Roster Thread (2023-2024 Season)

[joshjull]

It doesn't matter much what roster moves are made as long as Granato chooses to go from unstructured river hockey to a completely passive defensive game that gets cratered in the first ten minutes.

At least last year they could go toe-to-toe with scoring goals. Now they sit back and get shelled, with no jump up ice to use their offensive instincts. Granato has neutered the best aspect of his roster while being unable to implement a structure that they can handle.

Thats not whats going on.

The first period last night is an example of the issue. Granted it’s on the more extreme end. Their issue has been trying to force pretty aggressive offense when it isn’t there. Instead of just grinding out chances until things open up. Last night they were constantly cheating for offense in the first period, with bombs away passes and HUGE gaps between the dman and forwards. They’re weren’t sitting back at all.

Playing like this led to a ton of odd man rushes against, as it has all season long. Teams that sit back in defense shells don’t surrender a ton of odd man rushes like we do.

Playing like that was spectacularly stupid against a team like the Avs with their speed and counter attacking capabilities. Then continue to do it while they’re getting torched for it was amazing to watch. Like they thought, “this time the fire won’t burn me”

 

[nickdawg95]

go out and get Breube quenneville maybe ROY ?

someone with a little structure

 

[Beerz]

It doesn't matter much what roster moves are made as long as Granato chooses to go from unstructured river hockey to a completely passive defensive game that gets cratered in the first ten minutes.

At least last year they could go toe-to-toe with scoring goals. Now they sit back and get shelled, with no jump up ice to use their offensive instincts. Granato has neutered the best aspect of his roster while being unable to implement a structure that they can handle.

There is a Stanley Cup Champion coach freshly available

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

Thats not whats going on.

The first period last night is an example of the issue. Granted it’s on the more extreme end. Their issue has been trying to force pretty aggressive offense when it isn’t there. Instead of just grinding out chances until things open up. Last night they were constantly cheating for offense in the first period, with bombs away passes and HUGE gaps between the dman and forwards.

Playing like this led to a ton of odd man rushes against, as it has all season long. Teams that sit back in defense shells don’t surrender a ton of odd man rushes like we do.

Playing like that was spectacularly stupid against a team like the Avs with their speed and counter attacking capabilities.

I'll give you that because I just watched highlights, but I saw examples of both. The part where I say they get shelled is how they so easily/passivley give up their blue line. Then after teams establish possession in the Sabres zone, they play incredibly passive. They hardly ever put pressure on the D-man when they have the puck, don't play their man very aggressively/physically lower in the zone, and make weak clearing attempts when they have the chance.

I remember under Ruff they would have three guys getting the puck back and playing a tiny three man passing game up from D-zone through the neutral zone. These days (like you say) there's an ocean of ice between D and FW. Either way despite the faults in the roster, it still comes down to coaching and accountability. I don't see any of that anywhere.

 

[OkimLom]

There is a Stanley Cup Champion coach freshly available

Unfortunately, by the time we get around deciding what to do with the coach, and possibly firing him, said coach will probably have a new job somewhere.

 

[May Day 10]

This season is almost lost. They need to go 32-15-5 the rest of the way and they have managed to win consecutive times once in 30 games.

They arent making any major moves like firing a coach because ownership wants communication, family, wanting to be here, and being comfortable more than anything else. It is a disaster and this thing isn't magically going to correct itself.

 

[Sabresfansince1980]

This season is almost lost. They need to go 32-15-5 the rest of the way and they have managed to win consecutive times once in 30 games.

They arent making any major moves like firing a coach because ownership wants communication, family, wanting to be here, and being comfortable more than anything else. It is a disaster and this thing isn't magically going to correct itself.

I was fooled because I thought Granato was a better coach, and could up the level of urgency (given the hollow talk about expectations during the summer). Fooled again...like Charlie Brown.

 

[Caroline Says ll]

Thats not whats going on.

The first period last night is an example of the issue. Granted it’s on the more extreme end. Their issue has been trying to force pretty aggressive offense when it isn’t there. Instead of just grinding out chances until things open up. Last night they were constantly cheating for offense in the first period, with bombs away passes and HUGE gaps between the dman and forwards. They’re weren’t sitting back at all.

Playing like this led to a ton of odd man rushes against, as it has all season long. Teams that sit back in defense shells don’t surrender a ton of odd man rushes like we do.

Playing like that was spectacularly stupid against a team like the Avs with their speed and counter attacking capabilities. Then continue to do it while they’re getting torched for it was amazing to watch. Like they thought, “this time the fire won’t burn me”

I honestly question how much video and prep the staff is doing on each opponent. Even what worked well against the AVS in the first game we played this season was thrown out.

There are stressors we still have not adapted to. Our players still aren't positioning themselves in support of heavy pressure. Breakouts and zone entries remain a struggle. These are all coaching issues.

There are system coaches with cup and playoff and success resumes that are currently free and available. My dream is Claude Julien.

 

[OkimLom]

I honestly question how much video and prep the staff is doing on each opponent. Even what worked well against the AVS in the first game we played this season was thrown out.

There are stressors we still have not adapted to. Our players still aren't positioning themselves in support of heavy pressure. Breakouts and zone entries remain a struggle. These are all coaching issues.

There are system coaches with cup and playoff and success resumes that are currently free and available. My dream is Claude Julien.

Watching a ton of Avalanche games, I can say that the 1st Avs game in Buffalo was more of a result of the Avalanche players not getting up for the game more than the Sabres making things difficult for them. Mackinnon seemed to be sleep walking through the whole game. He looked like he was playing at maybe 60% effort, and his teammates were following the same. Now Buffalo needed to do their part and take advantage of that, and they did, but it honestly didn't feel like a game that they did anything different than other games.

I almost want to call the Buffalo Sabres the Ricky Bobbys, because this organization seems to be that movie personified. There are games where they go fast and they have success. Other times, they look like they don't know what to do with their hands. And then there are the games where they think they are on fire...And the fans are over on the side reenacting the Knife scene.

 

[DeletedUser539]

I'll give you that because I just watched highlights, but I saw examples of both. The part where I say they get shelled is how they so easily/passivley give up their blue line. Then after teams establish possession in the Sabres zone, they play incredibly passive. They hardly ever put pressure on the D-man when they have the puck, don't play their man very aggressively/physically lower in the zone, and make weak clearing attempts when they have the chance.

I remember under Ruff they would have three guys getting the puck back and playing a tiny three man passing game up from D-zone through the neutral zone. These days (like you say) there's an ocean of ice between D and FW. Either way despite the faults in the roster, it still comes down to coaching and accountability. I don't see any of that anywhere.

Everytime we try to break it in its either a solo effort or a pass to someone waiting at the blueline with no momentum or forced passes through the neutral zone with time and space that gets picked u understand pushing the pace but a more methodical approach could be more beneficial along with neutral zone movement like some swings and when swinging always go behind the puck carrier we need more east west than north south since forcing the latter isn't working

 

[TageGod]

I see your anti Mitts crusade is still in full swing.

Take off your glasses, would you like another 7x7 dished out? I don't. I specifically said he would hold a lot of value. Btw, he has been awful in 3 straight games. Turnover machine and possession killer constantly. His is not in early season form anymore.

 

[Beerz]

 

[joshjull]

Take off your glasses, would you like another 7x7 dished out? I don't. I specifically said he would hold a lot of value. Btw, he has been awful in 3 straight games. Turnover machine and possession killer constantly. His is not in early season form anymore.

If I take off my glasses, I won’t be able to read your hot takes. I’m old you know.

 

[joshjull]

Watching a ton of Avalanche games, I can say that the 1st Avs game in Buffalo was more of a result of the Avalanche players not getting up for the game more than the Sabres making things difficult for them. Mackinnon seemed to be sleep walking through the whole game. He looked like he was playing at maybe 60% effort, and his teammates were following the same. Now Buffalo needed to do their part and take advantage of that, and they did, but it honestly didn't feel like a game that they did anything different than other games.

I almost want to call the Buffalo Sabres the Ricky Bobbys, because this organization seems to be that movie personified. There are games where they go fast and they have success. Other times, they look like they don't know what to do with their hands. And then there are the games where they think they are on fire...And the fans are over on the side reenacting the Knife scene.

One key difference. Ricky Bobby won a lot. The Sabres not so much.

But I like the idea of placing each player in a car with a feral cougar

 

[Der Jaeger]

The good news in all of what's going on with the Sabres is that the organization is in really good shape. Many people could come in and do some great things.

- Scouting staff, with a GM who listens, has racked up draft wins. The organizational pipeline is stacked.
- The Sabres are drafting well outside of round 1.
- The team has multiple blue chip prospects in the organization at various stages of development.
- The Sabres have a full set of draft picks for the next 3 years.
- The active roster is the youngest in the league and full of great young players.
- The team has 2 blue chip talents in Thompson and Dahlin.
- Players left for dead in previous years are making turnarounds or have already turned around (Thompson, Dahlin, Mittelstadt in previous seasons, Jokiharju this season). And Skinner has returned to form so his contract isn't a true albatross.
- The Sabres cap situation is incredible, with Thompson, Cozens, and Samuelsson on great deals. Dahlin is on a good deal, and Power's deal could be a steal.
- Levi is a potential franchise goalie and UPL hasn't been a train wreck.

If Pegula fired Adams and Granato tomorrow, the new GM and head coach are walking into the best situation in the league. It's not kinetic energy yet, still potential. But the Sabres are one of the only teams in the league who could trade for a player like McDavid and still have a really good team left over, just as an example.

The question is: do we really want the change or just stay the course? Regier left Murray a full cupboard and he pissed everything into the wind. Is everyone willing to take that chance?

 

[OkimLom]

One key difference. Ricky Bobby won a lot. The Sabres not so much.

But I like the idea of placing each player in a car with a feral cougar

The winning happened last year...

And I'm up for anything to get this team corrected.

 

[OkimLom]

The good news in all of what's going on with the Sabres is that the organization is in really good shape. Many people could come in and do some great things.

- Scouting staff, with a GM who listens, has racked up draft wins. The organizational pipeline is stacked.
- The Sabres are drafting well outside of round 1.
- The team has multiple blue chip prospects in the organization at various stages of development.
- The Sabres have a full set of draft picks for the next 3 years.
- The active roster is the youngest in the league and full of great young players.
- The team has 2 blue chip talents in Thompson and Dahlin.
- Players left for dead in previous years are making turnarounds or have already turned around (Thompson, Dahlin, Mittelstadt in previous seasons, Jokiharju this season). And Skinner has returned to form so his contract isn't a true albatross.
- The Sabres cap situation is incredible, with Thompson, Cozens, and Samuelsson on great deals. Dahlin is on a good deal, and Power's deal could be a steal.
- Levi is a potential franchise goalie and UPL hasn't been a train wreck.

If Pegula fired Adams and Granato tomorrow, the new GM and head coach are walking into the best situation in the league. It's not kinetic energy yet, still potential. But the Sabres are one of the only teams in the league who could trade for a player like McDavid and still have a really good team left over, just as an example.

The question is: do we really want the change or just stay the course? Regier left Murray a full cupboard and he pissed everything into the wind. Is everyone willing to take that chance?

Agree with everything you said except the bolded. He left Murray with Cupboards 2/3 hanging off the walls, with no shelves in them. He left him with a main roster that was needing to be badly rebuilt, with maybe two decent pieces in Myers and Ennis, and a rushed in development prospects Girgensons, and a poorly handled Grigorenko. Murray was left to rebuild a main roster AND a prospect pipeline. Not to mention a 10 year deal with Ehrhoff which Murray had to decide what to do with.

 

[MarkusKetterer]

 

[Der Jaeger]

Agree with everything you said except the bolded. He left Murray with Cupboards 2/3 hanging off the walls, with no shelves in them. He left him with a main roster that was needing to be badly rebuilt, with maybe two decent pieces in Myers and Ennis, and a rushed in development prospects Girgensons, and a poorly handled Grigorenko. Murray was left to rebuild a main roster AND a prospect pipeline. Not to mention a 10 year deal with Ehrhoff which Murray had to decide what to do with.

I don't agree. Regier had already traded Vanek and Pominville when he was fired on November of 2013.

That left Murray with the Islanders 2014 1st and 2015 2nd, as well as Moulson from the Vanek trade. Regier got a 2013 1st, 2014 2nd, and Larsson from the Wild for Pominville. The roster still had Ryan Miller and Drew Stafford on it, along with Tyler Myers. The pipeline had Girgensons (agree he was rushed), Armia, Grigorenko, Pysyk, McNabb, Zadorov, Ristolainen, Ennis, Foligno, and Ott, along with Moulson who would be traded and return.

Regier also got a 2nd and a 5th for Jordan Leopold, and a 2nd and 2nd for Robyn Regehr. That's 5 2nds and 2 1sts. That's a lot left over.

 

[TageGod]

If I take off my glasses, I won’t be able to read your hot takes. I’m old you know.

Do you actually think Mitts is currently playing good hockey? Or are your rose colored Mitts glasses preventing you from seeing how bad he has been lately?

 

[HOOats]

- Scouting staff, with a GM who listens, has racked up draft wins. The organizational pipeline is stacked.
- The Sabres are drafting well outside of round 1.
- The team has multiple blue chip prospects in the organization at various stages of development.

Nice post. I'm curious how our pool is regarded around the league and furthermore, how much prospects are valued in general right now.

I have my doubts about how much Adams has explored making a prospects/picks for NHL player deal up to now, but aside from the Meier trade, have we seen prospects used as major currency in deals lately? I'm a little spooked that we aren't going to be able to effectively thin our cupboard and extract the value we've been storing in our prospects.

 

[Tatanka]

Nice post. I'm curious how our pool is regarded around the league and furthermore, how much prospects are valued in general right now.

I have my doubts about how much Adams has explored making a prospects/picks for NHL player deal up to now, but aside from the Meier trade, have we seen prospects used as major currency in deals lately? I'm a little spooked that we aren't going to be able to effectively thin our cupboard and extract the value we've been storing in our prospects.

I often felt that picks are perceived as more valuable bc a gm can exercise choice. Prospects fall into 2 camps: those selected before or after a team picked in the same draft. Those that picked before are often content with their guy. Those that picked later are now looking less at potential and more at production at whatever level they are at. A long winded way of saying unless a prospect is NHL ready in the eyes of the buyer, I think they are less valuable than picks and roster players.

 

[Ace]

No end in sight.

 

[Ehran]

No end in sight.

We're so low we don't even show up on the preview.

I don't know whether to laugh or cry at this point.

 

[Ace]

We're so low we don't even show up on the preview.

I don't know whether to laugh or cry at this point.

Well..the good news is that this is a great draft for D in the top half of the draft.

It’s about the only good news we’ve got. This season plays out the way it is…there should be massive changes at every level of the organization. But there won’t be.