Speculation: Roster building thread XXIII: Heading into doldrum days and All Star break

[HFsNumber1Heel]

FWIW, Hank's salary drops to its lowest point next year. 1 mil bonus + 4.5 mil base salary.

The cap hit is the problem more so than actual money.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

Nobody is going to offer sheet Georgiev at that number, IMHO. Offer sheets are as common as Bigfoot sightings.

Georgiev is a tough one - I don't think a player like Kapanen is coming the other way as Mirtle seemed to agree with. Personally, I'd like to see Georgiev, Staal w/retained salary (assuming he wants to go to a contender) traded for a near NHL prospect + vet with contract that expires this year.

Eh, after MTL and Aho last year, I think they're going to be more a part of "accepted" hockey business going forward.

Not common per se, but not so rare as ye olde sasquatch sightings.

 

[eco's bones]

I think it would be sooner than later

I think it’s less than 5 years. I’d say 3 years at most. If Shestyorkin and Georgiev continue to play well they’re going to want to be paid like it

.....and if moving Alex a year or even two from now means we get a 1st rounder and maybe more rather than a 2nd or someone's 25 year old 3rd line winger right now which would you choose? Alex is improving year to year and he's got multiple teams banging on our door already hoping to get a future starter for cheap.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

There's not a gun to the Rangers saying they have to trade Georgiev. If the return isn't phenomenal, hold onto him. In fact unless they can get a core forward, I keep him.

I don't get this notion the Rangers benching Lundqvist or buying him out is disrespectful. What's the invisible "moral standard?" Where does it come from and what human needs an explanation?

Every team at some point says goodbye to their star. The Yankees did it with Mattingly, Iginla in Calgary, Lou Lamariello didn't re-up how many guys? Even Shaq was let go by teams. I don't understand this "New York Standard" or "it's not the Rangers way." Please show me this doctrine.

None of those guys you mentioned were bought out. You don't buy out the guy who has been face of your franchise for 15 years. You don't have to play him, that is true, but a buy out is not an option here.

There isn't a gun being held to the Rangers' head, but there is a time limit to how "hot" of a commodity Geo is or will be. From whats been thrown out there by people in the know, it sounds like now is the time to sell high.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

It's really, really simple - you do not hand off a 23 year old 1A who happens to be the quintessential mature professional, overachiever, chemistry piece to this decade puzzle. Love Henrik to death but I'm not trading Georgiev. End of conversation. Henrik can be inactive, get paid, not get paid, have a parade, all of the above. We'll have a decade to celebrate Henrik, and during this decade, Georgiev and Shesterkin are the solution, together.

That cost for both is way down the line.

Georgiev next contract will be in the 4+ range.

Igors next contract will also be in the 4+ range.

That's about what Hank makes now.

I see no problems keeping both youngsters for another 5 years

I mentioned this the other day, but it seems people are just brushing it under the rug:

How on Earth do you guys think this plays beyond this season, maybe next, without becoming a major point of divisiveness in the clubhouse and throughout the org?

These guys are both entering their mid-twenties, have both served their apprenticeships, and will both (rightly) want to be the man, the starter, the star – and to be put in the corresponding position to get paid. Give 'em both 40 games a year, depress their numbers (thus consequently depressing their salaries), and neither will be happy.

Never mind the fact that having a starting-caliber goalie cooling his heels on the bench every game (when you could instead leverage him for help elsewhere that would actually be able to contribute on the ice) is a horribad waste of an asset.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

.....and if moving Alex a year or even two from now means we get a 1st rounder and maybe more rather than a 2nd or someone's 25 year old 3rd line winger right now which would you choose? Alex is improving year to year and he's got multiple teams banging on our door already hoping to get a future starter for cheap.

I mean it sounds like he’s not going to come cheap though.

And in theory yes I agree with what you’re saying but goalies are weird. Georgiev could fall off the face of the earth in 2 years and the Rangers get nothing for him

That’s a bunch of potential outcomes that have to be weighed here

 

[Savant]

I saw a couple people bring this up on twitter yesterday and it’s not something I had thought of, but eventually one of Shestyorkin/Georgiev are going to have to be traded

If Hank retires, at some point in the near future it’s going to cost to much to keep both Georgiev and Igor. So the tandem thing, not even sure how long it would be sustainable

I don’t buy that at all. Especially while Igor is under RFA control.

Vasilevsky went from entry level deal to 3x3.5. Igor has his work cut out for him if he wants to make a case to beat that. Even if for arguements sake Igor matches Vasilevsky’s first extension, I doubt Georgiev gets 5m (or over), probably gets 3.5-4.25ish. Lundqvist makes 8.5? They are going to save money

 

[pld459666]

Regarding both Geo and Igor, both will have to play lights out to get 2nd contracts at greater than 5per

Geo, as good as hes been, HAS NOT reached that level.

I doubt that Igor gets there in the next three years as well.

There seems to be a general overeating of who these guys are today.

Georgiev is not getting anything close to 4 plus on his next contract and Igor will have to post absurd numbers over the next 2 years to garner anything close to 4 million.

 

[Emptyvoid]

The cap hit is the problem more so than actual money.

I mentioned it not for the cap hit, but for possibly retirement reasons.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

As a number of us have been saying in regard to Bracco as a potential get from the Leafs for...

Well, pretty much any asset:

 

[Savant]

As a number of us have been saying in regard to Bracco as a potential get from the Leafs for...

Well, pretty much any asset:

Kapanen or bust for Georgiev for me

EDIT: (From Toronto)

 

[Lays]

Would love to get Andreas Johnsson back for Georgiev. He’s like Fast but better offensively (45-50 point player) and would fit with Zib as a Kreider replacement. Really don’t like Kapanen

Here’s my ideal plan

1st+Frederic for Kreider(+?)
Strome for a 2nd+2nd (or similar value)
Re-sign Fast
Trade Buchnevich for a 2nd+ (or similar value)
Trade DeAngelo+Boston’s 1st+ for Hampus Lindholm
Trade Skjei for 2nd+ (or similar value)
Trade Lundkvist+ for Alex Tuch

Draft Dawson Mercer with our 1st

Johnsson-Zibanejad-Kravtsov
Panarin-Chytil-Kakko
Barron-Mercer-Tuch
Lemieux-Frederic-Fast

Lindholm-Fox
Miller-Trouba
Robertson/Jones/Keane/Rykov/Lindgren/Reunanen

Shesty
X

this is my ideal lineup and in 2-3 years it’s a cup contender

 

[SA16]

If Bracco was that good/had such value you would have to think the guy who coached him the last few years in the AHL would know this and would have lobbied for him to be promoted to the NHL team. Hasn't happened.

 

[bl02]

Right now I just hope if Georgiev is traded we can at least get another Lemieux type player. Someone with some speed and physicality who can be a good 2/3rd liner.
Our prospects at forward seem thin

 

[kovazub94]

I mentioned this the other day, but it seems people are just brushing it under the rug:

How on Earth do you guys think this plays beyond this season, maybe next, without becoming a major point of divisiveness in the clubhouse and throughout the org?.

A. I think “point of divisiveness “ is no more likely than “happily ever after “, and as @eco's bones mentioned - the trade return would likely be greater then than now.

 

[bl02]

Definitely starting to feel we need a forward roster player back for Georgiev! Picks and some minor leaguer like Bracco to Risky. Not garnering lot of confidence from our forward prospect picks last few years except Chytil.

 

[kovazub94]

I think it would be sooner than later

I think it’s less than 5 years. I’d say 3 years at most. If Shestyorkin and Georgiev continue to play well they’re going to want to be paid like it

Even if it is 3 years from now that they get their hypothetical $4m for 4 years contracts - it’s still 7 years of cap hit that’s no bigger than Hank’s for the last 7 years.

 

[Mikos87]

Look Hank has done a lot for this organization. Carried them to a number of runs. I love the guy. I'm sure legions of Ranger fans do as well.

But if you were handling things with Hank the honorable way, which is what I fully expect them to, it's to ask him the following:

• How long do you want to play?
• Can you play at a higher level? If so, what will that take?
• Do you want to play for a contender?

The second question is not a money question, and the third question is not something that the Rangers can control. Most contenders don't need a starting goalie.

I think for Hank to succeed, you have to overhaul the defensive system.

For the Rangers to succeed, you have to overhaul the defensive system.

There is a coach on the market right now who got a great season out of an older Roberto Luongo, an older Marc Andre Fleary. Under the "Luongo Principal" he had his D-Zone structure play a tight zone coverage, and take away the seam pass, the east-west pass. That team made the playoffs.

His team hired a bunch of Corsi guys, fired the coach next year. The coach was then hired, and took a team to the cup finals right away, while the first team that fired him hasn't made the playoffs since then.

That guy is on the market now.

 

[Fitzy]

I'd like bracco as a throw in, not as major piece.

It'd be a worthwhile gamble. Give him some minutes on pp2 maybe the right side of the Panarin line.

Georgy plus Andersson for Kapanen plus Bracco.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

A. I think “point of divisiveness “ is no more likely than “happily ever after “, and as @eco's bones mentioned - the trade return would likely be greater then than now.

Oh, you can certainly make it work into this offseason, and potentially into the start of next if you're not getting the offers you want.

But if both are still here 2 seasons from now?

The back page articles write themselves.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

I'd like bracco as a throw in, not as major piece.

It'd be a worthwhile gamble. Give him some minutes on pp2 maybe the right side of the Panarin line.

Georgy plus Andersson for Kapanen plus Bracco.

If I'm acquiring undersized players, I want guys who I know have the speed/skill/other attribute to somehow make a difference on the ice.

Bracco screams AAAA scorer to me; would rather a pick as the throw-in in such a scenario.

 

[NoQuitInNewMexico]

I'd like bracco as a throw in, not as major piece.

It'd be a worthwhile gamble. Give him some minutes on pp2 maybe the right side of the Panarin line.

Georgy plus Andersson for Kapanen plus Bracco.

Was about to suggest the same exact trade. But I'm so curious to find out what other front offices actually think about Lias.

 

[East Coast Bias]

I saw a couple people bring this up on twitter yesterday and it’s not something I had thought of, but eventually one of Shestyorkin/Georgiev are going to have to be traded

If Hank retires, at some point in the near future it’s going to cost to much to keep both Georgiev and Igor. So the tandem thing, not even sure how long it would be sustainable

People are so busy trying to whine about Lundqvist that they're completely missing the point of trading one of them.

They're not going to spend their careers here splitting the #1 role. In what world are these guys going to accept that? You're never getting the recognition of a #1, cause you're not - you're 1A or 1B. You're never getting a ASG nod. You're not getting top money. You may start a playoff series, or maybe not, depending of it was you or your partner who was hot to end the season.

What example do we have of two good goalies doing this? You only ever see it with average goalies, with teams riding the hot hand.

 

[bobbop]

Nobody is going to offer sheet Georgiev at that number, IMHO. Offer sheets are as common as Bigfoot sightings.

Georgiev is a tough one - I don't think a player like Kapanen is coming the other way as Mirtle seemed to agree with. Personally, I'd like to see Georgiev, Staal w/retained salary (assuming he wants to go to a contender) traded for a near NHL prospect + vet with contract that expires this year.

I’ll give you two teams with need, cap room and draft capital...Detroit and Ottawa. I could se either of them offer sheeting Georgiev. $4.3 MM on an offer sheet is very realistic. You want to match that?

 

[Leetch3]

I’ll give you two teams with need, cap room and draft capital...Detroit and Ottawa. I could se either of them offer sheeting Georgiev. $4.3 MM on. An offer sheet is very realistic. You want to match that?

are 2 of the worst teams in the league gonna sign him to an offer sheet and give up a 1st round pick that will be a potential 1st overall cause they suck way beyond just a goalie when they can instead trade for him by just giving up a decent young player that won't even compare to the potential player that pick will be?