Rumor: Rumors & Proposals Thread | Lavoie Vs. Pederson Vs. Sutter Vs. Gagner Vs. Caggiula

[mkatcherin00]

Only so many Ekholms to go around I guess. But Nurse-Bouchard does make some sense to me, in that Nurse can get tunnel visioned into overshooting and trying to be an offensive defenceman he is not. So maybe an actual offensive defenceman on his pairing would help Nurse out, so he doesn’t waste shots and defers the offence to the better equipped Bouchard. That being said, it’s not ideal cause Bouchard playing top pair minutes is a risky prospect as his defending needs a lot of work. At the end of the day, Bouchard will need to figure out his shit in his own end. Our cup chances will largely hinge on his ability to do that as you are only as strong as your weakest link.

Speaking of Nurse and his positioning, I was thinking about him the other night watching K’Andre Millers defensive highlights. I swear at one point Nurse had a great stick check like Miller but I’m seeing it less and less as Nurses career goes on. Or maybe i imagined it how great it was back then in the first place. Man if Nurse could play defence like this though:

We usually just keep backing in and let guys waltz in on a red carpet

 

[MessierII]

Hopefully the veteran PTOs all sign league minimum one-way contracts and are agreeable to being sent to the minors if they don't make it out of camp.

This way they will still get paid if they find themselves in the AHL for any period of time and they'll still get paid if they are waived and another team claims them.

This would add depth to the organization and the players sent to Bakersfield could be called up at any date.

And I'll add this before someone else does, if they are in the minors for a certain period of time they'll have to be waived a second time to be recalled and play in the NHL.

Re entry waivers haven’t existed since 2013

 

[walktheboulavard]

15 games could easily mean the difference in home ice advantage in the playoffs.

If you get a young confident cost controlled top 4 dman out of it, it's worth the risk. At this point it doesn't matter were they finish in the regular season. Home or Away obstacles are abundant in playoffs, they're just going to have to overcome them like every previous champ before them.

 

[McDNicks17]

If you get a young confident cost controlled top 4 dman out of it, it's worth the risk. At this point it doesn't matter were they finish in the regular season. Home or Away obstacles are abundant in playoffs, they're just going to have to overcome them like every previous champ before them.

Sure, I just don't see any signs of that happening. Is there any reason to believe Ekholm unlocks Broberg like he did Bouchard other than them being Swedish?

To me, Broberg needs a Bouchard more than an Ekholm. He's shown basically zero puck skill in the NHL so far. He needs someone to do the heavy lifting with the puck while he does his best Ekholm impression.

 

[MessierII]

Sure, I just don't see any signs of that happening. Is there any reason to believe Ekholm unlocks Broberg like he did Bouchard other than them being Swedish?

To me, Broberg needs a Bouchard more than an Ekholm. He's shown basically zero puck skill in the NHL so far. He needs someone to do the heavy lifting with the puck while he does his best Ekholm impression.

Broberg can’t cover for Bouchard though. He’s just another inexperienced rushing D who will get caught out of position too much. That pairing would get torched.

 

[Broberg Speed]

Re entry waivers haven’t existed since 2013

all the better

Broberg can’t cover for Bouchard though. He’s just another inexperienced rushing D who will get caught out of position too much. That pairing would get torched.

Broberg may suck but he still does a bunch of hockey stuff better than Bouchard.

 

[McDNicks17]

Broberg can’t cover for Bouchard though. He’s just another inexperienced rushing D who will get caught out of position too much. That pairing would get torched.

I don’t mean Bouchard literally. Just someone with puck skills to play that role with him while he tries to become an Ekholm.

I think Broberg would bomb harder if you put him on a pairing with someone like an Ekholm and expect him to do a bunch of the puck moving.

 

[bobbythebrain]

Sure, I just don't see any signs of that happening. Is there any reason to believe Ekholm unlocks Broberg like he did Bouchard other than them being Swedish?

To me, Broberg needs a Bouchard more than an Ekholm. He's shown basically zero puck skill in the NHL so far. He needs someone to do the heavy lifting with the puck while he does his best Ekholm impression.

Disagree. He needs a vet to work him into the right spots, communicate positioning and switches. Bouch won't teach him that atm

Bro isn't gonna turn into an elite 2way dman but we can hope he does become a reliable top 4 who can skate with top players coming at him.

I've said from day 1 he looks nothing like his draft pedigree, and his skating hasn't stood out in the Nhl, but it isn't crap either.
I see him hopefully as a Toews where he can compliment Bouch in a few years

 

[walktheboulavard]

Sure, I just don't see any signs of that happening. Is there any reason to believe Ekholm unlocks Broberg like he did Bouchard other than them being Swedish?

To me, Broberg needs a Bouchard more than an Ekholm. He's shown basically zero puck skill in the NHL so far. He needs someone to do the heavy lifting with the puck while he does his best Ekholm impression.

That's disingenuous and exaggerated. His puck skills are fine, it's clearly a bit of confidence with the kid. It doesn't have to be Ekholm, but it seems that he's clearly invested the time to provide honest and real feed back when asked. And Ekholm has identified Broberg's short comings as exactly that (lack of confidence). It could be Nurse but we know that guy's going to be handling even tougher minutes.

 

[Broberg Speed]

Bouchard will never become a competent two-way defender either.

 

[McDNicks17]

That's disingenuous and exaggerated. His puck skills are fine, it's clearly a bit of confidence with the kid. It doesn't have to be Ekholm, but it seems that he's clearly invested the time to provide honest and real feed back when asked. And Ekholm has identified Broberg's short comings as exactly that (lack of confidence). It could be Nurse but we know that guy's going to be handling even tougher minutes.

I feel like the “confidence” thing is a bit of a kiss of death. You only really hear that when it’s a high pick not living up to their offensive potential.

 

[walktheboulavard]

I feel like the “confidence” thing is a bit of a kiss of death. You only really hear that when it’s a high pick not living up to their offensive potential.

It could be, but there's also cases were players improved play through garnering said confidence. The team has enough depth on d and runway to allow him to get ailments out of his game. It just doesn't make sense to me to discard 22 year old 8th overall pick dman without giving him a real opportunity.

 

[McDNicks17]

It could be, but there's also cases were players improved play through garnering said confidence. The team has enough depth on d and runway to allow him to get ailments out of his game. It just doesn't make sense to me to discard 22 year old 8th overall pick dman without giving him a real opportunity.

It seems really rare though. I can’t think of any Oilers examples that didn’t bust after hearing it about them. Might be a thing players have or they don’t.

I’m not saying to discard him. Just play him on the third pair on his natural side. I don’t think there’s any developmental bonus to throwing him into the deep end in the top4.

 

[Anarchism]

It could be, but there's also cases were players improved play through garnering said confidence. The team has enough depth on d and runway to allow him to get ailments out of his game. It just doesn't make sense to me to discard 22 year old 8th overall pick dman without giving him a real opportunity.

Its disappointing to be in the situation to realize your better off trading your top prospect rather than facing his value going to nothing.
We dont have depth on D. and no runway. Our Right side D...the whole league knows we got cratered there. The whole league knows to pick on Desi -- he might be able to overcome it with a quality vet there to share the load.
Thats who i would gamble on ...Desi....not Holland's reach that never was and quite possibly never will be.

 

[TheNumber4]

We usually just keep backing in and let guys waltz in on a red carpet

True. I always wondered why Gap Control seemed non existent with the Oilers. But it’s gotten better under Woody.

 

[TheNumber4]

Sure, I just don't see any signs of that happening. Is there any reason to believe Ekholm unlocks Broberg like he did Bouchard other than them being Swedish?

To me, Broberg needs a Bouchard more than an Ekholm. He's shown basically zero puck skill in the NHL so far. He needs someone to do the heavy lifting with the puck while he does his best Ekholm impression.

I get what you are saying, Stylistically this makes sense cause there’s not much offensive potential to unlock with Broberg and he should get used to being more of a shutdown type than a puck moving type.

I hate that we drafted this type of D-man in the Top 10 though. Much much higher ceiling should be expected when drafting in that range.

 

[SupremeTeam16]

And those minutes are going to be limited until Ekholm moves on or Broberg forces the issue.

The Oilers are no longer a team that's in the Klefbom/Petry situation that have no option but to throw those guys into the fire. The projection for Broberg this year and next is a bottom pairing defenseman with plenty of ability to shelter.

I don't see the outcome where he's demanding a significant increase in pay on his second contract unless he actually earns it.

People used to complain when the Oilers tossed prospects into the deep water right away now they complain when the team slow cooks guys and manages their minutes and competition appropriate to the players stage of development.

I think Broberg gives them some quality minutes this year and I wouldn’t be surprised to see them continue to develop his ability to play both sides.

 

[TheNumber4]

That's disingenuous and exaggerated. His puck skills are fine, it's clearly a bit of confidence with the kid. It doesn't have to be Ekholm, but it seems that he's clearly invested the time to provide honest and real feed back when asked. And Ekholm has identified Broberg's short comings as exactly that (lack of confidence). It could be Nurse but we know that guy's going to be handling even tougher minutes.

Brobergs lack of confidence is going to be a tough nut to crack. But to me, it makes sense if he doesn’t have it. He had one good tournament, he was being compared to the likes of Hedman, then he got torched and failed at the World Juniors when he was supposed to Swedens stud D-man and main leader, then he had some mediocre campaigns in the SHL where the coaches didn’t have much trust in him. His draft pedigree calling card, the “Broberg Speed” he barely shows flashes of. That’s like 3 or 4 years straight of downtrending and not much to be confident about. And now he still has to make it in the best league in the world and we have better players in front of him. For all these reasons I thought we should have cut bait and traded him while he still had some 1st round value, but sadly i think that boat has sailed.

 

[VainGretzky]

I expect the Oilers to make faster cuts this pre-season compared to the last ones The veterans were not in enough games for game shape it reminded me of Eakin's training camp to much emphasis on finding the 13th forward and 7th D man and the team was slow out of the gate, costing us 1st in the division and conference. I hope Woodcroft learned from that mistake, The season before Tippet had them all in game shape to start the season and the Oilers came out strong

 

[TheNumber4]

I expect the Oilers to make faster cuts this pre-season compared to the last ones The veterans were not in enough games for game shape it reminded me of Eakin's training camp to much emphasis on finding the 13th forward and 7th D man and the team was slow out of the gate, costing us 1st in the division and conference. I hope Woodcroft learned from that mistake, The season before Tippet had them all in game shape to start the season and the Oilers came out strong

The goal should be to win the Presidents trophy or atleast win the division this year. Not for bragging rights, but for the practice to be a consistent team for 82 games straight so that we’ll be better prepared for the Playoffs. So that we don’t make mistakes in the playoffs that we need to learn “lessons” from. Lesson time should be over when the playoffs start and this goes for everyone in the line up. Even young guys shouldn’t be excused from this, the Avs have/had plenty of young players that didn’t require more lessons when the playoffs started.

Getting off to a good start will be needed if we want to reach this goal, so if we can get our roster straight early that should help. Looking at our tryouts and prospects this year, I think we’ll be able to make a decision on them pretty quick. Although I wish we had some more potential in this by group, even long shots like Perlini would have been fun to follow in the preseason.

Also important for the Oilers will be to avoid the dreaded December slump/flu season. But is this even possible in Edmonton? I swear we should put the team in a bubble in November and every guy should be tested daily.

 

[walktheboulavard]

It seems really rare though. I can’t think of any Oilers examples that didn’t bust after hearing it about them. Might be a thing players have or they don’t.

I’m not saying to discard him. Just play him on the third pair on his natural side. I don’t think there’s any developmental bonus to throwing him into the deep end in the top4.

Not apposed to that as well, he's excelled in 3rd pairing playing with Bouch before Ekholm was acquired. Also nothing wrong with breathing a little confidence in your top prospect when you can afford it. Especially when he can be of value deep in the playoffs like you intend to be. All the ingredients for a solid 2 way dman are there, I'd rather roll the dice with him expecting a good return.

Its disappointing to be in the situation to realize your better off trading your top prospect rather than facing his value going to nothing.
We dont have depth on D. and no runway. Our Right side D...the whole league knows we got cratered there. The whole league knows to pick on Desi -- he might be able to overcome it with a quality vet there to share the load.
Thats who i would gamble on ...Desi....not Holland's reach that never was and quite possibly never will be.

He's better player than Desharnais bro. Love his story and what he brings but they're not same tier player. Vinny is a limited player, PK and clearing front of the net, that's the extent of his capability. No one trades 22 year old 6'3 dman that skates like the wind. I don't get, sure, if trade opportunity like Ekholm comes along I get it, but what's with this frantic impulse to jettison the kid.

 

[walktheboulavard]

Brobergs lack of confidence is going to be a tough nut to crack. But to me, it makes sense if he doesn’t have it. He had one good tournament, he was being compared to the likes of Hedman, then he got torched and failed at the World Juniors when he was supposed to Swedens stud D-man and main leader, then he had some mediocre campaigns in the SHL where the coaches didn’t have much trust in him. His draft pedigree calling card, the “Broberg Speed” he barely shows flashes of. That’s like 3 or 4 years straight of downtrending and not much to be confident about. And now he still has to make it in the best league in the world and we have better players in front of him. For all these reasons I thought we should have cut bait and traded him while he still had some 1st round value, but sadly i think that boat has sailed.

He did not get torched at WJC. He toyed with the competition and had like 3 points against Czechia (one of the best wjc teams of late) before getting injured.

 

[TheNumber4]

He did not get torched at WJC. He toyed with the competition and had like 3 points against Czechia (one of the best wjc teams of late) before getting injured.

I mean it’s the world juniors, Sweden is a power house team, some of those games border on exhibition with the talent disparity. I don’t think he did well against better teams, USA in particular toyed with him (bruised and battered him too if I remember)

 

[Anarchism]

Jack Campbell (retained 50 percent), Broberg, and Dustin Schwartzzzzz
To
LA for future considerations or Matt Roy (so the numbers work). LOL

 

[walktheboulavard]

I mean it’s the world juniors, Sweden is a power house team, some of those games border on exhibition with the talent disparity. I don’t think he did well against better teams, USA in particular toyed with him (bruised and battered him too if I remember)

Chzechia has been WJC power house as of late too, hardly a exhibition. Think he was injured going into the tournament already and exasperated through out the tournament. Holland was on record insinuating playing through injury was attribute he touted. Probably not the smartest path as it continued to affect him upon returning to SHL.