Confirmed with Link: Ryan McLeod & Ty Tullio traded to Buffalo for Matthew Savoie

[old kummelweck]

If only McLeod was more physical and played less afraid, the oilers would have won the stanley cup.

 

[ValJamesDuex]

Chad: McLeod is a bet on data

https://x.com/i/web/status/1809621564599816258

 

[Bryanbryoil]

I feel he will be more physical due to adams revamping the bottom 6 of all the physical guys are infectious and are able to influence the game chances are that will spread and rally the team as whole to play with a bit more bite

Having watched him since he was 18 I would tell you that I would not expect it. If you do there's a good chance that you are setting yourself up for disappointment. In the '21-22 season he was all but a lock to start the season with the big club. Instead he had a poor camp and honestly looked very disengaged physically. So he was sent down. He was later recalled and hasn't gone back to the AHL since. He has had stretches where he looks better than others in this regard, but he really doesn't look to play physical (token bumps or fly by's vs hitting a guy) and tries to avoid physical play as best he can. He could stand to add more mass to his frame even at his current age. IMO he is what he is in this regard but hopefully one day this changes at least when playoff hockey returns to Buffalo.

As a small guy, I find it somewhat infuriating when a big player doesn't utilize his size.

I'm not talking about thunderous body checks, just using your size to angle guys off the puck, put yourself between the opponent and the puck in board battles, go hard to the net no matter who's there, etc.

Hopefully Lindy can light a fire under his ass in that regard. At 24, that might be a tough ask.


We'll know the Sabres have arrived when complaining about our cap woes is a common refrain here.

I hear you, I'm a big guy, but I hate watching bigger players not utilize their advantage. Just separating a guy from a puck with a bump and being dogged on the puck would be great, it's not always about running guys through the boards.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Could you guys fill me in on Savoie? I haven't been following the drafts nearly as closely as I did in the 2010's. I know that he's from a town close to Edmonton and that we drafted his brother but recently didn't qualify him. I also know that he is on the smaller side and supposedly pretty fast. Is he gritty at all? Strengths and weaknesses?

Savoie tries to play bigger than he is, going to the slot/net, but that's in the WHL. In a small sample in Rochester he collected points but was scratched in playoff games. I think he projects as a mid-six winger that will play with speed and skill, but will be outmatched physically even though he'll try to get dirty. I can't say how he ranked among our other prospects but personally, I want a bigger roster a la FL, LA from years ago, TB. I don't think Savoie fits that type of team. I don't think McLeod does either though.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

If only McLeod was more physical and played less afraid, the oilers would have won the stanley cup.

Naw, what we really needed was Connor and Leon to be healthy. McLeod had a couple of seasons to really cement himself as a top end 3C on the team. he had stretches but overall was too inconsistent for a team in contention mode. He was on track to be our 4C this season. Instead we got a guy that can hopefully contribute some offense on an ELC deal over the next 3 years when we will have a cap crunch if we are able to sign all of McDavid, Draisaitl and Bouchard.

 

[Husko]

Is the rule still that you can extend someone once they're in the last year of their deal? If so:

What I'd like to see Adams do now is put Pegulas money where his mouth is. Get a long term extension done with McLeod. If he's really someone you think can be a cornerstone piece worth trading a blue chip prospect for, then give him a contract that indicates it. 5 X $4 million?

 

[Dirty Dog]

Having watched him since he was 18 I would tell you that I would not expect it. If you do there's a good chance that you are setting yourself up for disappointment. In the '21-22 season he was all but a lock to start the season with the big club. Instead he had a poor camp and honestly looked very disengaged physically. So he was sent down. He was later recalled and hasn't gone back to the AHL since. He has had stretches where he looks better than others in this regard, but he really doesn't look to play physical (token bumps or fly by's vs hitting a guy) and tries to avoid physical play as best he can. He could stand to add more mass to his frame even at his current age. IMO he is what he is in this regard but hopefully one day this changes at least when playoff hockey returns to Buffalo.



I hear you, I'm a big guy, but I hate watching bigger players not utilize their advantage. Just separating a guy from a puck with a bump and being dogged on the puck would be great, it's not always about running guys through the boards.

He’ll likely be on a line with Greenway and Benson. One is a big guy who plays physical, the other is a little guy who wants to be a bull dog. So maybe some physicality will grow in him, but I’m with you, probably not. But it’s not what the Sabres got him for—though it would really make him a more well-rounded player

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Savoie tries to play bigger than he is, going to the slot/net, but that's in the WHL. In a small sample in Rochester he collected points but was scratched in playoff games. I think he projects as a mid-six winger that will play with speed and skill, but will be outmatched physically even though he'll try to get dirty. I can't say how he ranked among our other prospects but personally, I want a bigger roster a la FL, LA from years ago, TB. I don't think Savoie fits that type of team. I don't think McLeod does either though.

Thanks. I've always been of the opinion that smaller players need to have elite skills to make a top 6 impact in the NHL. Speed, shot, core strength, puck skills, etc. I like that it sounds like he's gritty as that's something that often times you either have or you don't. That said in the pro's the players are bigger and stronger so smaller guys need to learn to pick their spots to try and keep from being rocked often. What is his core strength like on the walls?

 

[HOOats]

At first I was like wtf but told myself to give it a minute I did and now I like the trade not much better out there available for trade if there was they still aren't as good defensively feels like he could fit with a number of players in a different role whether it's a shutdown checking role or a disrupting forechecker driving possession and I think there is more upside for offense on this team

Definitely an initial shock. But that's part of the fun of it all.

I had warmed up to Nicholas Roy in Vegas as the target, but McLeod is the exact same kind of trade. A young, kinda boring professional Canadian 3C who can snuff out minutes (and get Krebs out of the lineup).

The way I look at it, Adams found a witch that offered a magic potion to make Savoie four years older, five inches taller, a guaranteed C, and sacrifice a bunch of offensive skill/potential for defensive acumen.

 

[NotABadPeriod]

He’ll likely be on a line with Greenway and Benson. One is a big guy who plays physical, the other is a little guy who wants to be a bull dog. So maybe some physicality will grow in him, but I’m with you, probably not. But it’s not what the Sabres got him for—though it would really make him a more well-rounded player

I'm going to quibble with this some, mostly because the more I think about it, the less I'm sure what sort of combos Ruff will roll out. I could easily see him move guys around to balance the lineup.

A lot of us are assuming Peterka-Thompson-Tuch will be the top line because that's how they ended the season, but that was a Granato line, not a Ruff line. Lindy might decide to completely put the lines in a blender. I wouldn't be surprised if at various points during the season we see McLeod skate with Peterka, or Quinn, or maybe even play wing with Thompson.

 

[Deep Blue Metallic]

Is the rule still that you can extend someone once they're in the last year of their deal? If so:

What I'd like to see Adams do now is put Pegulas money where his mouth is. Get a long term extension done with McLeod. If he's really someone you think can be a cornerstone piece worth trading a blue chip prospect for, then give him a contract that indicates it. 5 X $4 million?

I'm pleased with the deal, but hopefully they wait 25 games or so to see how McLeod fits before committing $ and term.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Thanks. I've always been of the opinion that smaller players need to have elite skills to make a top 6 impact in the NHL. Speed, shot, core strength, puck skills, etc. I like that it sounds like he's gritty as that's something that often times you either have or you don't. That said in the pro's the players are bigger and stronger so smaller guys need to learn to pick their spots to try and keep from being rocked often. What is his core strength like on the walls?

He's got a strong lower body and lower center of gravity so his balance his very good, seems to be effective along the walls but again...mostly in the dub. Too little sample size in Rochester so it's a bit of a guess how he can compete in the minors or NHL.

 

[Dirty Dog]

I'm going to quibble with this some, mostly because the more I think about it, the less I'm sure what sort of combos Ruff will roll out. I could easily see him move guys around to balance the lineup.

A lot of us are assuming Peterka-Thompson-Tuch will be the top line because that's how they ended the season, but that was a Granato line, not a Ruff line. Lindy might decide to completely put the lines in a blender. I wouldn't be surprised if at various points during the season we see McLeod skate with Peterka, or Quinn, or maybe even play wing with Thompson.

Yea it’s a definite possibility. Though, between Tuch, Geeenway, Zucker, and even benson and cozens, the Sabres have physical/tenacity throughout the top 9.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

He’ll likely be on a line with Greenway and Benson. One is a big guy who plays physical, the other is a little guy who wants to be a bull dog. So maybe some physicality will grow in him, but I’m with you, probably not. But it’s not what the Sabres got him for—though it would really make him a more well-rounded player

IMO it's always a plus to have a guy like Greenway on a line with players that are or play small. He'll make sure that they are protected in scrums, etc. I think that it sounds like the makings of a good line. IMO McLeod earlier on in his career showed more passing ability than he did last season. He has a decent shot too when he looks to use it.

 

[Gabrielor]

Could you guys fill me in on Savoie? I haven't been following the drafts nearly as closely as I did in the 2010's. I know that he's from a town close to Edmonton and that we drafted his brother but recently didn't qualify him. I also know that he is on the smaller side and supposedly pretty fast. Is he gritty at all? Strengths and weaknesses?

I've seen probably 40-45 WHL games of Savoie.

Lightning fast acceleration. Pro-style shot. Goes to the net.

Admittedly, scores a lot of 'CHL points', also known as 'I doubt that's a goal/assist levels up', but that's common for just about every CHLer.

I'll miss him, but this kind of move was coming.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

He's got a strong lower body and lower center of gravity so his balance his very good, seems to be effective along the walls but again...mostly in the dub. Too little sample size in Rochester so it's a bit of a guess how he can compete in the minors or NHL.

Thanks, yeah as you say that's against his peers and kids younger than he is. The pro game is a whole different animal. The AHL gives you a pretty good idea of if that translates against men. I'm of the opinion that he likely starts in the AHL and may stay down there a year or longer. If he forces his way up to the big team given our depth that would mean that he's a legit player. My favorite part about this deal is that our current GM is looking towards infusing youth beyond this current 2 year window that we are going for it, this started with us trading into the first round this year to take O'Reilly. If we weren't all in right now we probably would've been patient with McLeod.

 

[HOOats]

Could you guys fill me in on Savoie? I haven't been following the drafts nearly as closely as I did in the 2010's. I know that he's from a town close to Edmonton and that we drafted his brother but recently didn't qualify him. I also know that he is on the smaller side and supposedly pretty fast. Is he gritty at all? Strengths and weaknesses?

Seen some underplaying of Savoie's upside. Size may eventually prevent him from playing the brave style that will be necessary to reach his full ceiling, but there's still an outside chance at a 1W imo.

Elite speed, stick-handling at speed through traffic, diverse shot package, very good vision, high-end compete, above average IQ, good stickwork. He's always had an impressive offensive package.

 

[Bryanbryoil]

Seen some underplaying of Savoie's upside. Size may eventually prevent him from playing the brave style that will be necessary to reach his full ceiling, but there's still an outside chance at a 1W imo.

Elite speed, stick-handling at speed through traffic, diverse shot package, very good vision, high-end compete, above average IQ, good stickwork. He's always had an impressive offensive package.

Thanks, he looks very skilled from what I've seen on youtube. Core strength IMO is huge for smaller players. If he has that and can stay healthy he should do well for us.

 

[RefsIdeas]

One thing I wonder about - at the 2023 deadline after not getting Chychrun, Adams said in regards to Kulich and Savoie “they’re Sabres”. In our minds he was untouchable.

What did Savoie do from then to now, to not only be untouchable, but traded for a third line center?

 

[MOGlLNY]

Thanks, he looks very skilled from what I've seen on youtube. Core strength IMO is huge for smaller players. If he has that and can stay healthy he should do well for us.

I'd say if things go well he's likely a 2W. More likely a middle 6 winger.

 

[Dubi Doo]

Well, that's not exactly true, Adams wanted Malenstyn specifically because of his speed. Look who they added, McLeod, NAK, Lafferty, Malenstyn, they also wanted Necas or Ehlers. These are all very fast players. So I'm not sure UFA had such a player. Malenstyn also hits a lot.

The Isled also didn't want to give him up. Adams ante'd up for a player he targeted. A price they couldn't refuse, and a price we can easily pay because we were dealing an asset we had a surplus of. We also got 2/3 of the best 4th line in the league because of that trade. No complaints here.

 

[yasky]

One thing I wonder about - at the 2023 deadline after not getting Chychrun, Adams said in regards to Kulich and Savoie “they’re Sabres”. In our minds he was untouchable.

What did Savoie do from then to now, to not only be untouchable, but traded for a third line center?

Lindy, Zach Benson leapfrogging him, Ostlund coming along better than anticipated, Rosen getting a GQ cover….. lots to speculate on here.

 

[Rowley Birkin]

Much of this thread is about the overpay to acquire McLeod. The overpay is directly connected to the huge roster hole left behind by the Byram/Mitts trade. What has subtly gone unnoticed and un-credited to my stance on all this - clearly I was right about that hole, and how Krebs was not the guy to take that roster spot. Why else would KA make this trade for McLeod with what the vast majority of the hockey world sees as a steep price in Savoie?

I came in to defend the trade, and the only way to defend it is to realize and reference the huge roster hole left after trading Mitts. The roster hole that many posters here defended with propping Krebs up to be a player he is not. It had to be filled, and the overpay of Savoie fairly well shows that. So I wasn't just inserting my opinion on that trade for the sake of it.

Your arguement seems to be based on the logic that Mitts/McLeod are like for like, interchangeable players. The reality is they clearly have different skill sets, Mitts skill set isn't something Adams wanted to invest in while McLeod is the type of player he coveted. In Adams mind, there was a hole which needed filling, no matter if he moved Mitts or not.

I'm sure he'd have moved Mitts for McLeod in the same deal if he was offered the opportunity. Hence why in my OP I made the point of looking at the pair of trades as Mitts vs McLeod & Byram vs Savoie.

 

[NotABadPeriod]

Your arguement seems to be based on the logic that Mitts/McLeod are like for like, interchangeable players. The reality is they clearly have different skill sets, Mitts skill set isn't something Adams wanted to invest in while McLeod is the type of player he coveted. In Adams mind, there was a hole which needed filling, no matter if he moved Mitts or not.

I'm sure he'd have moved Mitts for McLeod in the same deal if he was offered the opportunity. Hence why in my OP I made the point of looking at the pair of trades as Mitts vs McLeod & Byram vs Savoie.

Agree. The hole was caused by the fact that as a team we haven't done a good enough job of drafting and developing the bottom 6 players we need. Guys who provide defense, physicality, PK ability, faceoffs, etc.

We didn't have anyone like Malenstyn. So we had to overpay to get him.
We didn't have anyone like McLeod. So we had to overpay to get him.

In a perfect world, we'd have our own 24 year old versions of those guys graduating from Rochester to fill those roles. But we don't. And that's not just on Adams, it started with Botterill not being able to successfully draft those players as well.

Pekar busted. Davidsson busted. Asplund teased us, then busted. And we also didn't have enough of those kinds of lottery tickets, which forced us to bank on those guys panning out. Those are the guys that left the hole in the lineup. Any of those guys hit, they are filling a role on this roster and maybe we don't have to go out and get a McLeod.

 

[itwasaforwardpass]

View attachment 892854

This is the Costanza that came to my mind at the moment. Every time a fan sees a player traded away.