Confirmed with Link: Ryan McLeod & Ty Tullio traded to Buffalo for Matthew Savoie

[michaelsaas]

So more Grier than Hecht?

 

[La Cosa Nostra]

Ok say it’s the day before the 2022 draft. Knowing we had the 9th pick is ANYONE saying they would be pleased if whoever we drafted ended up being a solid “30-35 point 3C” at 9th overall? No. Because that’s asinine to plug a 13 minute a night spot in the lineup using a f***ing top 9 draft pick.

The fact that the Oilers threw in a complete no name scrub is also hilarious..at the very least we should have gotten some kind of potential NHLer back not Ty f***ing Tullio. McLeod isn’t even physical and is 49% on his career for face offs so he isn’t even adept at those. And he doesn’t take crazy DZS either those are 49-51. This is atrocious. When you once got Toni Lydman for a 3rd it’s just disgusting the trades this week.

 

[MOGlLNY]

Ok say it’s the day before the 2022 draft. Knowing we had the 9th pick is ANYONE saying they would be pleased if whoever we drafted ended up being a solid “30-35 point 3C” at 9th overall? No. Because that’s asinine to plug a 13 minute a night spot in the lineup using a f***ing top 9 draft pick.

The fact that the Oilers threw in a complete no name scrub is also hilarious..at the very least we should have gotten some kind of potential NHLer back not Ty f***ing Tullio

I’m shocked to hear you don’t like this

 

[ValJamesDuex]

Agree. The hole was caused by the fact that as a team we haven't done a good enough job of drafting and developing the bottom 6 players we need. Guys who provide defense, physicality, PK ability, faceoffs, etc.

We didn't have anyone like Malenstyn. So we had to overpay to get him.
We didn't have anyone like McLeod. So we had to overpay to get him.

In a perfect world, we'd have our own 24 year old versions of those guys graduating from Rochester to fill those roles. But we don't. And that's not just on Adams, it started with Botterill not being able to successfully draft those players as well.

Pekar busted. Davidsson busted. Asplund teased us, then busted. And we also didn't have enough of those kinds of lottery tickets, which forced us to bank on those guys panning out. Those are the guys that left the hole in the lineup. Any of those guys hit, they are filling a role on this roster and maybe we don't have to go out and get a McLeod.

Great post!

Rousek does not seem to have much upside, Kozak is still iffy if he will make it and Biro can't seem to make a jump.
Wahlberg should be a big piece. Love the look of Ziemer and is a future A if he makes it
But more needed

ps some think Tullio could be a bottom 6 nhl'er down the road

 

[StrompTroller]

The only way to be as mad as some people are is to

A. For some reason think there is a massive gap between Savoie and the rest of the forward prospects. Which isn’t true.

B. Somehow think that every one of those prospects was going to find a spot here despite there being 6 guys and maybe at most three spots down the line. You know,..before they’re all in their draft plus six seasons. Which isn’t likely.

C. Were REALLY looking forward to watching Krebs at 3C. Which isn’t possible.

Other than that…you’re talking about one of a group of similarly ranked prospects who can’t all play here moved to improve upon Krebs at a key spot on the roster with a 24 year old who does the things they want in this league.

You can be mad about it, sure. I just don’t see how you can be THAT mad.

D. Trading a 50 dollar bill for a 10 spot because its payday is how this deal looks like. Thats how you can be mad. People who are frugal and responsible with their "assets" look at this as pissing away 50 bucks on a 10 dollar item that could have been found at goodwill for 5 bucks.

Im not even that upset about losing savoie the player and I think he's more damaged than the media/we know but the doctors do so cutting ties makes some sense before value tanks but no matter how you cut it it was piss poor asset management and he shouldve garnered a bigger or better return or been included ina deal for a better return.

Im not mad about McLeod as the return im eager to see how he does. He just wasn't enough for what we gave.

My biggest gripe is that people keep saying savoie was small skilled and redundant which is true 100% but you cant defend adams trading him for a subpar return we HE MADE THE POOL THAT WAY. He doesnt get kudos for blowing a top 10 pick and a high second on finally addressing the size/bottom 6 balance lol. It was his fault in the first place. You can be okay with the trade in a vacuum but giving adams any credit for now having to overpay to right his mistakes is asinine.

 

[Steddy33]

For the first time in years the Sabres are building a team with an identity. It actual looks like they have goal with their acquisitions. People are worried about having to give up a guy who isn't their top prospect, who seems to be injured a lot and they have to many of similar stock of. Games aren't won with potential and prospects. You actual need to build a team.

I don't love McLeod but he fits what they are trying to do and they did it. This a huge step in the right direction for this franchise.

 

[BFLO]

Savoie tries to play bigger than he is, going to the slot/net, but that's in the WHL. In a small sample in Rochester he collected points but was scratched in playoff games. I think he projects as a mid-six winger that will play with speed and skill, but will be outmatched physically even though he'll try to get dirty. I can't say how he ranked among our other prospects but personally, I want a bigger roster a la FL, LA from years ago, TB. I don't think Savoie fits that type of team. I don't think McLeod does either though.

That's 2 different seasons in the AHL that you're conflating into 1.

In his 18-19 yr old season he got into game 2 and 3 of the AHL Eastern Conference Finals and didn't do much. Tough spot to get thrown into. The Amerks were completely over matched by the eventual Calder Cup champ Hersey Bears. It wasn't just Savoie.

The next season he played a 6 game conditioning stint in the regular season and scored 5 points. His CHL playoff run went longer than the Amerks this year, so he never got a chance at a call up.

 

[CowbellConray]

D. Trading a 50 dollar bill for a 10 spot because its payday is how this deal looks like. Thats how you can be mad. People who are frugal and responsible with their "assets" look at this as pissing away 50 bucks on a 10 dollar item that could have been found at goodwill for 5 bucks.

Im not even that upset about losing savoie the player and I think he's more damaged than the media/we know but the doctors do so cutting ties makes some sense before value tanks but no matter how you cut it it was piss poor asset management and he shouldve garnered a bigger or better return or been included ina deal for a better return.

Im not mad about McLeod as the return im eager to see how he does. He just wasn't enough for what we gave.

My biggest gripe is that people keep saying savoie was small skilled and redundant which is true 100% but you cant defend adams trading him for a subpar return we HE MADE THE POOL THAT WAY. He doesnt get kudos for blowing a top 10 pick and a high second on finally addressing the size/bottom 6 balance lol. It was his fault in the first place. You can be okay with the trade in a vacuum but giving adams any credit for now having to overpay to right his mistakes is asinine.

I don’t think any GM would say Savoie had 5 times the value of McLeod. Maybe like you spent 15 dollars on parking because you wanted to get to the game on time instead of 10 which would have made you late. You aren’t happy you paid 15, but at the end of the day you made it to the game on time


We need to make the damn playoffs. This move for this season gives us a better chance than what we had with Savoie.

 

[NotABadPeriod]

Great post!

Rousek does not seem to have much upside, Kozak is still iffy if he will make it and Biro can't seem to make a jump.
Wahlberg should be a big piece. Love the look of Ziemer and is a future A if he makes it
But more needed

ps some think Tullio could be a bottom 6 nhl'er down the road

Biro signed with Seattle as a free agent, so he's out of the picture completely.

 

[Fjordy]

Ok say it’s the day before the 2022 draft. Knowing we had the 9th pick is ANYONE saying they would be pleased if whoever we drafted ended up being a solid “30-35 point 3C” at 9th overall? No. Because that’s asinine to plug a 13 minute a night spot in the lineup using a f***ing top 9 draft pick.

The fact that the Oilers threw in a complete no name scrub is also hilarious..at the very least we should have gotten some kind of potential NHLer back not Ty f***ing Tullio. McLeod isn’t even physical and is 49% on his career for face offs so he isn’t even adept at those. And he doesn’t take crazy DZS either those are 49-51. This is atrocious. When you once got Toni Lydman for a 3rd it’s just disgusting the trades this week.

I think Kasper was on their radar, it's like a 3C. We were looking at Kasper for that as well and some wanted to take him.

 

[Deep Blue Metallic]

Ok say it’s the day before the 2022 draft. Knowing we had the 9th pick is ANYONE saying they would be pleased if whoever we drafted ended up being a solid “30-35 point 3C” at 9th overall? No. Because that’s asinine to plug a 13 minute a night spot in the lineup using a f***ing top 9 draft pick.

The fact that the Oilers threw in a complete no name scrub is also hilarious..at the very least we should have gotten some kind of potential NHLer back not Ty f***ing Tullio

Check out these recent busts and near-busts with a Top-9 draft pedigree. There is no guarantee whatsoever attached to a 9OA pick.

2016: Puljujarvi 3rd, Juolevi 4th, Alex Nylander (!) 8th
2017: Patrick 2nd (feel so bad for that kid), Glass 6th
2018: Kravtsov 9th
2019: Dach 3rd (ditto for Kirby), Turcotte 4th
2021: Clarke 8th

I'll wager that every single GM who made those unfortunate picks says "ya, gimme Ryan McLeod" with the benefit of hindsight.

 

[Fjordy]

2021: Clarke 8th

Was he developing poorly? I just wasn't paying attention.

 

[Old Navy Goat]

I think Kasper was on their radar, it's like a 3C. We were looking at Kasper for that as well and some wanted to take him.

Kasper and Gauthier were my preferences for #9

 

[Fjordy]

Kasper and Gauthier were my preferences for #9

I liked Gauthier a lot, but so did Savoie. I would have been fine with Kasper too.

 

[RefsIdeas]

I don’t think any GM would say Savoie had 5 times the value of McLeod. Maybe like you spent 15 dollars on parking because you wanted to get to the game on time instead of 10 which would have made you late. You aren’t happy you paid 15, but at the end of the day you made it to the game on time


We need to make the damn playoffs. This move for this season gives us a better chance than what we had with Savoie.

I think this move does help us make the playoffs. Is McLeod better than Savoie long-term though?

What’s our long-term goal?

This feels like a move a cup contender would make to find that “one missing piece”. Not a team that’ll get throttled in the first round.

 

[Speedy Cerviche]

How does the #1 PPG player in the WHL not have top line upside?

Look at his line mates and deployment by chance? I'm not saying yay/nay here, but playing with Firkus/Jager/Mateychuk/Calvert for a full 2 minutes on every PP, and getting at least 1/2 of those guys at ES, the PPG adds up. Especially when he joined one of the top offensive teams in the WHL.
I've watched a lot of Savoie in junior, I will say this. Benson in his draft year was way better than Savoie, Geekie is a much better pro prospect v Savoie (former teammates). Savoie is either a top six F or playing in Europe in 4-5 years IMO.

 

[Old Navy Goat]

I liked Gauthier a lot, but so did Savoie. I would have been fine with Kasper too.

I didn't want Savoie due to his injury history, though i warmed towards him. I was lambasted for proclaiming Benson was better.
Saying that this wasn't the best trade in regards to value. Roster wise it makes sense, and trading a surplus for a need generally depresses the value of the trade commodity

 

[Deep Blue Metallic]

Was he developing poorly? I just wasn't paying attention.

2021 draft - too early to tell really. That was unfair to Clarke. He's 21. There might be a few others I listed who turn it around.

My point stands though. There's no guarantee attached to a 9OA.

 

[jd1970]

I watched Savoie's only game. He looked scared out of his wits, and was benched the final two periods and was never heard from again.

 

[jd1970]

How does the #1 PPG player in the WHL not have top line upside?

He was 20 years old playing kid hockey.

 

[Chainshot]

lol the revision in here trying to downplay Savoie as a prospect is interesting.

Kasper and Gauthier were my preferences for #9

And even Kasper was in trade rumors in recent weeks. *shrug*

 

[jd1970]

lol the revision in here trying to downplay Savoie as a prospect is interesting.


And even Kasper was in trade rumors in recent weeks. *shrug*

I never liked him much myself, but what do I know. Soft and fragile.

 

[McFlyingV]

Is the rule still that you can extend someone once they're in the last year of their deal? If so:

What I'd like to see Adams do now is put Pegulas money where his mouth is. Get a long term extension done with McLeod. If he's really someone you think can be a cornerstone piece worth trading a blue chip prospect for, then give him a contract that indicates it. 5 X $4 million?

I think you would regret that contract badly. McLeod's upside is unlikely to be much higher than he's currently shown. There really hasn't been any indication that he will become more physical or more willing to engage in physical battles, it's been the knock on him since he was 16 and 8 years later he's shown no sign of changing this part of his game. His strengths lie in his skating as a puck transporter and a back checker, and it's why his underlying metrics look so good. He is very good at carrying the puck out of his own zone and into the offensive zone, but he's not sure what to do with it once he gets there because he won't attack the middle ice where there might be contact. The same goes with his defensive game where he's a good back checker who can strip pucks with his speed and stick, but once he's in the defensive zone he floats a lot and isn't willing to participate in the physical play required to break up the cycle. It's why he's an effective penalty killer because his job is to use his speed and stick to get in lanes and break up zone entries, not to muscle guys off the puck.

TL;DR - Good puck transporter, good neutral zone/back checking defender, and good pker. Not very good defender in the defensive zone, and not very good offensive zone player. If you can utilize those strengths he'll be a quality player for you.

 

[Dreakon13]

I think this move does help us make the playoffs. Is McLeod better than Savoie long-term though?

What’s our long-term goal?

Putting the cart before the horse there. Sitting on prospects at the expense of the NHL product is part of what got us to this point.

 

[RefsIdeas]

Putting the cart before the horse there. Sitting on prospects at the expense of the NHL product is part of what got us to this point.

Wasn’t Adams whole MO to not hit “fast forward”?Isn’t this doing exactly that?

We made it this far, why sacrifice what we’ve built up now?

I could see sacrificing Savoie + for somebody that would equal or exceed Savoies likely ceiling (Ehlers, Necas). Still can’t wrap my head around this though.