forwards - The Hockey Writers Carolina Hurricanes Latest News, Analysis & More

Goals were up this season and there has been a clear shift in recent years emphasizing speed and skill at all positions. Heading into the Stanley Cup Playoffs, the teams…

thehockeywriters.com

 

[Fjordy]

Ullmark has a full NMC today that drops to a 16 team No Trade List on 7/1/2023.

Ullmark has full control over whether he goes anywhere today and has a huge hammer even after 7/1 as he can just list teams that are not going to trade for him as the only teams he would accept a trade to.

Hurricanes & Panthers Highlight The Value of Defensive Forwards - The Hockey Writers Carolina Hurricanes Latest News, Analysis & More

Goals were up this season and there has been a clear shift in recent years emphasizing speed and skill at all positions. Heading into the Stanley Cup Playoffs, the teams…

thehockeywriters.com

And? He loves Buffalo, we could also trade after the draft. The question here is rather whether Adams wants to return Ullmark

 

[Jim Bob]

And? He loves Buffalo, we could also trade after the draft. The question here is rather whether Adams wants to return Ullmark

He may not want to move again.

It wouldn't shock me at all if neither Ullmark nor Adams wanted a reunion.

 

[Fjordy]

He may not want to move again.

It wouldn't shock me at all if neither Ullmark nor Adams wanted a reunion.

Well, it depends on how they broke up. If Boston wants to trade Ullmark, they will trade him after the 1st.

 

[Chainshot]

He may not want to move again.

It wouldn't shock me at all if neither Ullmark nor Adams wanted a reunion.

Paraphrasing Adams: We want players who want to be here.


That ain't Ullmark.

 

[Jim Bob]

Well, it depends on how they broke up. If Boston wants to trade Ullmark, they will trade him after the 1st.

Not if he doesn't want to be dealt and wants to stay in Boston.

 

[Fjordy]

Not if he doesn't want to be dealt and wants to stay in Boston.

He will also have a list of 16 teams.

 

[Jim Bob]

He will also have a list of 16 teams.

Yeah and if he wants to stay, he will have the 16 most likely teams to need a #1 goalie on his NO trade list.

He will block teams like Buffalo, Edmonton, Ottawa, and others. Then he will leave teams like Dallas, NYI, NYR and others that are set in goal as teams he will accept a trade to effectively blocking all trades out of Boston.

 

[Dingo44]

Well, it depends on how they broke up. If Boston wants to trade Ullmark, they will trade him after the 1st.

Ullmark isn't getting traded and we're not trading for him. Might as well discuss trading for a Tkachuk or Makar.

 

[Fjordy]

Yeah and if he wants to stay, he will have the 16 most likely teams to need a #1 goalie on his NO trade list.

He will block teams like Buffalo, Edmonton, Ottawa, and others. Then he will leave teams like Dallas, NYI, NYR and others that are set in goal as teams he will accept a trade to effectively blocking all trades out of Boston.

I thought the list was already made.

Ullmark isn't getting traded and we're not trading for him. Might as well discuss trading for a Tkachuk or Makar.

We can discuss.

 

[Jim Bob]

I thought the list was already made.

With the M-NTC coming into play on 7/1/2023, there is usually a date beforehand that a player has to provide a list to the team. Nobody knows when that date is. But since the first two years of the deal had a full NMC, I doubt the list was in place at the start of the contract.

 

[joshjull]

I believe (definitely not certain) we offered him the exact same contract he got in Boston, he chose Boston. Certainly not faulting him on that choice, that’s for sure.

The reported ask from Ullmark to stay was 6x6mil AAV. Similar to what Grubauer got.

With the M-NTC coming into play on 7/1/2023, there is usually a date beforehand that a player has to provide a list to the team. Nobody knows when that date is. But since the first two years of the deal had a full NMC, I doubt the list was in place at the start of the contract.

Don’t they have until the day the terms change?

 

[Jim Bob]

Don’t they have until the day the terms change?

There is a deadline for the list to be submitted to the team, as we saw in the Berglund trade example.

My guess is that the list would need to be handed over in advance of 7/1 so that the Bruins have a sense of who they can talk to without having to ask Ullmark to waive. But, any sort of deadline would be in the actual contract and we do not have access to that.

Some contracts also have wording that the player will provide a list when the team asks for one as we have heard GMs state that they have not asked a player for a list.

 

[SnuggaRUDE]

Caught up on a lot of reading. Thoughts

1. Buffalo has former goalies doing well
2. They give up an outsized number of HDCA
3. Given 1&2 maybe goalie isn’t the issue
4. If I’m bargain hunting I’m looking at the cap twister NYR have tied themselves into
5. FO% is still over rated
6. Savioe, Kulich, and especially Ostlund/Rosen are not locks for the top 9
7. Joker will look surprisingly better when his partner isn’t 20
8. Adams is, rightly, banking on internal improvements because the team is incredibly young
9. PK1 is the lowest hanging fruit for improvement
10. Buffalo was really healthy last year which masked some of their problems
11. Reinbacher won’t be left at 13
12. I don’t hate trading back to the 20s and taking an extra defensive prospect

 

[TageGod]

This isn't a real rumor this is just KA due diligence at most. There is a 0.0% chance they trade for Connor. I would be incredibly disappointed if they did. Tampa Bay level wasted assets.

 

[Fjordy]

Caught up on a lot of reading. Thoughts

1. Buffalo has former goalies doing well
2. They give up an outsized number of HDCA
3. Given 1&2 maybe goalie isn’t the issue
4. If I’m bargain hunting I’m looking at the cap twister NYR have tied themselves into
5. FO% is still over rated
6. Savioe, Kulich, and especially Ostlund/Rosen are not locks for the top 9
7. Joker will look surprisingly better when his partner isn’t 20
8. Adams is, rightly, banking on internal improvements because the team is incredibly young
9. PK1 is the lowest hanging fruit for improvement
10. Buffalo was really healthy last year which masked some of their problems
11. Reinbacher won’t be left at 13
12. I don’t hate trading back to the 20s and taking an extra defensive prospect

3. Anderson 90,7%, UPL 89,2%, Comrie 88,6%

7. Joker is not suitable to play with Dahlin or Power, so he has no place in the top 4. He cannot play LD (as I was told) and I would prefer Boosh in the third pair with his skills over Joker. Joker looks like a guy who likes to move the puck and go on the offensive. No place

8. I understand about internal improvements in attack, but I don’t see them in defense and goalkeeping. We expect Levi to be this help, but we need another goalie.

 

[Ace]

I can’t believe I just read someone blame Owen Power for Joker being terrible. He‘s even worse with Dahlin! Power masks his problems more than anyone.

My God.