Speculation: Roster Building Thread XXXIV: Walk the line into the ring of fire

[RiffyNYR61]

Kreider is a nice player with a unique, enticing skill set. He’s a leader in the room and has nice chemistry on and off the ice with Mika.

that said, he’s in his late 20’s, and is one Of the streakiest players I’ve ever watched. Let’s not forget that, historically, he has disappeared for huge chunks of seasons- he happens to be extremely hot and engaged right now, in his contract year and right before the deadline.

I’m not sure why people would think he’s suddenly found the switch to be this player full time.

 

[GAGLine]

Could that be the case because he signed an over 35 contract though?

Yes, that is why Kovy still counts. Nothing stops a 35+ contract from counting against the cap. Sticking the player in the AHL reduces the cap hit by 100k (weird rule), but that's it. Buyouts, terminations and retirements don't matter.

Henrik is not on a 35+ contract, so his cap hit would be completely gone if he and the Rangers were to terminate.

 

[GAGLine]

A guy who I’d consider picking up on the cheap IF Skjei was traded for a forward is Jake Gardiner. He’s been on the block all season. His contract is relatively short and palatable and he could come in and be a 4/5 LD who can also provide a bit of offense. $4.05m for 3 more years. That’s average 2nd pairing money. I think that he will be better next year a full year after his major injury last year.

Perhaps IF Carolina is motivated to move him they would consider taking Smith with some money retained as a depth F/D next year to help offset some salary

No interest in Gardiner, even if Smith is going the other way. If we want a fill in for Skjei (assuming he is traded), I would prefer someone with less AAV and term.

 

[JT Kreider]

A guy who I’d consider picking up on the cheap IF Skjei was traded for a forward is Jake Gardiner. He’s been on the block all season. His contract is relatively short and palatable and he could come in and be a 4/5 LD who can also provide a bit of offense. $4.05m for 3 more years. That’s average 2nd pairing money. I think that he will be better next year a full year after his major injury last year.

Perhaps IF Carolina is motivated to move him they would consider taking Smith with some money retained as a depth F/D next year to help offset some salary

Gardiner wouldnt survive a season here

 

[Zynbanejad]

Kreider is a nice player with a unique, enticing skill set. He’s a leader in the room and has nice chemistry on and off the ice with Mika.

that said, he’s in his late 20’s, and is one Of the streakiest players I’ve ever watched. Let’s not forget that, historically, he has disappeared for huge chunks of seasons- he happens to be extremely hot and engaged right now, in his contract year and right before the deadline.

I’m not sure why people would think he’s suddenly found the switch to be this player full time.

Because that’s what happens. Players hit their stride. Kreider has been bogged down by asinine coaching for most of his career. He’s finally on a line that’s been mostly together for two seasons now. Our investment in him has finally paid off. It would be foolish to trade him now if the offer is just alright.

 

[Avery16]

No interest in Gardiner, even if Smith is going the other way. If we want a fill in for Skjei (assuming he is traded), I would prefer someone with less AAV and term.

We also just don't need a stand-in for third pair minutes.

 

[JT Kreider]

Ovechkin-Kuznetsov-Wilson
Vrana-Backstrom-Oshie
Hagelin-Eller-Panik
Leipsic-Dowd-Hathaway


Caps starting lineup today ...looks a bit weak on LW..can understand why they may be interested in CK.

McMichael would be one of the few returns I'd be over the moon to get for Kreids

 

[UnSandvich]

Because that’s what happens. Players hit their stride. Kreider has been bogged down by asinine coaching for most of his career. He’s finally on a line that’s been mostly together for two seasons now. Our investment in him has finally paid off. It would be foolish to trade him now if the offer is just alright.

On the contrary, it would be more foolish to keep him when the team's window won't really open for at least 2 seasons. Kreider at that point will be a PWF over 30, and we've all seen how those age

EDIT: And at least some of the assets traded for will hopefully be entering the league on ELCs when we'll need cheap depth

 

[Zynbanejad]

On the contrary, it would be more foolish to keep him when the team's window won't really open for at least 2 seasons. Kreider at that point will be a PWF over 30, and we've all seen how those age

EDIT: And at least some of the assets traded for will hopefully be entering the league on ELCs when we'll need cheap depth

True, but Kreider is probably the best conditioned and strongest player we’ve had in years. Might I remind you he can jump out of a hot tub

I’m also in the minority here probably, but I think we can compete today....we’re a piece or two and some playoff experience away IMO.

 

[NYRangers0723]

Kreider is a nice player with a unique, enticing skill set. He’s a leader in the room and has nice chemistry on and off the ice with Mika.

that said, he’s in his late 20’s, and is one Of the streakiest players I’ve ever watched. Let’s not forget that, historically, he has disappeared for huge chunks of seasons- he happens to be extremely hot and engaged right now, in his contract year and right before the deadline.

I’m not sure why people would think he’s suddenly found the switch to be this player full time.

It’s impossible to be that player full time. Players have streaks. Especially ones that play and physical speed game otherwise you wear yourself out or cause injury. Overall Kreider has been a very good player. He had become a better overall player. Remember how bad he used to be
Defensively? Now he makes a lot of good defensive plays and avoids the penalty box as much as possible. Even face offs which I never knew he would be good at he had done well. He is a underrated passer even though his job isn’t to be a playmaker. Obviously his bet presence is so crucial even if he didn’t translate into points for himself. His speed opens up space for his line mates too. So yeah I agree the big long term contract is risky but you can say that with every contract. When I look at all the things he brings I still firmly believe it is so hard to replace

 

[duhmetreE]

I need a source for anyone quoting those cap numbers. It hasn't jumped $7m in years.

We haven't traded a single guy like Staal/Smith/Hank. Always stuck buying out. There is a reason. Are we black balled for raising salaries for decades? Do we refuse to incentivize like Toronto did? Is Gorton unrealistic? Does he prefer buyouts? I'll believe it when I see it.

Huge assumptions everywhere. Henrik retiring... Skjei trade probably brings back salary. Arbitration for everyone and super low, ranger friendly numbers that are wishful thinking.
Lundqvist comes over, plays his off side and is impactful?
Rykov struggles in the A. Hajak has struggled.
A left of Lindgren, Hajak, ADA is better than the non-world beaters of Skjei and Staal.

Yes, getting by next year is the challenging part, because it is such a crunch it will reverberate for years. Is the goal to improve or collect hockey cards? Why would we push the growing pains to next season and the year after when now is the rebuild? Why have a worse team when panarin is a year or 2 older, when Zibanajed, who misses stretches every season, aged and is due a new, more expensive deal?

I'm sorry, I'm listening to the other side. It's not adding up for me.

What do you think the cap is? It's 81.5 this year.

Skjei could most certainly be moved without taking salary back.

There is a reason, because they're owed a lot of money. Cap rich teams tend to not like 'spending money.' Good thing, this is their final years of a front-loaded contract. Once they're paid their signing bonuses, it becomes palatable.

It's not wishful thinking. That's the benefit of having controllable assets. Sure, they could hold out but I doubt it gets to that. ADA is the only one where this would become an issue.

Strome is more than likely going to be moved at some point.
Buch is more than likely going to be moved at some point.

???? There are no growing pains. We have completely opposite perceptions. Getting rid of Staal, Smith and HL create no pains. Replacing Skjei with ADA on the books is not a pain. Replacing Buch with Kravtsov is not a pain, it sucks that it has to happen but thats how things work in a hard-cap era.

Keep the core/good pieces/performers and move forward. Kreider - Zibs is as good as a combo gets. We cant keep everyone. If you think getting rid of Kreider is the play, that's fine, I don't.

In 2022 our dead cap money subsides and we will have a lot more room.

 

[Ghost of jas]

True, but Kreider is probably the best conditioned and strongest player we’ve had in years. Might I remind you he can jump out of a hot tub

I’m also in the minority here probably, but I think we can compete today....we’re a piece or two and some playoff experience away IMO.

I’ve been saying this for a while now. Next year, this team should be a solid playoff team.

 

[Zynbanejad]

I mean if you compare our roster today to the Blues’ last year when Binnington took the starter role...they’re pretty similar. Defense could use some work, but we’re close. We never had this scoring ability in front of Hank before. Igor does. I truly think we’re close.

 

[NYR Viper]

What do you think the cap is? It's $81.5 this year

Skjei could most certainly be moved without taking salary back.

There is a reason, because they're owed a lot of money. Cap rich teams tend to not like spending money. Good thing, this is their final years of a front-loaded contract. Once they're paid their signing bonuses, it becomes palatable.

It's not wishful thinking. That's the benefit of having controllable assets. Sure, they could hold out but I doubt it gets to that. ADA is the only one where this would become an issue.

Strome is more than likely going to be moved at some point.
Buch is more than likely going to be moved at some point.

???? There are no growing pains. We have completely opposite perceptions. Getting rid of Staal, Smith and HL create no pains. Replacing Skjei with ADA on the books is not a pain. Replacing Buch with Kravtsov is not a pain, it sucks that it has to happen but thats how things work in a hard-cap era.

Keep the core/good pieces/performers and move forward. Kreider - Zibs is as good as a combo gets. We cant keep everyone. If you think getting rid of Kreider is the play, that's fine, I don't.

In 2022 our dead cap money subsides and we will have a lot more room.

I really don’t think trading Skjei for no money coming back would be possible. A team adding $5+m on the books is going to be hard to find. And if that’s a prerequisite, expect the value to drop as other teams will know you need to dump cap

 

[NYRangers0723]

People keep saying we are 2 years away but I really don’t believe that. Hell we can literally get in this year lol. Look I understand some want to try and win the lottery again like last year when we jumped to 2 but I don’t see that happening. I believe in this team. I want playoffs LGR!!!

 

[NYRangers0723]

I mean if you compare our roster today to the Blues’ last year when Binnington took the starter role...they’re pretty similar. Defense could use some work, but we’re close. We never had this scoring ability in front of Hank before. Igor does. I truly think we’re close.

True Post. Agreed. When you have Igor in net you have a shot

 

[Paulie Walnutz]

Yes, that is why Kovy still counts. Nothing stops a 35+ contract from counting against the cap. Sticking the player in the AHL reduces the cap hit by 100k (weird rule), but that's it. Buyouts, terminations and retirements don't matter.

Henrik is not on a 35+ contract, so his cap hit would be completely gone if he and the Rangers were to terminate.

Yeah that’s what I thought.

 

[HonestGabe]

Need.More.News

Brooks has been silent

 

[NYR Viper]

True Post. Agreed. When you have Igor in net you have a shot

I think many people don’t want to replicate what happened with Hank when he was a rookie with Shesty. Just because you can squeak into the playoffs doesn’t mean you’re a true contender. Rushing it only means it’s more difficult to contend moving forward.

 

[Fitzy]

I think many people don’t want to replicate what happened with Hank when he was a rookie with Shesty. Just because you can squeak into the playoffs doesn’t mean you’re a true contender. Rushing it only means it’s more difficult to contend moving forward.

Replicate/Rush what? It's not like NYR traded a bunch of futures for a playoff run in 2006.

 

[Mac n Gs]

Yes, that is why Kovy still counts. Nothing stops a 35+ contract from counting against the cap. Sticking the player in the AHL reduces the cap hit by 100k (weird rule), but that's it. Buyouts, terminations and retirements don't matter.

Henrik is not on a 35+ contract, so his cap hit would be completely gone if he and the Rangers were to terminate.

Yeah, and CapFriendly just confirmed it for Bogosian's contract:

 

[Beer League Sniper]

Need.More.News

Brooks has been silent

Brooks still occasionally has insider info, but most of his connections have atrophied since Sather stepped down.

 

[UnSandvich]

The Rangers need at least one more Top 6 C prospect/player, and ideally another Top 4 LD prospect/player, before they'll be set to compete. Because Strome and our current set of LDs? That ain't it chief

 

[duhmetreE]

I really don’t think trading Skjei for no money coming back would be possible. A team adding $5+m on the books is going to be hard to find. And if that’s a prerequisite, expect the value to drop as other teams will know you need to dump cap

The list definitely a lot smaller and it would more than likely affect the return.. If its this TDL an expiring contract can come back... or whatever the difference that is needed to make things work.

There are a lot of moving parts coming to this offseason and a lot of decisions to be made... BUT after this off-season the foundation will/should be set

 

[NYRangers0723]

I think many people don’t want to replicate what happened with Hank when he was a rookie with Shesty. Just because you can squeak into the playoffs doesn’t mean you’re a true contender. Rushing it only means it’s more difficult to contend moving forward.

what is rushing it? It’s not like anybody is suggesting trading pick to go for it. The Rangers are simply letting it play out. Look I was a big supporter for the rebuild long before the letter came out and still am but that doesn’t mean we should just try not to get into the playoffs on purpose. I think that sends a shitty message. Even if Kreider if traded and we somehow make the playoffs(unlikely) but If that somehow happens I wouldn’t be upset at all. Otherwise you become the Sabres lol