Roster Building Thread VI (2022-23): Offseason edition

[Machinehead]

Then again, I still have hope that Panarin could fit what we were doing if we actually did something as a team instead of "everyone jump in the pool."

 

[bleedblue94]

The guys who lowballed him are gone and half the team Fast played with are still here, I see no reason why he'd be so petty, especially when the rumblings I remember are that fast left because he wasnt interested in a rebuild.

Either way, there are other options for that role. They just need a guy who can play fast (no pun intended), forecheck and create space on Panarin's wing. I like Garland as an option if you can get Vancouver to retain or he gets bought out. Hathaway would also kill 2 birds with one stone; get tougher and get a hardnosed guy to do the dirty work.

He did not want to live in NYC anymore, it wasnt about term or money, he just did not want to be in NYC. people need to understand that NYC is not for everyone. let it go...

 

[NYR Viper]

Then again, I still have hope that Panarin could fit what we were doing if we actually did something as a team instead of "everyone jump in the pool."

I think you meant jump 'out' of the pool. Kreider is on the team...

 

[Guyute]

Kreider - Zibanejad - Panarin
Lafreniere - Trocheck - Vesey
Cuylle - Chytil - Kakko
Goodrow/UFA - Brodz/UFA - Motte

 

[bleedblue94]

Cuylle should be guaranteed a roster spot in training camp

no he shouldn't, and guaranteeing roster spots for kids is another step towards entitlement. you hope he grabs a spot, but he needs to be competing with someone for the spot.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Then again, I still have hope that Panarin could fit what we were doing if we actually did something as a team instead of "everyone jump in the pool."

This was probably true 3 years ago.

I don't think it is now. Outside of playing like an asshole when the chips have been down, theres been a clear drop off in his skill set which has fed into him becoming really one dimensional and easy to defend.

The only ways to really feed into him being successful IMO are either to become rush centric (which I DON'T want, these teams end up getting eaten and it's going to take a while to build the team up to do this) or to play him with Matt Tkachuk.

 

[NYR Viper]

I have gone back and forth on Panarin. I can honestly say that if Drury found a way to off-load Panarin and bring back, say, someone like Duchene, I wouldn't be that upset. In saying that, I am starting to see Panarin more as Jagr in terms of needing the RIGHT players to play with in lieu of the best players. IF Drury can find a couple of low salaried guys who fit in with Panarin, similar to how Strome and Fast did so not that long ago, having him on his own line creates matchup nightmares for most teams.

 

[McRanger92]

no he shouldn't, and guaranteeing roster spots for kids is another step towards entitlement. you hope he grabs a spot, but he needs to be competing with someone for the spot.

I wish the team had some entitlement. Too many Betas

He did not want to live in NYC anymore, it wasnt about term or money, he just did not want to be in NYC. people need to understand that NYC is not for everyone. let it go...

I said there were other options. Unless you know him personally its all conjecture.

 

[bleedblue94]

If you want a team like chicago to take panarin you need to figure out what you are giving them with panarin to take that deal. they have the cap room to do it and MAYBE he would waive to go there, but if you want to send a f***ing jolt through this org and trade panarin and laffy to the hawks for pick 20, pick 44, and jason dickinson? You open up a tremendous amount of flexibility but now you have tanked the lw depth. cap space is an asset in itself and this opens up a lot of options for them to change the mix here. also, is goodrow a guy they would have interest in for culture and to help the team with this kid coming in bc almost everyone has acknowledged that they need to add some vet pieces to help insulate bedard when he comes in bc their roster is barebones.

if you take contracts out of the equation and just look at players and styles, who in the forward group do you want to remove?

 

[surlysailor]

He did not want to live in NYC anymore, it wasnt about term or money, he just did not want to be in NYC. people need to understand that NYC is not for everyone. let it go...

Link? I really don't remember that being a thing I could be wrong but the only thing I remember was that he wanted a 3 year deal and Gorton said no to that. Also iirc Gorton was thinking long term, not just that season and thought that 3 mil in the 3rd year might not work for NYR cap. Strome had arb, ADA was up and coming before that whole fiasco. That was a bad decision to let him walk but I think that's the diff between Drury & Gorton, Gorton had a long term plan vs signing Goodrow for more money and term.

 

[McRanger92]

Kreider - Zibanejad - Panarin
Lafreniere - Trocheck - Vesey
Cuylle - Chytil - Kakko
Goodrow/UFA - Brodz/UFA - Motte

Yuck

 

[bleedblue94]

I wish the team had some entitlement. Too many Betas



I said there were other options. Unless you know him personally its all conjecture.

You dont think this team has entitlement? alphas have entitlement, i dont know why you are saying we have betas. we have alphas but they chose to not direct that into the on ice.

i am aware that he did not want to be in NYC and I will leave it at that. Covid did not help with the lifestyle at the time in that area/state, and that was kind of the cherry on top.

 

[McRanger92]

You dont think this team has entitlement? alphas have entitlement, i dont know why you are saying we have betas. we have alphas but they chose to not direct that into the on ice.

i am aware that he did not want to be in NYC and I will leave it at that. Covid did not help with the lifestyle at the time in that area/state, and that was kind of the cherry on top.

Management can guarantee Cuylle a roster spot without telling him about it lol. Making the young players reach some arbitrary benchmark to "earn it" has gone horribly for the organization.

 

[bleedblue94]

Management can guarantee Cuylle a roster spot without telling him about it lol. Making the young players reach some arbitrary benchmark to "earn it" has gone horribly for the organization.

you think players dont look at depth charts and cant figure out what is going to happen? come on ha

you need internal competition, we dont have that here and havent had it for awhile. you can see that with the team. everyone is entitled to their slot on this roster and they know it

Link? I really don't remember that being a thing I could be wrong but the only thing I remember was that he wanted a 3 year deal and Gorton said no to that. Also iirc Gorton was thinking long term, not just that season and thought that 3 mil in the 3rd year might not work for NYR cap. Strome had arb, ADA was up and coming before that whole fiasco. That was a bad decision to let him walk but I think that's the diff between Drury & Gorton, Gorton had a long term plan vs signing Goodrow for more money and term.

no link, i am vetted on this site by Sniper and i will leave it at that.

 

[surlysailor]

I don't think you will ever get fair value for Panarin, and there's no one to use the money on that will help NYR get into the playoffs again the following season. Sure the next summer move Panarin if you think you can get Matthews/Aho but then it's ok to take a lesser return to whoever he might want to go because you're clearing the cap space for a FA. This off season Drury needs to make shrewd deals. Bring in guys with something to prove on 1 year deals. Trade Goodrow and hopefully you don't have to give up a good asset to do that, but everyone knows NYR are cap strapped (similar to Van who is trying to give away Garland but teams are asking for a high pick to take that on). Also find a coach that. won't rely on so heavy on players. Fox on PP1 & top pair but maybe don't run him out so much on the PK. Give CK 3rd line minutes so you give him more energy on PP & PK. Use the kids more on 5v5 and hope that gives them a boost. Pair Panarin with someone on a prove it deal, someone who can go in and hound pucks down. I honestly try and find a Hagelin type, guy who can get in behind the D and just move the puck to Panarin. I know he hasn't played much but I'd give AJF a contract. I always thought he could be Hags 2.0 if put in the right situation but if not at worst he's a 13F.

 

[bleedblue94]

Yuck

as long as panarin is here we are going to be trying to find a way to make the roster work bc it is always about where do we put him to either A. make him work B. not be as much of a liability C. try to stuff guys into other roles to work around the panarin issue.

this guy needs to go so the org can move forward

 

[Filip Chytil]

I always try to think, "ok this is what this guy does, and this is what he doesn't do, so these need to be his linemates."

What Lafreniere does is throw Tanner Glass hits and chew gum, and what he doesn't do is be good at hockey.

We need a guy who does everything to be his linemate.

Let's get Matthew Tkachuk.

Conspiracy theory:

AV, a fellow French-Canadian, is actually Laf's dad. AV chewed a ton of gum too and adored Tanner Glass and turned his son into the French-Canadian version of Tanner to get revenge on the Rangers.

Waiting on DNA tests to confirm this.

 

[bleedblue94]

This, I don't think you will ever get fair value for Panarin, and there's no one to use the money on that will help NYR get into the playoffs again the following season. Sure the next summer move Panarin if you think you can get Matthews/Aho but then it's ok to take a lesser return to whoever he might want to go because you're clearing the cap space for a FA. This off season Drury needs to make shrewd deals. Bring in guys with something to prove on 1 year deals. Trade Goodrow and hopefully you don't have to give up a good asset to do that, but everyone knows NYR are cap strapped (similar to Van who is trying to give away Garland but teams are asking for a high pick to take that on). Also find a coach that. won't rely on so heavy on players. Fox on PP1 & top pair but maybe don't run him out so much on the PK. Give CK 3rd line minutes so you give him more energy on PP & PK. Use the kids more on 5v5 and hope that gives them a boost. Pair Panarin with someone on a prove it deal, someone who can go in and hound pucks down. I honestly try and find a Hagelin type, guy who can get in behind the D and just move the puck to Panarin. I know he hasn't played much but I'd give AJF a contract. I always thought he could be Hags 2.0 if put in the right situation but if not at worst he's a 13F.

Again, cap space is an asset.
Laffy is also going in the deal.
You are not getting value on the surface but I think that kind of deal saves some face, opens flexibility, and prevents you from a possible mess with laffy's contract this summer.

Just because there is not a clear view of where the money would be spent today doesn't mean that having the flexibility to make something wont be invaluable. and you bring up trying to make space for next summer, let me ask you this: do you think it would be easier to clear the salary this summer or next summer when panarin is a year older (almost 33) and multiple other teams will be looking to clear salary to go after those same players? it is smarter to do it now if you can.

 

[NYR Viper]

I don't see a concern with signing some vets to compete with and possibly start on the NHL roster, pushing guys like Cuylle and Othmann to the AHL to start the season unless they blow the doors off of the competition. Injuries will occur. Let them get big minutes in the AHL to start the year.

 

[Machinehead]

My other issue with trading Panarin right now is that we don't exactly have the LW depth we think we do.

Lafreniere does not need to be forced into a top six role.

 

[Machinehead]

I don't see a concern with signing some vets to compete with and possibly start on the NHL roster, pushing guys like Cuylle and Othmann to the AHL to start the season unless they blow the doors off of the competition. Injuries will occur. Let them get big minutes in the AHL to start the year.

My only concern with that is that we have like $100 in cap space.

 

[McRanger92]

you think players dont look at depth charts and cant figure out what is going to happen? come on ha

you need internal competition, we dont have that here and havent had it for awhile. you can see that with the team. everyone is entitled to their slot on this roster and they know it


no link, i am vetted on this site by Sniper and i will leave it at that.

We have plenty of internal competition. Unfortunately it's rigged in favor of the veterans who can do whatever they want without a role or ice time change, and the Kids fall down the pecking order for the same mistakes.

 

[bleedblue94]

We have plenty of internal competition. Unfortunately it's rigged in favor of the veterans who can do whatever they want without a role or ice time change, and the Kids fall down the pecking order for the same mistakes.

What competition? You dont have competition if it is rigged, and what you described (accurate) is literally the complete opposite of competition haha.

Players here for the last 2 years knew their spot and their role. There was no competition bc regardless of play and such players still had their role. Trouba even alluded to this as an issue the night of the helmet toss.

 

[surlysailor]

Again, cap space is an asset.
Laffy is also going in the deal.
You are not getting value on the surface but I think that kind of deal saves some face, opens flexibility, and prevents you from a possible mess with laffy's contract this summer.

Just because there is not a clear view of where the money would be spent today doesn't mean that having the flexibility to make something wont be invaluable. and you bring up trying to make space for next summer, let me ask you this: do you think it would be easier to clear the salary this summer or next summer when panarin is a year older (almost 33) and multiple other teams will be looking to clear salary to go after those same players? it is smarter to do it now if you can.

I get that cap is an asset, but drury is not going to tear this team down. Also you are throwing away a 90 point player, a 21 y/o first overall pick who may not be what we hoped for but is at least a top 9 player for 2 picks who may not be ready for at least 3-4 years, a complete scrub. Then Drury since he is in a cup or bust mode is going throw money away for a mediocre fa crop or give up other assets for players just to fill in the holes he created? For what? An at best a prayer to get into the playoffs? Also it’s not like Laf is going to command a ton as a rfa, he’s got to get the same if not maybe .1 more than KK.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I'd love to get all of Panarin's space off the books in its entirety, but the reality is that if he's moved its probably going to take retention AND taking back some salary.

Taking back salary makes more sense for where this team is right now since you want bodies you can use now rather than just draft picks who won't be ready to help for 3-5 years. Hopefully Barkov continues to be underwhelming for Florida en route to them getting pumped by Carolina and they think that Panarin is the antidote.