Rumor: Rumors & Proposals Thread | Does Bowman Make His Mark on the Team Before Training Camp?

[iCanada]

I completely disagree on this. I think Broberg's floor and ceiling are both higher, I especially think his ceiling is clearly higher than that of Holloway. It's not like I have any credibility as a scout so you may very well be right but I don't think it's very close.

At the end of the day what matters is what Bowman and Jackson see in both players.

I think you could be right on his ceiling, sure, but his floor to me is he doesn't even make the f***ing team... Which like...

Yeah. Idk. Just not good enough for 4.6 AAV on a contender man.

 

[GMofOilers]

Think they will have to walk away from Holloway too.

If you match even on Holloway it puts the team over the cap when Kane comes off the LTIR.

You can say "well then trade Kane", but that's going to be difficult at that point, he's going be looked at as damaged goods and teams are going to know the Oilers have to dump cap and will ask for the moon (probably a 1st round pick at least) because we have no choice. That and he has a NTC too, so he may not agree to even waive that.

Kulak or Ceci you could dump to accomodate Holloway's pay raise but since you've also walked from Klefbom that thins out the D considerably, I don't think that's an option.

Team will be fine next year, but this is an embarrassing kick in the ass to the front office, this level of management is not good enough, everyone in that front office needs to look in the mirror and be better. Basically the only thing they have to show for 9 years of drafting past McDavid is Bouchard and Skinner now, lucky for them Bouchard looks like a star.

The amount of cap mismanagement and wasted draft capital is really piss poor.

You can waive a Ryan or Perry and we have cap space for Holloway, when Kane comes back

 

[Soundwave]

With or without Broberg and Holloway, the Oilers have to trade Kane or/and Ceci/Kulak in a year

Because that money will go to Drai/Bouchard. It can't be going into Broberg so that's a non-starter.

Holloway just puts the Oilers in a bad spot this year.

I think they walk away from both of these players.

 

[SupremeTeam16]

Think they will have to walk away from Holloway too.

If you match even on Holloway puts the team over the cap when Kane comes off the LTIR.

You can say "well then trade Kane", but that's going to be difficult at that point, he's going be looked at as damaged goods and teams are going to know the Oilers have to dump cap and will ask for the moon (probably a 1st round pick at least) because we have no choice. That and he has a NTC too, so he may not agree to even waive that.

Kulak or Ceci you could dump to accomodate Holloway's pay raise but since you've also walked from Klefbom that thins out the D considerably, I don't think that's an option.

Not a big deal, these aren’t vital pieces to the teams immediate success, in fact at the matched cap hits they are a detriment.

In the immediate future they are still a better team then the one that almost won it all last year and with the extra picks and cap flexbiiity they’ll likely be able to improve the team more then what Holloway and Broberg would of at a combined 7M.

 

[Soundwave]

You can waive a Ryan or Perry and we have cap space for Holloway, when Kane comes back

The Oilers would be over the cap, we don't have the cap space to afford a 2+ contract.

 

[Macblender]

Think they will have to walk away from Holloway too.

If you match even on Holloway puts the team over the cap when Kane comes off the LTIR.

You can say "well then trade Kane", but that's going to be difficult at that point, he's going be looked at as damaged goods and teams are going to know the Oilers have to dump cap and will ask for the moon (probably a 1st round pick at least) because we have no choice. That and he has a NTC too, so he may not agree to even waive that.

Kulak or Ceci you could dump to accomodate Holloway's pay raise but since you've also walked from Klefbom that thins out the D considerably, I don't think that's an option.

Team will be fine next year, but this is an embarrassing kick in the ass to the front office, this level of management is not good enough, everyone in that front office needs to look in the mirror and be better. Basically the only thing they have to show for 9 years of drafting past McDavid is Bouchard and Skinner now, lucky for them Bouchard looks like a star.

The amount of cap mismanagement and wasted draft capital is really piss poor.

I agree with this since if Kane uses his NMC we have to trade someone else. If you dump Ceci or a kulak our D gets weaker to just keep Holloway at a position of strength.

I hate what his level of comp is for the offer sheet. But at the same time I look at a JVR or others still out there that may want a cup shot that could be very cheap who put up way more points than Holloway

 

[Soundwave]

Not a big deal, these aren’t vital pieces to the teams immediate success, in fact at the matched cap hits they are a detriment.

In the immediate future they are still a better team then the one that almost won it all last year and with the extra picks and cap flexbiiity they’ll likely be able to improve the team more then what Holloway and Broberg would of at a combined 7M.

In the short term maybe not, but with the loss of McLeod, Holloway, Foegele that's a lot of speed gone, with Broberg also out that's an embarrassment of a prospect pool.

It is what it is, but this management group better learn some hard lessons from this f*** up.

 

[GMofOilers]

The Oilers would be over the cap, we don't have the cap space to afford a 2+ contract.

Well not with a 23 man roster but why we need 23?

We have space man

 

[Behind Enemy Lines]

Friedman mentioned that Brobergs team didn’t want to sign in season and I’m sure Holloway thought the same. Given their inability to contribute enough to be full time players, they weren’t at risk of losing value on their second contract but there was upside to waiting to see if they could increase value.

The big mistake Jackson made was being too naive that he wouldn’t get shived in the back. If the players asks (1.2 and 1.8) are to be believed that means the players and team were less then 1M apart combined, if you can’t bridge the gap at that point then it’s probably time to start thinking that something is up and fling open the door to trade offers on both, at the very least that would of forced Armstrongs hand because if either gets traded to another team then his hand falls apart so he’d likely have to speed up his timeline.

I think both agents knew back at the beginning of July that these offers were coming and so they never would have let their clients sign for under 2M. The whole play is predicated on forcing the Oilers into the worse situation possible with no escape hatch which is why they had to wait 6 weeks to spring the trap. If either player signs at the numbers Friedman suggested was their ask, the whole plan falls apart.

I appreciate your post. But I don't see Jackson as some sort of innocent babe in the woods. He's a deeply experienced former agent used to leveraging the system for maximum value - see Connor Brown contract for example.

The traditional route with restricted free agents has been an ability to wait it out with no real threat of offer sheet. The Oilers however had 2 tantalizing young NHL players (who had both very uneven, I'd argue poor organization development which stunted their proving points with their abilities). Though both demonstrated in the toughest situation of deep NHL playoff conditions); negative cap room after blowing through free agency; and legitimate vulnerability with points 1 and 2. Timing with McDavid's wedding that included a celebratory Jackson might also not be coincidental within the hockey dog days of summer.

Now from all I have read and see Jeff Jackson is a meticulous planner and strategic thinking. I have to believe there's been contingency planning around the possibility of an offer sheet strike, so, here's hoping there is some formative thought that's already gone into how to proceed. In my mind it comes down to how the management and coaching staff assess Broberg's value and ability to meet the upper markers on his potential or not versus the unknown of a market replacement at that salary level, likely right shot, and more proven ability.

The Oilers got caught and all possible outcomes are now costly, whether financial or in loss of one or both of their critical under age 25 top NHL players.

 

[McTonyBrar]

Please bring back Broberg. We can't afford to lose him. I don't care what anyone says. He is very good and will be even better when he gets more NHL experience. I hope Bowman thinks of that when he makes his decision. I'll be ripped for this but I see Broberg as Ekholm 2.0 eventually

 

[Arpeggio]

I think it sucks that the Oilers might lose these guys, but I do think some people are overstating this impact of this move on next year's team.

We're losing a bottom pairing dman and a 3-4th line winger yes. These are not irreplaceable pieces for this season. Where this move really hurts is 3-4 years down the road, if both guys pan out.

I'm a little bit surprised about this board's reaction to losing Broberg. I felt like I was on an island in believing in him as a future impact player, and now we're talking about him as a significant loss. Holloway showed some flashes in the playoffs for sure, but both guys were really underwhelming during the regular seasons vs what our expectations were going into the year.

 

[Macblender]

Please bring back Broberg. We can't afford to lose him. I don't care what anyone says. He is very good and will be even better when he gets more NHL experience. I hope Bowman thinks of that when he makes his decision. I'll be ripped for this but I see Broberg as Ekholm 2.0 eventually

Does he increase our chances to win this year when it destroys deadline flexibility and we have to sell off a bigger piece that we may not control if Kane doesn’t waive his NMC?

I care about a cup more than Broberg, I really like the player but 4.6 is very very hard to fit without likely hurting the team significantly in other areas

 

[Soundwave]

Well not with a 23 man roster but why we need 23?

We have space man

Skinner (3) McDavid (12.5) Hyman (5.5)
RNH (5.125) Drai (8.5) Arvidsson (4)
Janmark (1.45) Henrique (3) Brown (1)
Kane (5.125) Ryan (1) Holloway (2.29)

Ekholm (6) Bouchard (3.9)
Nurse (9.25) Ceci (3.25)
Kulak (2.7) Stetcher (0.78)
Brown (1)

Skinner (2.6)
Pickard (1)

Brown Overage - 3.2
Neal Buyout - 1.9
Campbell Buyout - 1.1
Perry Overage - 300k(?)

= 89.52 million

That's above the cap even without carrying an extra forward. That's a 21 man roster. It doesn't work. It doesn't even work with a 20 man roster, lol.

To keep Holloway you have to basically trade Kane, but the cost of doing that is probably going to be a 1st since every team knows we are desperate and without that trade we'd be over the cap. Kulak/Ceci being dumped is a non-starter after already losing Klefbom.

 

[SupremeTeam16]

I'd suspect that in early July we didn't talk to the RFA because we were UFA hunting. The plan there is to spend the money so you can pressure your RFAs to settle for whatever is left.

I'd guess as soon as our spending spree was over, St.Louis was talking to Broberg already, probably directly and not just the agent. Half of getting an offer sheet like this is selling them on the opportunity and showing how important they would become to their new team

I could see a similar scenario playing out with Holloway. That was probably added on though. It would be pretty easy to talk Holloway into signing away from Edmonton after we made big signings at forward that blocked his path at advancement. Even adding Savoie might have made him wonder

The timing of the sheets is probably just as reported. It's just to remove our buyout window.

The entire play is built off offer sheeting both players at the point that inflicts maximum cal pain for minimum pick value and also doesn’t leave Edmonton with much of any easy options. If either player signs before they’re ready to offer sheet the whole plan falls apart. If Oilers sign Holloway at his 1.2 ask or Broberg at his 1.8 ask the plan is dead in the water. So Armstrong would have had to be on the same page with both agents about an offer sheet coming and what that number is going to be in order to ensure both players didn’t sign with Edmonton.

 

[GMofOilers]

Skinner (3) McDavid (12.5) Hyman (5.5)
RNH (5.125) Drai (8.5) Arvidsson (4)
Janmark (1.45) Henrique (3) Brown (1)
Kane (5.125) Ryan (1) Holloway (2.29)

Ekholm (6) Bouchard (3.9)
Nurse (9.25) Ceci (3.25)
Kulak (2.7) Stetcher (0.78)
Brown (1)

Skinner (2.6)
Pickard (1)

Brown Overage - 3.2
Neal Buyout - 1.9
Campbell Buyout - 1.1
Perry Overage - 300k(?)

= 89.52 million

That's above the cap even without carrying an extra forward. That's a 21 man roster. It doesn't work. It doesn't even work with a 20 man roster, lol.

To keep Holloway you have to basically trade Kane, but the cost of doing that is probably going to be a 1st since every team knows we are desperate and without that trade we'd be over the cap. Kulak/Ceci being dumped is a non-starter after already losing Klefbom.

Like I said lots of room in a couple months to make it happen

 

[Soundwave]

Like I said lots of room in a couple months to make it happen

From what?

The only way you get cap space is to trade Kane, now lets realistically look at that, he has multiple years left on a 5+ million deal and will be coming off surgery where he hasn't looked good for a while.

The ask to move him is going to be a 1st round pick because other teams aren't stupid and can see without them helping us out we'll be over the cap, so they have all the leverage.

Dylan Holloway isn't worth all that.

 

[Soundwave]

Gonna have to find younger, faster bottom 6ers than Perry and Ryan at some point in-season, those two can't be playoff regulars.

 

[Soundwave]

If Barrie is willing to take like 1 year x 1 mill, I think they will sign Barrie. Maybe they can tack on some performance bonuses.

 

[oXo Cube]

If Barrie is willing to take like 1 year x 1 mill, I think they will sign Barrie. Maybe they can tack on some performance bonuses.

Could be wrong but I don't think Barrie is eligible for a bonus contract being under 35 and not coming off of a significant injury.

But either way I'd have some interest. We know he's a fit here, is a popular guy with the core group, and the 2nd PP unit that really should get more minutes this year could use a real QB. Seems like a smart camp tryout option.

 

[Soundwave]

Could be wrong but I don't think Barrie is eligible for a bonus contract being under 35 and not coming off of a significant injury.

But either way I'd have some interest. We know he's a fit here, is a popular guy with the core group, and the 2nd PP unit that really should get more minutes this year could use a real QB. Seems like a smart camp tryout option.

Man his offense really fell off a cliff in Nashville. He really liked being here and his wife is close to a lot of the other Oiler wifeys too.

As a stop gap option, sure why not I guess but it basically can't be for more than 1 mill.

 

[Zerotonine]

How's everyone liking that perry deal now??? Lol

 

[Soundwave]

How's everyone liking that perry deal now??? Lol

I don't think it impacted the situation much to be honest. It's not like without Perry we'd have been able to offer 1.8.

The 3+ mill in dead cap from Brown's overage and 1.1 mill in dead cap additional from Campbell, sure those basically did it.

 

[Oilhawks]

How's everyone liking that perry deal now??? Lol

It’s buriable. It literally has 0 impact on these two going for the bag on a bubble team

 

[McBooya42]

Please bring back Broberg. We can't afford to lose him. I don't care what anyone says. He is very good and will be even better when he gets more NHL experience. I hope Bowman thinks of that when he makes his decision. I'll be ripped for this but I see Broberg as Ekholm 2.0 eventually

We can't afford to keep him.

 

[Zerotonine]

I don't think it impacted the situation much to be honest. It's not like without Perry we'd have been able to offer 1.8.

The 3+ mill in dead cap from Brown's overage and 1.1 mill in dead cap additional from Campbell, sure those basically did it.

In all fairness browm some what made up some of that 3 million dead cap space by signing for 1 million. Easily made up for most of it and maybe then some of he continues to play like he did in the playoffs....