Snapping easily seen, easily stopped shots from the point isn't going to make NHL defenses respect anything. They need someone net front and they don't have that guy. OR they need to get better movement to get some back-post options open so that they are at least around the net at times rather than just sitting on the flanker one-timers. Or both.
Roster Thread (2023-2024 Season)
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Snapping easily seen, easily stopped shots from the point isn't going to make NHL defenses respect anything. They need someone net front and they don't have that guy. OR they need to get better movement to get some back-post options open so that they are at least around the net at times rather than just sitting on the flanker one-timers. Or both.
So, I have an interesting thought:
I've long been riding Adams for the lack of veteran presence in the room. But, I think there is one thing that should be said: Some of the veterans are not good examples for a young team.
Okposo and Girgensons certainly tick the 'old timey' example of what you want a veteran to be.
However, I am very curious about Skinner. This summer is probably the 1st reasonable window to buy him out.
You are going to have to take your medicine on it, especially in year 3. But, the hope is by then than the cap will have risen enough to offset that kind of dead weight.
In a vacuum, let's just say:
Buyout Skinner, Let Oloffson walk
That puts your lineup at:
XXXX-Thompons-Tuch
Peterka-Cozens-Quinn
Benson-XXXXX-Kulich/Rosen
Greenway-XXXX-XXXXX
I'm also under the thought you flip one (or both) of Krebs/Mittelstadt to truly remake the forward group. I'd like to get one truly dynamic winger in here as well as a legit middle six two way center.
I've long been riding Adams for the lack of veteran presence in the room. But, I think there is one thing that should be said: Some of the veterans are not good examples for a young team.
Okposo and Girgensons certainly tick the 'old timey' example of what you want a veteran to be.
However, I am very curious about Skinner. This summer is probably the 1st reasonable window to buy him out.
You are going to have to take your medicine on it, especially in year 3. But, the hope is by then than the cap will have risen enough to offset that kind of dead weight.
In a vacuum, let's just say:
Buyout Skinner, Let Oloffson walk
That puts your lineup at:
XXXX-Thompons-Tuch
Peterka-Cozens-Quinn
Benson-XXXXX-Kulich/Rosen
Greenway-XXXX-XXXXX
I'm also under the thought you flip one (or both) of Krebs/Mittelstadt to truly remake the forward group. I'd like to get one truly dynamic winger in here as well as a legit middle six two way center.
I dont see how you can sell a buyout on him if the puts up another 30 goal season and likely ends up top 5 on the team in points. Any potential crunch of the cap would be in his last two years, as it sits right now they project to have 25mil in cap to sign RFA and UFA next season.So, I have an interesting thought:
I've long been riding Adams for the lack of veteran presence in the room. But, I think there is one thing that should be said: Some of the veterans are not good examples for a young team.
Okposo and Girgensons certainly tick the 'old timey' example of what you want a veteran to be.
However, I am very curious about Skinner. This summer is probably the 1st reasonable window to buy him out.
You are going to have to take your medicine on it, especially in year 3. But, the hope is by then than the cap will have risen enough to offset that kind of dead weight.
In a vacuum, let's just say:
Buyout Skinner, Let Oloffson walk
That puts your lineup at:
XXXX-Thompons-Tuch
Peterka-Cozens-Quinn
Benson-XXXXX-Kulich/Rosen
Greenway-XXXX-XXXXX
I'm also under the thought you flip one (or both) of Krebs/Mittelstadt to truly remake the forward group. I'd like to get one truly dynamic winger in here as well as a legit middle six two way center.
Beerz
Registered User
- Jun 28, 2011
- 37,831
- 14,759
No thanksSo, I have an interesting thought:
I've long been riding Adams for the lack of veteran presence in the room. But, I think there is one thing that should be said: Some of the veterans are not good examples for a young team.
Okposo and Girgensons certainly tick the 'old timey' example of what you want a veteran to be.
However, I am very curious about Skinner. This summer is probably the 1st reasonable window to buy him out.
You are going to have to take your medicine on it, especially in year 3. But, the hope is by then than the cap will have risen enough to offset that kind of dead weight.
In a vacuum, let's just say:
Buyout Skinner, Let Oloffson walk
That puts your lineup at:
XXXX-Thompons-Tuch
Peterka-Cozens-Quinn
Benson-XXXXX-Kulich/Rosen
Greenway-XXXX-XXXXX
I'm also under the thought you flip one (or both) of Krebs/Mittelstadt to truly remake the forward group. I'd like to get one truly dynamic winger in here as well as a legit middle six two way center.
chi777
Registered User
- Feb 23, 2006
- 1,553
- 379
So, I have an interesting thought:
I've long been riding Adams for the lack of veteran presence in the room. But, I think there is one thing that should be said: Some of the veterans are not good examples for a young team.
Okposo and Girgensons certainly tick the 'old timey' example of what you want a veteran to be.
However, I am very curious about Skinner. This summer is probably the 1st reasonable window to buy him out.
You are going to have to take your medicine on it, especially in year 3. But, the hope is by then than the cap will have risen enough to offset that kind of dead weight.
In a vacuum, let's just say:
Buyout Skinner, Let Oloffson walk
That puts your lineup at:
XXXX-Thompons-Tuch
Peterka-Cozens-Quinn
Benson-XXXXX-Kulich/Rosen
Greenway-XXXX-XXXXX
I'm also under the thought you flip one (or both) of Krebs/Mittelstadt to truly remake the forward group. I'd like to get one truly dynamic winger in here as well as a legit middle six two way center.
YES!!!
Either Quinn or Peterka could take his spot on the top line and would probably put up similar or better numbers. While also playing a more balanced and less selfish game.
We have huge cap savings the first year, the next 2 would cost $4mil, and after that the penatly is less than $2mil a year. Very manageable.
Skinner is too one dimensional and too expensive and too lazy to keep. He's also taking a valuable roster spot that should be going to our up and coming talent. I think Quinn or Peterka could make much better use of 1st line ice time than Jeff Skinner.
We can use that cap space to try and land someone with skills we don't currently posses. Such as someone skilled at crashing the net or a 2-way center that can win a faceoff.
Skinner was a top offensive player for the Canes when they tricked us into taking him off their hands. We gave them a pile of useless scraps that never even played for them and they've been a better team ever since. I dont see that as a coincidence.
So, I have an interesting thought:
I've long been riding Adams for the lack of veteran presence in the room. But, I think there is one thing that should be said: Some of the veterans are not good examples for a young team.
Okposo and Girgensons certainly tick the 'old timey' example of what you want a veteran to be.
However, I am very curious about Skinner. This summer is probably the 1st reasonable window to buy him out.
You are going to have to take your medicine on it, especially in year 3. But, the hope is by then than the cap will have risen enough to offset that kind of dead weight.
In a vacuum, let's just say:
Buyout Skinner, Let Oloffson walk
That puts your lineup at:
XXXX-Thompons-Tuch
Peterka-Cozens-Quinn
Benson-XXXXX-Kulich/Rosen
Greenway-XXXX-XXXXX
I'm also under the thought you flip one (or both) of Krebs/Mittelstadt to truly remake the forward group. I'd like to get one truly dynamic winger in here as well as a legit middle six two way center.
Skinner draws a ton of penalties. If the Sabres power play was even half way decent, Skinner's value would be much higher.
While Skinner's defensive acumen on the ice doesn't make him a role model, he is not a problem in the dressing room and is not a bad vet to have around.
A buyout this summer puts the club on the hook for a 6 year caphit. Unless they really need cap badly next summer, I think they are much better off keeping him and then revisiting the idea in 2025.
Ace
Registered User
- Oct 29, 2015
- 26,522
- 33,437
I’m still fascinated by what the plan is. They show you every night they need a new 4th line and more competitive guys. They have damn near another half dozen high pick skill forwards coming.
They need to do a lot of work to acquire the things they need…and their assets are almost all the opposite.
They need to do a lot of work to acquire the things they need…and their assets are almost all the opposite.
The plan is playoffs next year as long as GM and coach are unfireable which is the case this season.
Ace
Registered User
- Oct 29, 2015
- 26,522
- 33,437
I’d LOVE to see how you think Adams is going to field a playoff lineup with this mess. They’ll bring in some rookies…have no answer in goal…and need a whole new bottom six. Not to mention that top 4 D they STILL need.
They’re no closer than the day he took over.
HaNotsri
Regstred User
- Dec 29, 2013
- 9,013
- 6,875
What hurts is that they might not make the playoffs on the first serious try. This is another year where you'd need miracle coaching and pretty much every player having career years. I wouldn't consider this a playoff attempt.
You can try and fail but this isn't even up to the level of trying.
To me it looks like Adams think making the playoffs is a process that can be iterated upon endlessly. In the meantime elcs end, players pass their prime, coaches lose their mojo and fans find new, more rewarding, hobbies.
Most non-tanking teams treat the season as a project that you try to optimize in order to reward the owner, team and fans. They live in a reality where a year is important in itself, not an endless cycle to be repeated like the myth of sisyphus.
I'd explore what it would take to add Backlund&Andersson. Would have to take Markstrom as well I reckon. Is Cozens on the table? Would need to move some serious salary the other way.
Cozens
Clifton
Comrie
UPL
Markstrom
Backlund
Andersson
Vladar
It's just a crazy 3am idea dont beat me up
Skinner - Thompson - Tuch
Peterka - Mitts - Quinn
Benson - Backlund - Greenway
Jost - Krebs - Robinson
Girgs/KO
Dahlin - Andersson
Power - Joker
Sammy - EJ
RJ/Bryson
Levi
Markstrom
Vladar
VO half retained to somewhere for a pick
Cozens
Clifton
Comrie
UPL
Markstrom
Backlund
Andersson
Vladar
It's just a crazy 3am idea dont beat me up
Skinner - Thompson - Tuch
Peterka - Mitts - Quinn
Benson - Backlund - Greenway
Jost - Krebs - Robinson
Girgs/KO
Dahlin - Andersson
Power - Joker
Sammy - EJ
RJ/Bryson
Levi
Markstrom
Vladar
VO half retained to somewhere for a pick
Last edited:
toddkaz
Registered User
- Nov 25, 2022
- 7,628
- 4,911
sabremike
Kemonito superfan
Yes. At some point jobs are on the line and the plan will change. I think that will be the case next off season. Sadly KA and Donny are fully protected regardless of the results of this season.
It doesn't matter much what roster moves are made as long as Granato chooses to go from unstructured river hockey to a completely passive defensive game that gets cratered in the first ten minutes.
At least last year they could go toe-to-toe with scoring goals. Now they sit back and get shelled, with no jump up ice to use their offensive instincts. Granato has neutered the best aspect of his roster while being unable to implement a structure that they can handle.
At least last year they could go toe-to-toe with scoring goals. Now they sit back and get shelled, with no jump up ice to use their offensive instincts. Granato has neutered the best aspect of his roster while being unable to implement a structure that they can handle.
toddkaz
Registered User
- Nov 25, 2022
- 7,628
- 4,911
I think someone posted before, Buffalo is last place in shots with front net presence.
Probably one of the reasons the PP is so bad.
joshjull
Registered User
You’re crazy for hating Novikov enough to want him to play here right now.
Last edited:
Their plan is, quite literally, ‘everyone gets a little better everyday’. Adams’s has even said so. After that I really don’t think there isn't one other than "Get draft picks, use draft picks"
He's let the coach drive the "major" acquisitions (Greenway and Clifton are USHL kids). There's no grand architecture or system. Culture fit is more important than system fit (the only real system fit they seem to have is good skating with an emphasis on offensive creativity). I mean...this has always been the problem. It's the blind leading the blind. No one has the experience or cachet to say "This is how we need to do things, these are our guiding principals, and this is how we get from here to contention. We need to fill these roles to play this system, this what our ideal roster looks like"
Adams tenure has been a budget driven under the guise of being 'culture first'. They've tried to emulate the bills front office without having the underlying competence in architecture or even hockey knowledge. Say what you will about McDermott/Beane, he knows what kind of players are needed to play his defense. It's why despite waves of injuries, the defense looks mostly competent still. There is a wave of the right 'types' of players on the practice squad.
Until we get competence at the top, competence on the ice will always be far away. There will be years like last year where everything falls in to place and maybe we make the playoffs. But sustained success isn't happening under this front office. It simply doesn't have the basic competency needed to build a team that matches into a disciplined system.
Let Adams be the director of Vibes and telling fans what they want to hear, get some people with a real resume and history in here to do the real work.
Olofsson scored 30 goals last year and most fans recognized that they needed to move on from him.
Skinner is part of the issue here. It's not a coincidence he's never made the playoffs in a long NHL career. To be successful, he has to get the premium offensive minutes. If he gets the premium offensive minutes, the team isn't going to be successful because of how bad he is in his own zone. He can't play down the lineup where his bad defensive impacts are lessoned, or he pouts and becomes a black hole of suck. He either has to accept a lessor role without pouting or he's gotta go. Period.
Skinner's buyout isn't that bad at this point. Next year it's minimimal, followed by 4.4M and 6.4M. Then 3 years at 2.4M. In those 3 years, the cap should be 90M+.
It's time to start making significant changes here. We know who skinner is. He's not going to put us over the top. Not sure why we are even having this discussion. At the end of the year, he's been here for 6 years of the 13 year drought. He's not part of the solution. Lets take our medicine, clear the roster spot, and start actually building a roster than can win, not just score a bunch of goals.
Youngest team in the league, everyone keeps getting hurt, inconsistent goaltending, over performed last year. Recipe for having unrealistic expectations. Mitts is gone next year, as is Olofsson. Mitts will have high trade value as an RFA to trade at the deadline. Some teams will need to give up on their season/build and you can use Mitts+ to acquire a big piece on forward.
Quinn Thompson Peterka
Benson XXX/Cozens Tuch
Skinner XXX/Cozens Greenway
Robinson XXX XXX
Lets say Mitts goes as part of package for another top 6C. I still think Cozens will eventually turn it around. He always has 20ish game cold streaks which is wild. Sprinkle in a few 4th liners. Greenway is probably a 4th line player if we want to really compete.
Skinner and greenway will likely be placed by Savoie/Kulich/Rosen in two or 3 years. Long term outlook on team:
Quinn Thompson Peterka
Benson XXX/Cozens Savoie
Kulich XXX/Cozens Tuch
Robinson XXX XXX
Dahlin Samuelsson
Power Johnson
XXX Joker
I expect minimal changes on D. Need players who tilt the ice and play aggressive consistently.
Quinn Thompson Peterka
Benson XXX/Cozens Tuch
Skinner XXX/Cozens Greenway
Robinson XXX XXX
Lets say Mitts goes as part of package for another top 6C. I still think Cozens will eventually turn it around. He always has 20ish game cold streaks which is wild. Sprinkle in a few 4th liners. Greenway is probably a 4th line player if we want to really compete.
Skinner and greenway will likely be placed by Savoie/Kulich/Rosen in two or 3 years. Long term outlook on team:
Quinn Thompson Peterka
Benson XXX/Cozens Savoie
Kulich XXX/Cozens Tuch
Robinson XXX XXX
Dahlin Samuelsson
Power Johnson
XXX Joker
I expect minimal changes on D. Need players who tilt the ice and play aggressive consistently.
joshjull
Registered User
I see your anti Mitts crusade is still in full swing.
- Feb 3, 2015
- 4,910
- 4,703
I think a vet who plays a selfish 1 way game, is un-coachable and is as happy as a golden retriever puppy win or lose, is not a good vet to have around.
He plays a losing brand of hockey and has zero interest in changing. He's the player embodiment of "losing culture".
This team baffles me. To me talent is there
Problems that I see
- goals that Sabres get seem to be individual effort and freestyle passing. I do not see evidence of organization or set plays
- back checking in ozone ineffective for the most part. Other team seem to zoom up ice. Best for checkers in ozone are skinner, , benson , tuch and Thompson. Others going through motions and ineffective
-defensive structure seems to create openings for other team
- power play horrible. Better to use their 5 vs 5 offense then what is there now
- home ice ineptitude baffles me. Home teams have advantage of picking the the lines last to get matchup advantages but Sabres don’t see results of that
I do not and have never understood the love for the Sabres fourth lines. To me, they have been nothing special. Get rid of them all and replace with a big boy line. Use Robinson, Krebs and Murray.
Thompson Samuelson and Dahlin seem to be playing hurt.
Joker has been our best dman. Power is learning to play. Clifton and eJohnson good third pair quality. Ryan Johnson looks very good.
To be better we need to add some size to third and fourth lines to make the other team worries about getting hit.sabres don’t have that and other teams can go Harlem globetrotting on them
Problems that I see
- goals that Sabres get seem to be individual effort and freestyle passing. I do not see evidence of organization or set plays
- back checking in ozone ineffective for the most part. Other team seem to zoom up ice. Best for checkers in ozone are skinner, , benson , tuch and Thompson. Others going through motions and ineffective
-defensive structure seems to create openings for other team
- power play horrible. Better to use their 5 vs 5 offense then what is there now
- home ice ineptitude baffles me. Home teams have advantage of picking the the lines last to get matchup advantages but Sabres don’t see results of that
I do not and have never understood the love for the Sabres fourth lines. To me, they have been nothing special. Get rid of them all and replace with a big boy line. Use Robinson, Krebs and Murray.
Thompson Samuelson and Dahlin seem to be playing hurt.
Joker has been our best dman. Power is learning to play. Clifton and eJohnson good third pair quality. Ryan Johnson looks very good.
To be better we need to add some size to third and fourth lines to make the other team worries about getting hit.sabres don’t have that and other teams can go Harlem globetrotting on them
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