Speculation: Roster building thread XXIII: Heading into doldrum days and All Star break

[Mac n Gs]

Look Hank has done a lot for this organization. Carried them to a number of runs. I love the guy. I'm sure legions of Ranger fans do as well.

But if you were handling things with Hank the honorable way, which is what I fully expect them to, it's to ask him the following:

• How long do you want to play?
• Can you play at a higher level? If so, what will that take?
• Do you want to play for a contender?

The second question is not a money question, and the third question is not something that the Rangers can control. Most contenders don't need a starting goalie.

I think for Hank to succeed, you have to overhaul the defensive system.

For the Rangers to succeed, you have to overhaul the defensive system.

There is a coach on the market right now who got a great season out of an older Roberto Luongo, an older Marc Andre Fleary. Under the "Luongo Principal" he had his D-Zone structure play a tight zone coverage, and take away the seam pass, the east-west pass. That team made the playoffs.

His team hired a bunch of Corsi guys, fired the coach next year. The coach was then hired, and took a team to the cup finals right away, while the first team that fired him hasn't made the playoffs since then.

That guy is on the market now.

I mean, I’d love Gallant too, and I think he’s been giving a raw deal by two teams now. Tallon made some absolutely braindead moves as GM, and somehow Gallant got canned for not being able to push forward an inferior team.

I just can’t see them canning Quinn right as this team is taking a turn for the better.

 

[bobbop]

are 2 of the worst teams in the league gonna sign him to an offer sheet and give up a 1st round pick that will be a potential 1st overall cause they suck way beyond just a goalie when they can instead trade for him by just giving up a decent young player that won't even compare to the potential player that pick will be?

At that price it’s a second, not a first

 

[Good Intentions]

I mentioned this the other day, but it seems people are just brushing it under the rug:

How on Earth do you guys think this plays beyond this season, maybe next, without becoming a major point of divisiveness in the clubhouse and throughout the org?

These guys are both entering their mid-twenties, have both served their apprenticeships, and will both (rightly) want to be the man, the starter, the star – and to be put in the corresponding position to get paid. Give 'em both 40 games a year, depress their numbers (thus consequently depressing their salaries), and neither will be happy.

Never mind the fact that having a starting-caliber goalie cooling his heels on the bench every game (when you could instead leverage him for help elsewhere that would actually be able to contribute on the ice) is a horribad waste of an asset.

you are one of my favorite guys here – and we are overdue to catch a game together, but I empathically disagree on this.

Georgiev may be the one. If anything, I need to see 60 starts from Shesterkin. Nothing is certain. The position is too crucial. Georgiev has shown the demeanor, personality, chemistry, and guts. He is wildly underrated, and being discarded because there is a Russian wildcard that may prove to be superb. And that’s just it - may be.

Deal Georgiev and you’ll regret it, I promise.

 

[eco's bones]

Regarding both Geo and Igor, both will have to play lights out to get 2nd contracts at greater than 5per

Geo, as good as hes been, HAS NOT reached that level.

I doubt that Igor gets there in the next three years as well.

There seems to be a general overeating of who these guys are today.

Georgiev is not getting anything close to 4 plus on his next contract and Igor will have to post absurd numbers over the next 2 years to garner anything close to 4 million.

Igor actually has this year and next before his next contract is due. To get a $4 mil deal for 21-22 he will literally have to take over the No. 1 spot and lead us into the playoffs by next year. Now we might make the playoffs anyway going back and forth between Igor and Alex or Henrik but if he's not getting the major bulk of games he's probably not going to score that big. It's more likely his third contract that he'll start really making big money.

As for Alex I agree too. Alex has been excellent but he doesn't have a ton of leverage. I think his contract coming up at least if it is with us is going to be in the $2-2.5 mil range and the higher end of that might be generous.

 

[Kakko Schmakko]

you are one of my favorite guys here – and we are overdue to catch a game together, but I empathically disagree on this.

Georgiev may be the one. If anything, I need to see 60 starts from Shesterkin. Nothing is certain. The position is too crucial. Georgiev has shown the demeanor, personality, chemistry, and guts. He is wildly underrated, and being discarded because there is a Russian wildcard that may prove to be superb. And that’s just it - may be.

Deal Georgiev and you’ll regret it, I promise.

Why would we regret it if we get a good return back rather than keeping him and losing a good player in the expansion draft trying to protect him. What we are regretting or should be regretting is the dumb contract we gave to Lundqvist.

 

[eco's bones]

I will say this if the Rangers did buy out Henrik---one thing it would show is they're serious as can be about the direction they're going---because that's a very hard cold and calculated decision. There's no way of parsing around or bull shitting it.

 

[itsPLkielbasa]

I will say this if the Rangers did buy out Henrik---one thing it would show is they're serious as can be about the direction they're going---because that's a very hard cold and calculated decision. There's no way of parsing around or bull ****ting it.

If they do buy him out... how does that look on our cap situation?
I doubt it happens but if it does, how much money are we talking about going against our cap for the next few years?

 

[eco's bones]

I mean it sounds like he’s not going to come cheap though.

And in theory yes I agree with what you’re saying but goalies are weird. Georgiev could fall off the face of the earth in 2 years and the Rangers get nothing for him

That’s a bunch of potential outcomes that have to be weighed here

I don't see why Alex would fall off the face of the earth--he's better from year 1 to 2 to 3 and he's only 23 years old. The same argument by the way could be made for Igor--why couldn't he fall off?

 

[eco's bones]

If they do buy him out... how does that look on our cap situation?
I doubt it happens but if it does, how much money are we talking about going against our cap for the next few years?

The buyout would be $5.5 mil next year--which would free up $3 mil and $1.5 in 21-22. That's it. He has one year left so a buyout only effects 2 years.

I don't think it will happen either by the way but if they do move Alex it's not going to happen.

 

[Vitto79]

Gonna get killed on this one

Moore , Bracco for Georgiev , Haley

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

I don't see why Alex would fall off the face of the earth--he's better from year 1 to 2 to 3 and he's only 23 years old. The same argument by the way could be made for Igor--why couldn't he fall off?

Yes you could make the argument about Igor

For me it comes down to trusting what Allaire and the front office thinks. If they’re comfortable trading Georgiev than I am as well

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Won't Georgiev be susceptible to the expansion draft being a 3rd year player?

You can protect Georgiev, with Shestyorkin being exempt and Lundqvist a UFA

 

[RangersFan1994]

Gonna get killed on this one

Moore , Bracco for Georgiev , Haley

Awful

 

[charliemurphy]

Gonna get killed on this one

Moore , Bracco for Georgiev , Haley

Counter...
Georgiev for 2020 2nd and Bracco
OR
Georgiev for 2020 3rd (Columbus' pick) and Robertson

 

[EdJovanovski]

 

[cheech70]

Bread get nicked up last game?

 

[gravey9]

My theory on the Rangers approach to Georgiev is this.

If they cannot get a current top 9 NHL forward, they will not trade Geo. They will go back to Lundqvist after the deadline and say, look, we tried to find a deal for Geo, but moving a long term solution for #1 goalie for pennies on the dollar hurts the organization too much going forward. And if we can't find a deal that makes sense than we have to go with our young goalies as the tandem in 20-21. We need you to work with us. If we can't find a deal by the draft for Geo that makes sense, would you be willing to go to a contender for one last crack at it?

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

you are one of my favorite guys here – and we are overdue to catch a game together, but I empathically disagree on this.

Georgiev may be the one. If anything, I need to see 60 starts from Shesterkin. Nothing is certain. The position is too crucial. Georgiev has shown the demeanor, personality, chemistry, and guts. He is wildly underrated, and being discarded because there is a Russian wildcard that may prove to be superb. And that’s just it - may be.

Deal Georgiev and you’ll regret it, I promise.

Ha. Back atcha!

Well, the problem is, as they say in the financial world, "you can't time the market." A major component of constructing a roster in any sport is knowing whom to keep, whom to deal, and whom to go out and get – and sometimes (most times) you can't wait for the exact moment you'd prefer; you have to strike while the iron's hot. (Good examples would be the Fox, Trouba, and Panarin deals last year, all of which one could argue, came perhaps one year earlier than would have been ideal.)

So, while there may be an offer available for Georgie today, while Igor has only two starts under his belt; that same offer may not be there after he's got 60. This is why you have a front office and teams of scouts: you need to be able to make the call when the call is there to be made.

All that being said, my point was more in reference to all those stating that a tandem of Georgie and Igor are the long-term future. As I think I stated in my original post, I can totally envision a scenario where no decision is made until the offseason, or even the beginning of next season. Any longer than that, however, and the problem IMO starts to grow increasingly acute.

 

[bobbop]

I'd like bracco as a throw in, not as major piece.

It'd be a worthwhile gamble. Give him some minutes on pp2 maybe the right side of the Panarin line.

Georgy plus Andersson for Kapanen plus Bracco.

Interesting thought

 

[duhmetreE]

So, theoretically... If Shesty has a strong outing, will Lundqvist play on Tuesday? Or is he going to be sitting for 3 weeks?

 

[NYSPORTS]

If they do buy him out... how does that look on our cap situation?
I doubt it happens but if it does, how much money are we talking about going against our cap for the next few years?

it’s not bad b/c Hank is 38 and qualifies for (social security/kidding) the 67% rule

Henrik Lundqvist buyout calculator, cap hit impact | Puckpedia

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

I mentioned it not for the cap hit, but for possibly retirement reasons.

Got it. I don't think Henrik wants to retire. He strikes me as ultra competitive. Plus he's gone on record as saying once he's done as a player, he's done with hockey and doesn't want to manage or coach.

 

[Fitzy]

Bread get nicked up last game?

He had a reverse hit that knocked him pretty hard

 

[Alluckks]

I’ll give you two teams with need, cap room and draft capital...Detroit and Ottawa. I could se either of them offer sheeting Georgiev. $4.3 MM on an offer sheet is very realistic. You want to match that?

You're telling me Ottawa wants to play the offersheet game with the New York Rangers? Lol

 

[RangerBoy]