Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XXXVII

[mas0764]

This is not a reactionary post to the last few games or anything like that and I know he has a mnc but IF the opportunity presents itself to move panarin and his contract you gotta do it.

It may be the only way that the kids are allowed to actually take another step into legitimate positions in this roster, his style since the injury is married to perimeter play, he is turning 31, and while he accumulates points now I just don't see this going a good direction over the next 4 years.

I really thought copp would be resigned but his play has badly deteriorated as the playoffs have gone on and other guys have gotten better.

Please do not make a dollar and term commitment to a player to help manage panarin bc he's here. The youth on this team is primed to take another step of ownership of this team, this summer is the time to give them that opportunity and accept some growing pains. Backfill them with a competent 3rd line (vatrano can come back as a 3rw for starters).

Stroke can't go away soon enough.

Everyone here keeps talking about getting Kreider or trouba to waive their nmc clauses but the guy to try on is panarin. It realistically won't happen but I do wonder if Drury will try. Would be very curious to know if Drury was a fan of that signing when it happened.

I am not inherently against the idea of moving Panarin but the main benefit can't be the cap space like it would be with moving Trouba. You might get picks or prospects also if you can talk Trouba into waiving, but it's not going to be a massive haul.

With Panarin, I might be open to it, but you also need a massive haul back.

Like, two firsts, a young top 6 C prospect, and another piece.

We were offering something like Strome or Buch, a first, a defensive prospect, and Chytil for Eichel. It would have to be like that.

I don't know that I want the NHL ready piece, because we have prospects and young players ready to take the wing spot Panarin's departure would open up.

So I'll take two firsts and a highly regarded Lundell-level center prospect and maybe a throw-in.

I don't necessarily hate it. I've long maintained we cut off the rebuild too early in regards to our forward depth. This would finish it off.

Panarin is a huge cost, but, he's also 30.

I don't really believe this team is going to win a Cup or Cups as we are seeing right this moment. If you could get a 3-for-1 to finalize your future forward core, I'm listening.

The savings allow you to lock up Kakko, Chytil, Miller and Laf, and also keep Copp, Motte, Vatrano, etc.

 

[Ola]

I agree 110% with @Kocur26. Hit the breaks.

We are a helluva team. We have a helluva core. Best goalie, one of the better bluelines, a top PP, young nukes. The phase we stand in front of should in no shape way or form be described with a word starting with "re....." anything.

But given that Fox, Ziba and Shesty's monster contracts all kick in July 1, Kakko's 2nd contract kicks in on July 1 (or probably a later date, but you get the drift), and we have no contract coming of the books -- either this summer or next, except 3m in BO money -- in addition to Miller, Laf and Chytil requiring new contracts next summer, we should not spend money on UFAs this summer.

For me it boils down to one simple question. If we keep one of Strome and Copp -- are we a legit top 2-3 contender next season? Like we all know that if we sign one of them to a long term deal, it will cost us tremendously next summer and down the road. And I just don't see it. Tampa made the Conference Finals the first time with Hedman and co and then missed the POs the next year. Sometimes you got to give it time. I think we will be good even without betting on a safe horse in Copp.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Souring on Copp is too reactionary IMO.

 

[cheech70]

Add in the fact that we need a top 6 RW and relatively cheap talent.

His agent would be stupid not to convince him to play nice.

And Russia is a shit show with even personal assets not secure with a madman running the country into the ground. USA safest haven in the world.

 

[LiveLongandProspal]

Re-sign: Motte, Blais (if the price is right), Kakko, Vatrano (if the price is right), Copp (if 4.5M or less, which IDK), Braun (if for 2M or less).

The rest can walk.

Shop Trouba and Panarin. Getting out of either contract would give us major breathing room. I doubt it'll happen and they probably won't waive, but it would go a long way to opening up cap space to sign guys like Laf, Kakko and K'Andre long-term

Trade bait: Georgiev (LOL), Hajek (double LOL), Lundkvist, Chytil (yes, even Chytil), Nemeth (get him the F off this team). And I'd even move Kakko for the right deal if the belief is that he's not going to improve and they can salvage any kind of value he has. I'd even look into trading Lindgren too, because he's unfortunately going to break down sooner or later. He's a warrior, but unfortunately those players have shelf lives.


Kreider-Zibanejad-Vatrano
Panarin-TRADE-Kravtsov
Lafreniere-Copp-Kakko
Cuylle-Goodrow-Motte
Reaves
Rydahl


Lindgren-Fox
K'Andre-Trouba
Jones-Schneider
Braun


Igor
NEW BACKUP!

 

[NYR Viper]

I'm not getting the apprehension with signing Copp who has fit in really nicely on this team. He should come in at, or just over $5m per season. That's a good number for a 2nd line player, specifically one who is a center (or should be). Give him a NMC in years 1-3 and then a NTC like Trouba and Kreider in years 4-6 and get his cap hit at or around $5m. It fits. It gives Chytil more time to mature and best case scenario, we have Copp playing 3C on a contender as well as prime PK time.

 

[SA16]

If Blais doesn't play game 6 I'm not re-signing him. This is the playoffs. Everyone plays hurt. If he's not willing to make that sacrifice then he's not a guy you win with in the future.

 

[Chalfdiggity3]

Re-sign: Motte, Blais (if the price is right), Kakko, Vatrano (if the price is right), Copp (if 4.5M or less, which IDK), Braun (if for 2M or less).

The rest can walk.

Shop Trouba and Panarin. Getting out of either contract would give us major breathing room. I doubt it'll happen and they probably won't waive, but it would go a long way to opening up cap space to sign guys like Laf, Kakko and K'Andre long-term

Trade bait: Georgiev (LOL), Hajek (double LOL), Lundkvist, Chytil (yes, even Chytil), Nemeth (get him the F off this team). And I'd even move Kakko for the right deal if the belief is that he's not going to improve and they can salvage any kind of value he has. I'd even look into trading Lindgren too, because he's unfortunately going to break down sooner or later. He's a warrior, but unfortunately those players have shelf lives.


Kreider-Zibanejad-Vatrano
Panarin-TRADE-Kravtsov
Lafreniere-Copp-Kakko
Cuylle-Goodrow-Motte
Reaves
Rydahl


Lindgren-Fox
K'Andre-Trouba
Jones-Schneider
Braun


Igor
NEW BACKUP!

Im good with shopping trouba or panarin and even what you stated about possiby finding a deal for chytl and kakko even though i dont think we should be looking to move any of our young forwards. Esp since they are all under 23yo..

That lindgren talk is just nonsense. You want to move on from Lindgren why? for 3m per off the books? Bc he may break down at the age of 30-31 like girardi? He just turned 24! Thats at least 6 years away. You want to unload one of if not the ONLY warrior on the backend bc he may break down in 6 years? COME ON.

Panarin go for it. Im tired of his play. Cant stand it. THe lack of everything is disgusting.
Trouba it all depends if we think Schnieder is ready to make the step up.

 

[pld459666]

Because the idea of the letter and the rebuild was to construct a long term contender, and if you toss that out the window to accomodate the peaks of a couple thirty year olds that's a bad idea.

You have a long term core of Shesterkin, Fox, Lafreniere, Kakko, Chytil, Kravtsov, Othmann, Miller, Jones, Robertson, Lundkvist, etc, etc.

You still need a center or two for THAT group. It needs to be similarly aged to grow with them. It only gets harder to find those guys later and you can't count on plucking one out of free agency later as you are going to be cash strapped.



That's an overpay but I like your thought process.

Slight, but worth it i think.

 

[pld459666]

If Blais doesn't play game 6 I'm not re-signing him. This is the playoffs. Everyone plays hurt. If he's not willing to make that sacrifice then he's not a guy you win with in the future.

This is a bit extreme. This is not a fractured wrist or ankle.

I get the premise, but I'm still resigning him whether he suits up or not

 

[HANK30]

Any chance on signing Pasternak? Sounds like he's going to hit FA in 2023 with Cassidy gone in Boston

 

[bbny]

Re-sign: Motte, Blais (if the price is right), Kakko, Vatrano (if the price is right), Copp (if 4.5M or less, which IDK), Braun (if for 2M or less).

The rest can walk.

Shop Trouba and Panarin. Getting out of either contract would give us major breathing room. I doubt it'll happen and they probably won't waive, but it would go a long way to opening up cap space to sign guys like Laf, Kakko and K'Andre long-term

Trade bait: Georgiev (LOL), Hajek (double LOL), Lundkvist, Chytil (yes, even Chytil), Nemeth (get him the F off this team). And I'd even move Kakko for the right deal if the belief is that he's not going to improve and they can salvage any kind of value he has. I'd even look into trading Lindgren too, because he's unfortunately going to break down sooner or later. He's a warrior, but unfortunately those players have shelf lives.


Kreider-Zibanejad-Vatrano
Panarin-TRADE-Kravtsov
Lafreniere-Copp-Kakko
Cuylle-Goodrow-Motte
Reaves
Rydahl


Lindgren-Fox
K'Andre-Trouba
Jones-Schneider
Braun


Igor
NEW BACKUP!

There’s not enough cap space for all of that

 

[rangers1314]

If Blais doesn't play game 6 I'm not re-signing him. This is the playoffs. Everyone plays hurt. If he's not willing to make that sacrifice then he's not a guy you win with in the future.

You understand that he needs to be medically cleared to play right? It's not like they are asking him and he's saying "no".

Also, people need to chillout around here with Blais. Was I asleep when this dude turned into an offensive dynamo? He's a bottom 6 winger. Relax.

Any chance on signing Pasternak? Sounds like he's going to hit FA in 2023 with Cassidy gone in Boston

He and his agents are going to talk to Boston over the next few weeks prior to the draft. If no deal can be made he will be traded at/around the draft for a major price. That trade will also come with an agreed upon extension with the team acquiring him.

 

[WojtekWolski86]

If Blais doesn't play game 6 I'm not re-signing him. This is the playoffs. Everyone plays hurt. If he's not willing to make that sacrifice then he's not a guy you win with in the future.

Do you think the guy that blew out his knee from a cheap slew foot and has watched his team go all the way to the conf finals from the sideline after having to watch his last team go to the Cup is wilfully holding back from playing?

Time to check your house for carbon monoxide.

 

[I Eat Crow]

Guys, guys, guys. Look again at who posted about Blais.

 

[WojtekWolski86]

Options not in any specific order.
1) you reload this current team as much as possible to try another run.
2) let go of all expiring contracts and hand the keys over to the kids for promoted roles. Might mean a step back for a season or 2 but they've earned the opportunity
3) move a core piece with a big contract or 2 to reconstruct the current make up. For example, Panarin, Kreider, Trouba. Likely Panarin and Trouba are the most expendable. Trading Kreider you might as well deal Mika and rebuild that's how close those two are. That's like trading Zuke and keeping Hank.

Panarin Ziba Kreider
Laf Chytil Kaako
Othmann Goodrow Kravtsov
Motte cheap 4c Blais
EF: Reaves, Cheap vet

Miller Fox
Lindgren Schneider
Jones Trouba

Igor
Cheap backup

Give the kids the keys to the lambo

 

[NoQuitInNewMexico]

Blais is a weird "eye test" player for me where I'm not sure how much he'll ever score, but his hands are legitimately very good and not just for a big guy or a physical guy. I think he had the same situation as Brandon Dubinsky where he was a small skill guy who had a huge growth spurt either right before the draft or right after.

Like the Buch trade was still a mess, but it makes sense that they saw something in the player. Could have even been an attempt to bring in "our own Tom Wilson" because he has some of the traits and Wilson was on their fourth line forever, though I don't think Sammy just destroys people in fights like that

 

[pld459666]

Based on what this team has done in rounds 1 and 2, I cannot rule out a Game Seven in NY. Granted this is not Pitt or Carolina we are playing, these guys down in Tampa know how to win and the series could be over tomorrow night. I still look at what we did and how we played in those other series, backs to the wall, and know that there is an absolute chance we push this to game 7 and however small, a berth in the finals.

That said, If we lose, I will be pissed, but am also rational enough to know that this was a hell of a run that came a season or 2 too early which I think actually bodes well for the 7 kids on the roster 24 and younger.

This playoffs for me is all about the lessons that can be learned about what is needed to take the next step in our evolution as a hockey club.

I still think we are way too much of a perimeter team and that's something we will need to correct. Getting Blais re-signed for next year and beyond will be a step in the right direction.

Moving on from Strome is a must and Copp maybe as well and I was of the opinion that Copp was a must in terms of re-signing.

I like what I saw out of the Kid line these playoffs and would make it a priority to have those three man the 2nd line in 22-23. Shift Panarin to the RW with CK and Mika and make sure that Lafreniere is on the 1st PP unit. Both Chytil and Kakko on PP2.

Biggest issue would be to add a 3rd line center with decent offensive ability, size and a good dose of sandpaper. I would check with Nashville to see what they would want for Trenin, I mentioned in another post about checking with Chicago about Dach.

If we could add one or the other, I'd mix and match the bottom six with Goodrow, Blais, Motte, Brodzinsky (Trenin or Dach) Othmann, Cuylle, Trivigno.

Nemeth and Braun have to go. Bring in Jones or Lundkvist for that bottom pairing and bring up the overall team speed from the back end.

Ideally, my 2022-23 team would look like this:

Kreider - Zibanejad - Panarin
Lafreniere - Chytil - Kakko
Goodrow/Othmann - Trenin/Dach - Blais/Trivigno
Goodrow/Cuylle - Brodzinsky - Motte/Blais

Lindgren - Fox
Miller - Trouba
Jones - Schneider

Igor

I do not think this team really knows how good it actually is. We see glimpses of it in certain situations but it's not there consistently. Once they know and can play that was consistently, they are going to be very dangerous.

 

[Off Sides]

Options not in any specific order.
1) you reload this current team as much as possible to try another run.
2) let go of all expiring contracts and hand the keys over to the kids for promoted roles. Might mean a step back for a season or 2 but they've earned the opportunity
3) move a core piece with a big contract or 2 to reconstruct the current make up. For example, Panarin, Kreider, Trouba. Likely Panarin and Trouba are the most expendable. Trading Kreider you might as well deal Mika and rebuild that's how close those two are. That's like trading Zuke and keeping Hank.

Panarin Ziba Kreider
Laf Chytil Kaako
Othmann Goodrow Kravtsov
Motte cheap 4c Blais
EF: Reaves, Cheap vet

Miller Fox
Lindgren Schneider
Jones Trouba

Igor
Cheap backup

Give the kids the keys to the lambo

I'd at least like to see them see what Copp wanted in extension to stay, especially if he did not require a super restrictive clause, but other than that I agree.

 

[huerter]

Gilbert line: Laf - Chytil - Kakko
Messier line: Panarin - Copp - Tyler Johnson (50%)
Hadfield line: Motte - Goodrow - Blais/Reaves
Ratelle line: Kreider - Zibanejad - Rielly Smith

 

[Machinehead]

The biggest priority in the offseason has to be getting better at even strength.

There should be easy fixes. Get Vatrano off the top line. Break up the Bobbsey Twins. Play the kids more.

Souring on Copp is too reactionary IMO.

Copp is going to be expensive in an area where I don't think we need to pay much. Panarin is not only fine with marginal players, he thrives with them.

Copp has been fine and has put up points but that line still completely sucks 5v5. He hasn't been the answer to Panarin struggling. Telling Strome to f*** off is going to be the answer.

 

[McRanger92]

Panarin needs to play with guys who can finish their chances. Him Mika & Kreider can make it work playing together next year. Keep the kid line together but give them too 6 minutes. If it ain’t broke don’t fix it.

Copp is a tough call. I think the injury is limiting him. I like the idea of Blais-Copp-Kravtsov as a heavy, skilled forechecking line. Bring back motte or a comparable player for the fourth line with Goodrow & Hunt/Reaves/Brodzinski. Cuylle & Othmann could also mix in to give the team some energy.

The defense & goaltending isnt a worry. The top 4 is as good as anyone in the league with Miller’s emergence. He needs to QB PP2 next year and lead the team in minutes to preserve Fox & Lindgren. Schneider I expect a big jump with this experience he’s getting. Still have Lundkvist/Jones/Robertson (willing to bet he’s the one NYR like most) to play with.

Still think we have a puncher’s chance this series, but that’s how I feel going into the off-season regardless

 

[Boris Zubov]

Gilbert line: Laf - Chytil - Kakko
Messier line: Panarin - Copp - Tyler Johnson (50%)
Hadfield line: Motte - Goodrow - Blais/Reaves
Ratelle line: Kreider - Zibanejad - Rielly Smith

Bro, you post some wacky shit all the time, but Tyler Johnson? Really?

 

[rangers1314]

The biggest priority in the offseason has to be getting better at even strength.

What about the idea of looking to make a move for a legit top4 offensive LHD?

 

[Machinehead]

What about the idea of looking to make a move for a legit top4 offensive LHD?

Lindgren is fine and I don't think we have the cap to bring in a big defensman without letting other holes just rot.