Roster/Rumors/Speculation/Trade Talk - 2023-24: Hotel California

[periferal]

The way I see it...


This is a very flawed roster. At least half the league has more raw talent and/or good prospects that will turn into talent real soon.

Barry Trotz brought them to basically their best possible outcome.

Lane Lambert is dragging them down (to the point where they seem lifeless).

And given the cap/asset situation of the club (that Lou put us in), there might not even be a way to add the necessary pieces to make a Cup contender anymore.

Meanwhile the clock is ticking as the Isles are the 2nd oldest team in the league and many in the core seem to be regressing/slowing down, so there might not even be another "run" in this team to matter what Lou adds..

Add it all up and to me it seems clear what should happen...

1. Lambert must be fired/replaced with a competent coach.
2. Lou should probably go as well.
3. Those players approaching 30 or older that have any value should probably be traded while they still have some.

Let's be brutally honest folks...The Islanders house is on fire and it's getting worse. It's going to be ugly no matter what, but would make the most sense to save what you can and get out, as opposed to just sitting there and hoping something magical saves you.

 

[BrockLobster]

What does it say? Kurz blocked me last year.

What did you say to get blocked by kevin kurz?? Lol

 

[MJF]

What did you say to get blocked by kevin kurz?? Lol

I told him he’s not fit to shine Staple’s shoes. Criticized him a bunch. Never used profanity.

He was thin-skinned when he first arrived.

 

[Lame Lambert]

We need to do something drastic like stripping the C from Anders and giving it to Josh Bailey.

 

[PK Cronin]

I’m gonna throw my two cents in regarding transparency on injuries.

Every other sport, including the NFL provides fairly detailed information regarding these injuries. I don’t buy the argument that disclosure of these injuries makes a player more subject to targeting. It doesn’t seem to happen in the NFL, so why should it happen in the NHL?

As far as a player’s medical history, we are not talking about whether somebody has diabetes, cancer, substance abuse or a sexually transmitted disease. Things like that should not be in the public domain unless the player chooses to make it known. Orthopedic injuries are a different kettle of fish.

More than a few people may disagree with me, but the lack of transparency annoys me and makes me less interested in the product.

Just because other sports do doesn't mean it's right. The NFL is also the worst offender of lying to their players about brain injuries, no? It might lead to targeting, it's a lot easier to target in the NHL than it is in the NFL. You have a stick that gives you greater reach, you skate around the ice wherever you want at any given time, and you can whack whoever you want. Is it rampant? Probably not. Does it happen? I'd bet everything I have that it does, especially come playoff time. Visnovsky was allegedly targeted by the Capitals because of his concussion history, but you think if a player was known to have a broken hand or wrist that he's not going to get an extra whack or two when it was feasible to do so?

You're drawing an arbitrary line between an illness and orthopedics because it's what you want it be different, but it's really not. It's all personal information.

Again, I'm not opposed to players disclosing their injuries and I am interested in that information but it's crazy to think you're entitled to that information because you're a consumer.

 

[PK Cronin]

We need to do something drastic like stripping the C from Anders and giving it to Josh Bailey.

I'm interested.

 

[WangMustGo]

The way I see it...


This is a very flawed roster. At least half the league has more raw talent and/or good prospects that will turn into talent real soon.

Barry Trotz brought them to basically their best possible outcome.

Lane Lambert is dragging them down (to the point where they seem lifeless).

And given the cap/asset situation of the club (that Lou put us in), there might not even be a way to add the necessary pieces to make a Cup contender anymore.

Meanwhile the clock is ticking as the Isles are the 2nd oldest team in the league and many in the core seem to be regressing/slowing down, so there might not even be another "run" in this team to matter what Lou adds..

Add it all up and to me it seems clear what should happen...

1. Lambert must be fired/replaced with a competent coach.
2. Lou should probably go as well.
3. Those players approaching 30 or older that have any value should probably be traded while they still have some.

Let's be brutally honest folks...The Islanders house is on fire and it's getting worse. It's going to be ugly no matter what, but would make the most sense to save what you can and get out, as opposed to just sitting there and hoping something magical saves you.

Agreed, longterm i think this core needs a new foundation. You keep Sorokin(assuming he resigns this offseason), Barzal, Dobson, and probably Pelech. The rest can all be moved. Start with Mayfield and Varlamov.

This team is going to need to retool for atleast the next 2-3 years. They need to get out of these longterm contracts to mediocre middle 6 players, and most of them have no value.

Isles need to rebuild the farm system and develop its prospects. The isles are not 1 piece away anymore, 2 or 3 years ago they may have been, but these days they are at a minimum a good LD and 2 very good forwards away from contending.

 

[Top Corner]

He's right, and they touch on a lot of what we all have mentioned. The roster has too many forwards who are the same. They're all signed for a year or two too long. There's not much room to make improvements because of the cap and lack of expiring contracts.

I just think that if Lamoriello is going to go for the playoffs he needs to do everything possible (trade anything) to bring in the talent to move guys down the lineup or off the roster. Get Meier, no matter the cost. Bring in Horvat. Go get Chychrun. The team needs them all if they're going to actually go for the cup, if not, start the rebuild. It's nut up or shut up time.

He needs to find homes for some of the redundant players that don't have speed but that will be a tall task in the mess he currently has. No identifiable 1st line and I'm not sure we will ever get that with Barzal as he has become too predictable. I guess the million dollar question is how can you turn Bailey / Palm / Lee into a couple quicker scorers. Not sure he can even get 1

 

[PK Cronin]

He needs to find homes for some of the redundant players that don't have speed but that will be a tall task in the mess he currently has. No identifiable 1st line and I'm not sure we will ever get that with Barzal as he has become too predictable. I guess the million dollar question is how can you turn Bailey / Palm / Lee into a couple quicker scorers. Not sure he can even get 1

I think it'd require too much roster turnover to do mid-season. Usually we don't see teams moving out three regulars and replacing them with new guys at the deadline.

 

[The Real JT]

The way I see it...


This is a very flawed roster. At least half the league has more raw talent and/or good prospects that will turn into talent real soon.

Barry Trotz brought them to basically their best possible outcome.

Lane Lambert is dragging them down (to the point where they seem lifeless).

And given the cap/asset situation of the club (that Lou put us in), there might not even be a way to add the necessary pieces to make a Cup contender anymore.

Meanwhile the clock is ticking as the Isles are the 2nd oldest team in the league and many in the core seem to be regressing/slowing down, so there might not even be another "run" in this team to matter what Lou adds..

Add it all up and to me it seems clear what should happen...

1. Lambert must be fired/replaced with a competent coach.
2. Lou should probably go as well.
3. Those players approaching 30 or older that have any value should probably be traded while they still have some.

Let's be brutally honest folks...The Islanders house is on fire and it's getting worse. It's going to be ugly no matter what, but would make the most sense to save what you can and get out, as opposed to just sitting there and hoping something magical saves you.

Good, depressing post.

The second paragraph is an understatement.

While there might conceivably be a small run left in this crew, the trajectory over the next 2 years with no major intervention is decidedly downward. A move to make us better short term will undoubtedly make our fortunes worse in the long run.

I’d sell either Nelson or JGP in the offseason and flip our UFAs to be at the TDL.

Beau has no worth but might be a chip at next year’s TDL.

Bailey: I’d rather bench him and lose that available cap space rather than attach assets to him in a trade.

 

[Osakahaus]

He needs to find homes for some of the redundant players that don't have speed but that will be a tall task in the mess he currently has. No identifiable 1st line and I'm not sure we will ever get that with Barzal as he has become too predictable. I guess the million dollar question is how can you turn Bailey / Palm / Lee into a couple quicker scorers. Not sure he can even get 1

Picks, but even then the problem is that there are so many pacey players in the NHL without a good shot.

To me, the isles biggest issue is never getting proper consistent wingers. I hope to god someone lamoriello drafted pans out, because this team is bare bones right now even in the prospect pool. Maybe Maggio or Finley end up being something, but it feels bleak.

 

[Doshell Propivo]

I believe the non disclosures of injuries is an item the NHLPA put into the CBA. Not so much to prevent players from targeting opponents but more to not give owners leverage in contract negotiations when it comes to injury history. The NFL players union is pretty week in comparison...

 

[The Real JT]

Just because other sports do doesn't mean it's right. The NFL is also the worst offender of lying to their players about brain injuries, no? It might lead to targeting, it's a lot easier to target in the NHL than it is in the NFL. You have a stick that gives you greater reach, you skate around the ice wherever you want at any given time, and you can whack whoever you want. Is it rampant? Probably not. Does it happen? I'd bet everything I have that it does, especially come playoff time. Visnovsky was allegedly targeted by the Capitals because of his concussion history, but you think if a player was known to have a broken hand or wrist that he's not going to get an extra whack or two when it was feasible to do so?

You're drawing an arbitrary line between an illness and orthopedics because it's what you want it be different, but it's really not. It's all personal information.

Again, I'm not opposed to players disclosing their injuries and I am interested in that information but it's crazy to think you're entitled to that information because you're a consumer.

Helpful hint: It’s hard to gain favor in an argument when you call the opposing view crazy.

No shock but I disagree with you. That’s all.

 

[PK Cronin]

Helpful hint: It’s hard to gain favor in an argument when you call the opposing view crazy.

No shock but I disagree with you. That’s all.

I wasn't intending to gain favor, it's so outlandish to me that I think it's crazy and I'm not sure how we've gotten to this place where people feel entitled to that information.

You provided no basis for your belief other than the NFL does it, which isn't a sound argument at all, and that you think it's different than other medical issues for some reason. There's nothing else there.

I'm open and interested in why you think how you do, but right now I think it's a nutty stance with jello legs that I've never seen substantiated in any way. It's also cool if you're not interested. I don't think you're crazy, I just don't like how common this view has become in sports.

 

[Lame Lambert]

I'm interested.

You know what, I really respect your willingness to go down the ship.

 

[doublechili]

I wonder to what extent Lou has free rein at this point? I assume that a GM always has to run some things by ownership (eg., big contracts), but we don't know what goes on behind the scenes and what the conversations have been between the owners and Lou in the past year or so.

What have they said publicly? Lou said that he believes in the group, and that ultimately he's responsible for the results. Ownership said "in Lou we trust" and they leave the hockey decisions to the hockey people. Nothing earth-shattering there.

My hunch is that Lou is on a short leash. He could be fired at any time and maybe we have a new GM next week. But if it's true that he's in the last year of his contract he's a bit of a lame duck and ownership may be letting him run things out with "the group" that he put together. If the results aren't there, they'll let him go and team will have a new GM (not Chris L) and a new coach next season. But I wonder if Lou is free to trade a 1st round pick for a player at this point without running it by ownership?

 

[MJF]

I'm interested.

You’re 3 years too late.

I wonder to what extent Lou has free rein at this point? I assume that a GM always has to run some things by ownership (eg., big contracts), but we don't know what goes on behind the scenes and what the conversations have been between the owners and Lou in the past year or so.

What have they said publicly? Lou said that he believes in the group, and that ultimately he's responsible for the results. Ownership said "in Lou we trust" and they leave the hockey decisions to the hockey people. Nothing earth-shattering there.

My hunch is that Lou is on a short leash. He could be fired at any time and maybe we have a new GM next week. But if it's true that he's in the last year of his contract he's a bit of a lame duck and ownership may be letting him run things out with "the group" that he put together. If the results aren't there, they'll let him go and team will have a new GM (not Chris L) and a new coach next season. But I wonder if Lou is free to trade a 1st round pick for a player at this point without running it by ownership?

Nobody thought the owners would ever fire Garth Snow. Until they did.

 

[Lame Lambert]

Nobody thought the owners would ever fire Garth Snow. Until they did.

This is starting to feel like that situation all over again and I really don’t like it

 

[doublechili]

Nobody thought the owners would ever fire Garth Snow. Until they did.

The owners seem pretty decisive. And competent, based on what they did with the arena, etc.. We have no idea what they're doing behind the scenes, but I feel like the team is in pretty good hands with them.

 

[xECK29x]

I told him he’s not fit to shine Staple’s shoes. Criticized him a bunch. Never used profanity.

He was thin-skinned when he first arrived.

He honestly, sucks

 

[MJF]

This is starting to feel like that situation all over again and I really don’t like it

As long as the owners do ‘t do something half way like kick Lou upstairs. If he gets removed as GM he has to leave the organization. I don’t want him setting the framework for his replacement.

 

[PK Cronin]

I wonder to what extent Lou has free rein at this point? I assume that a GM always has to run some things by ownership (eg., big contracts), but we don't know what goes on behind the scenes and what the conversations have been between the owners and Lou in the past year or so.

What have they said publicly? Lou said that he believes in the group, and that ultimately he's responsible for the results. Ownership said "in Lou we trust" and they leave the hockey decisions to the hockey people. Nothing earth-shattering there.

My hunch is that Lou is on a short leash. He could be fired at any time and maybe we have a new GM next week. But if it's true that he's in the last year of his contract he's a bit of a lame duck and ownership may be letting him run things out with "the group" that he put together. If the results aren't there, they'll let him go and team will have a new GM (not Chris L) and a new coach next season. But I wonder if Lou is free to trade a 1st round pick for a player at this point without running it by ownership?

I can't imagine the ownership group is happy with the results right now. I hope in the future that the owners show patience with GMs and don't fire them after stumbling a little bit. I'm more inclined to give GMs time to right the ship and address their shortcomings, especially after they've had some success. Rotating GMs regularly isn't a recipe for long term success in my eyes and I think most people aren't patient enough sometimes. It feels like people have been looking for a reason to move on from Lamoriello since the first ECF loss.

I'd be more than willing to give Lamoriello more time if he were younger, but he's not and it creates more of an issue for me. He's 80 years old and I wonder how many more years he has in him. I don't think he'll be able to properly orchestrate a rebuild, so if the team is going to rebuild the owners need to replace him sooner rather than later.

If he were to move into a President of Hockey Operations role only, I'd be okay with that in just about any situation. He's knowledgeable, respectable, knows everyone in the game, and helps set a tone for the organization.

 

[MJF]

He honestly, sucks

I guess I’m not missing anything.

 

[Lame Lambert]

He honestly, sucks

All of our reporters are terrible. They all just regurgitate anything that a casual fan with functional eyes can figure out.

 

[PK Cronin]

He honestly, sucks

People loved when he first got here because he was less friendly than Staple, now they don't like him because he's less friendly.

As long as the owners do ‘t do something half way like kick Lou upstairs. If he gets removed as GM he has to leave the organization. I don’t want him setting the framework for his replacement.

I think it depends on what the role is. I'm not interested in him being President but really pulling all the strings. If he's just there as more of a mentor and/or guiding hand on how to handle situations I'd be okay. Not sure he'd accept that though.