Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XXXIV

[TheBloodyNine]

I think you will find that a lot of posters, including myself, generally agree with your views. Poll the board and a lot of us will acknowledge this is most likely a one and done playoff team with a lot of holes and a few more years of growth to go. But who wants to be hit over the head with that reality every day?

Isn't the purpose of this board to analyze and discuss how the team is playing? If they are playing bad people should be allowed to say how they are playing bad, and they play bad often, so that's why you get those opinions from me. I don't think there is a rule on this board that says "opinions must always be positive" right? This isn't Reddit thank god haha.

I don't think blind optimism is helping just as much as blind pessimism does, but when there is actual evidence to back up the pessimism, it looks a lot less blind. This team is little more than Fox and Shesterkin and Kreider right now, and that's been the case since October. People's response to that is usually to point to the standings, but they are quickly dropping down them, and the reason they got there is because they had the third easiest schedule in the early part of this season. That's reality. Being endlessly positive isn't going to change that. I know you will say being endlessly negative won't either, and you're not wrong, but at least we could then discuss the aspects of the team that need to change in order for them to become champions - what we all want them to be.

 

[duhmetreE]

Isn't the purpose of this board to analyze and discuss how the team is playing? If they are playing bad people should be allowed to say how they are playing bad, and they play bad often, so that's why you get those opinions from me. I don't think there is a rule on this board that says "opinions must always be positive" right? This isn't Reddit thank god haha.

I don't think blind optimism is helping just as much as blind pessimism does, but when there is actual evidence to back up the pessimism, it looks a lot less blind. This team is little more than Fox and Shesterkin and Kreider right now, and that's been the case since October. People's response to that is usually to point to the standings, but they are quickly dropping down them, and the reason they got there is because they had the third easiest schedule in the early part of this season. That's reality. Being endlessly positive isn't going to change that. I know you will say being endlessly negative won't either, and you're not wrong, but at least we could then discuss the aspects of the team that need to change in order for them to become champions - what we all want them to be.

This place would be Reddit when they ban 'wrong think' or what the mods deemed unacceptable.

Bounce ideas/thoughts off of eachother. I'm glad that not everyone thinks the same. Trying to shut someone up because they don't think like you is a major issue in modern day society

 

[DanielBrassard]

This place would be Reddit when they ban 'wrong think' or what the mods deemed unacceptable.

Bounce ideas/thoughts off of eachother. I'm glad that not everyone thinks the same. Trying to shut someone up because they don't think like you is a major issue in modern day society

It would be terribly boring if there were no dissenting opinions. But I don't care how you choose to root, if you want to be optimistic that's perfectly reasonable, if you are more pessimistic or negative I think that's fair as well. If the team was one of the better teams in the league where it really matters, there would be a lot less negativity that's for sure.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

This place would be Reddit when they ban 'wrong think' or what the mods deemed unacceptable.

Bounce ideas/thoughts off of eachother. I'm glad that not everyone thinks the same. Trying to shut someone up because they don't think like you is a major issue in modern day society

100%.

 

[Fitzy]

I don't think the issue is NYR 'playing the wrong way' so much as it is that this team just doesn't have a lot of depth at forward.

All the skill is in four forwards up front.

Lafreniere, Kakko, Chytil, Gauthier are projects. They've all been really disappointing this season to the extent that we would probably be better off with replacement level players in those spots.

Hunt, Rooney, Reaves are all 4th line level players, some of whom are being asked to do way too much.

The 3rd pairing has been a concern all season. Schneider has added some stability but he's one of two guys we need there when healthy.

The roster makeup is more like 2006 than 2014. All the scoring is coming from a few top players. Our D corps is a lot more talented than 2006 but there's a lot of youth and inexperience. In 2006 we added Sykora but lost Rucinsky to injury. Prucha got stifled in the playoffs, no secondary scoring, game over.

So management has a really tough choice to make here- they could go out and get a few veteran players to try to piece together a balanced roster at the last minute, but doing so would likely see Chytil, Kakko, and Lafreniere either demoted to limited 3rd line minutes or out of the lineup altogether. Or, we can continue to focus on developing the young players and hoping they come along before Panarin, Zib, Kreider start to decline too badly.

Most of NYR's problems this season lie pretty heavily on the heads of a few players.

Georgiev
Kakko
Lafreniere
Chytil
Nemeth

Have all been performing WAY below expectations. How long are we willing to be patient as our stars enter their 30s?

 

[TominNC]

I get the feeling no matter how the team is playing some people would not be happy. And they actually have one of the easier schedules through the second half.

 

[IDvsEGO]

I don't think the issue is NYR 'playing the wrong way' so much as it is that this team just doesn't have a lot of depth at forward.

All the skill is in four forwards up front.

Lafreniere, Kakko, Chytil, Gauthier are projects. They've all been really disappointing this season to the extent that we would probably be better off with replacement level players in those spots.

Hunt, Rooney, Reaves are all 4th line level players, some of whom are being asked to do way too much.

The 3rd pairing has been a concern all season. Schneider has added some stability but he's one of two guys we need there when healthy.

The roster makeup is more like 2006 than 2014. All the scoring is coming from a few top players. Our D corps is a lot more talented than 2006 but there's a lot of youth and inexperience. In 2006 we added Sykora but lost Rucinsky to injury. Prucha got stifled in the playoffs, no secondary scoring, game over.

So management has a really tough choice to make here- they could go out and get a few veteran players to try to piece together a balanced roster at the last minute, but doing so would likely see Chytil, Kakko, and Lafreniere either demoted to limited 3rd line minutes or out of the lineup altogether. Or, we can continue to focus on developing the young players and hoping they come along before Panarin, Zib, Kreider start to decline too badly.

Most of NYR's problems this season lie pretty heavily on the heads of a few players.

Georgiev
Kakko
Lafreniere
Chytil
Nemeth

Have all been performing WAY below expectations. How long are we willing to be patient as our stars enter their 30s?

I dont disagree that the rangers are top heavy right now, but Laf looked good w mika / ck last night and I think just needs a quick spark to get going and we'll see that line start really controlling play at 5v5.
That then moves Kakko to line 2 when he's healthy, The kakko panarin strome line was a 5v5 dominant line.
That then still leaves us top heavy, but to the extent that it doesn't actually matter.

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

The roster makeup is more like 2006 than 2014. All the scoring is coming from a few top players. Our D corps is a lot more talented than 2006 but there's a lot of youth and inexperience. In 2006 we added Sykora but lost Rucinsky to injury. Prucha got stifled in the playoffs, no secondary scoring, game over.

This should be glued to every post and the entire New York Rangers HF section along with "expectations were to make the playoffs AND MAYBE win a round."

All the very heavy or very fast teams have thumped the Rangers this year; Colorado, Vegas, Carolina, Calgary, Minnesota, and I'd even throw in LA to that group.

Once again, this team is not having a long run. They might get lucky and beat Washington/Pittsburgh in round 1. We can't say how the Rangers match up against either because we haven't seen it yet. The Washington game from October doesn't count because both teams have drastically changed since then.

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

I get the feeling no matter how the team is playing some people would not be happy. And they actually have one of the easier schedules through the second half.

This board hated the 2016-17 group but imagine this roster plays like with depth scoring. They'd still find something to criticize.

 

[NoQuitInNewMexico]

The point total doesn't mean we're the 5th best team in the league or whatever it is now, it just means we have a good cushion to try things and get our shit together and still make the playoffs

 

[cheech70]

Quick side note after seeing my buddy Zuke...what was the result of that trade? Who do we have from it. TIA

 

[Fitzy]

Quick side note after seeing my buddy Zuke...what was the result of that trade? Who do we have from it. TIA

Matthew Robertson is the biggest part of that return. He's gonna be a long play rather than a short play to the NHL though. I'd say fall of 2023.

 

[Crease]

Quick side note after seeing my buddy Zuke...what was the result of that trade? Who do we have from it. TIA

Matthew Robertson and Oliver Tarnstrom.

 

[RickChartraw]

Quick side note after seeing my buddy Zuke...what was the result of that trade? Who do we have from it. TIA

Matt Robertson (D)
Oliver Tarnstrom (C)

 

[Brief Candle]

I don't think the issue is NYR 'playing the wrong way' so much as it is that this team just doesn't have a lot of depth at forward.

I couldn't agree more here. I like Gallant's vision. I think he understands the modern game extremely well along with his coaching staff. The issue we have is that while I think we look stellar as far as defensive development is concerned, my god are we weak on forwards.

We effectively have the possibility for one functional NHL line that's even remotely a threat. The rest are hardly even mediocre, and when faced with a couple of injuries to even borderline players, we fall apart. A lot of our early success was puck luck. How many times did we all say "I don't know how we pulled THAT off".

No team expects to have four god-tier lines, but we're just not nearly as close as our record would suggest. We have too many "roll players" who are neither gritty enough or skillful enough to REALLY compete.

I really do think Gallant is the right guy for this team. He only has so much to work with, though. The question is, how do you replace half a team? It's a bit of a mess, really.

 

[NoQuitInNewMexico]

Didn't the league change the rules after that trade, because the conditional pick made it too hard for Dallas to offer a fair deal to their player?

 

[Fitzy]

I dont disagree that the rangers are top heavy right now, but Laf looked good w mika / ck last night and I think just needs a quick spark to get going and we'll see that line start really controlling play at 5v5.
That then moves Kakko to line 2 when he's healthy, The kakko panarin strome line was a 5v5 dominant line.
That then still leaves us top heavy, but to the extent that it doesn't actually matter.

If NYR can find a way to integrate Laf and Kakko into the top 2 lines such that they aren't a net drag on the line's productivity, then great.

It's still going to be very tough to make a deep run with the third line in shambles. Goodrow NEEDS to center that line, because a 3rd line of Laf-Chytil-Gauthier is bad enough to lose you the series on it's own.

Laf-Mika-Kreider
Panarin-Strome-Kakko
Chytil-Goodrow-???
Hunt-Rooney-Reaves

You can stabilize that roster by renting a guy like Smith for 3RW, but is that worth it? There's a chance of winning the cup every time you make the playoffs. Don't think, on the other hand that boosting that chance from like 2% to 2.2% with a rental is worth it. Let it be a learning experience. Few young teams go deep their first dance. If we end up losing in the Eastern Conference finals I'll gladly eat crow about thinking this team was still a year away at least.

If NYR think this veteran core is the one they have to win with, you have to start thinking about potential veteran trade returns for guys like Chytil, Kakko, Laf, Lundkvist.

 

[IDvsEGO]

This should be glued to every post and the entire New York Rangers HF section along with "expectations were to make the playoffs AND MAYBE win a round."

All the very heavy or very fast teams have thumped the Rangers this year; Colorado, Vegas, Carolina, Calgary, Minnesota, and I'd even throw in LA to that group.

Once again, this team is not having a long run. They might get lucky and beat Washington/Pittsburgh in round 1. We can't say how the Rangers match up against either because we haven't seen it yet. The Washington game from October doesn't count because both teams have drastically changed since then.

I mean are we closer to 2006 in the sense that we have offensively talented players, absolutely.
2014 we essentially rolled 3 lines that were almost all 2nd lines in terms of talent.
in 2022 we're rolling 2 lines that are producing like 1st lines and a 3rd line thats on the weaker end, with a 4th line thats bottom end of the league.

An additional difference is we have a defense thats far better than 2006 and even 2014. And thats not a disrespect to 2014.

 

[Crease]

They have too many guys who don’t produce enough to justify their lack of defense or don’t defend enough to justify their lack of production. A lot of tweeners. They’re being carried by the Big Four, Fox, Trouba, the fourth line, and Igor.

 

[Savant]

Didn't the league change the rules after that trade, because the conditional pick made it too hard for Dallas to offer a fair deal to their player?

The crazy thing is how close Dallas came to hitting those conditions.

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

I mean are we closer to 2006 in the sense that we have offensively talented players, absolutely.
2014 we essentially rolled 3 lines that were almost all 2nd lines in terms of talent.
in 2022 we're rolling 2 lines that are producing like 1st lines and a 3rd line thats on the weaker end, with a 4th line thats bottom end of the league.

An additional difference is we have a defense thats far better than 2006 and even 2014. And thats not a disrespect to 2014.

The 2014 and 2015 were different. The Penguins completed the shift in DMen from stay at home or to way to quicker skaters.

 

[RGY]

I am excited for the deadline acquisitions we will add to get some more depth in here.

 

[LokiDog]

I would say that most people probably agree that this is not the year to spend assets on rentals and a deep playoff push, despite the record.

However decisions loom about guys like Strome, Chytil, Gauthier, Lundkvist, Kravtsov, etc.

Not to mention growing discomfort with the lottery bros.

It may not be the season to go all in with rentals, but it may be a pretty good moment to look at a couple of HARD decisions and see if something like a KK, Strome, Lundkvist gets you a LONG TERM piece. Sadly, I’m void of ideas. The core up front is too far along age wise to wait for all of the kids to fill in the missing holes. And guys like Chytil and Kakko look less and less likely to be able to replicate the performance of guys like Zib and Kreider later when the forward and D cores are similar ages. The window has just opened. We have a few years to intelligently take a swing. This isn’t the year for all in rentals.

Aside from a big splash, guys like Crouse/Lehkonen could definitely stabilize the top nine and let us spread it around better.

 

[Draft Guru]

The crazy thing is how close Dallas came to hitting those conditions.

If Jamie Been can score on an empty net wrap around in overtime game 7 vs STL we at least get one 1st round pick out of that.

 

[duhmetreE]

I don't think the issue is NYR 'playing the wrong way' so much as it is that this team just doesn't have a lot of depth at forward.

All the skill is in four forwards up front.

Lafreniere, Kakko, Chytil, Gauthier are projects. They've all been really disappointing this season to the extent that we would probably be better off with replacement level players in those spots.

Hunt, Rooney, Reaves are all 4th line level players, some of whom are being asked to do way too much.

The 3rd pairing has been a concern all season. Schneider has added some stability but he's one of two guys we need there when healthy.

The roster makeup is more like 2006 than 2014. All the scoring is coming from a few top players. Our D corps is a lot more talented than 2006 but there's a lot of youth and inexperience. In 2006 we added Sykora but lost Rucinsky to injury. Prucha got stifled in the playoffs, no secondary scoring, game over.

So management has a really tough choice to make here- they could go out and get a few veteran players to try to piece together a balanced roster at the last minute, but doing so would likely see Chytil, Kakko, and Lafreniere either demoted to limited 3rd line minutes or out of the lineup altogether. Or, we can continue to focus on developing the young players and hoping they come along before Panarin, Zib, Kreider start to decline too badly.

Most of NYR's problems this season lie pretty heavily on the heads of a few players.

Georgiev
Kakko
Lafreniere
Chytil
Nemeth

Have all been performing WAY below expectations. How long are we willing to be patient as our stars enter their 30s?

I think it's poor management to have Laffy with Chytil/Gauthier for so long. These guys needs some guidance. Put them with vet leadership which can only help. That line is not a 3rd line, it's a weak 2nd line on a terrible team. All good teams do have a strong top9 but they all don't play the same style game. We need an effective 3rd line that plays simple/physical/cycle hockey.

Our 5v5 has not been good. Our big boys are having major success on Special Teams, where our depth get 20-30 seconds a PP after a clear. ( pointing to their total PP time is terribly out of context to what opportunites they actually receive. ) I don't want our bottom6 to be playing a high skill offensive game. I'd prefer the smashmouth, physical grind down the opposing team. Get the puck behind them and go to work. Having Chytil and Laf ( along with a Gauthier ) together on the 3rd line destroys the teams balance IMO.

We need players to be put in their 'roles' and be put in position to succeed. I LOVE Hunt Rooney Reaves. Have no clue why it was broken up. They serve their purpose/role tremendously.

Sadly, Turk had the right lineup from season start. We just need to add a player like Lekhonen to balance out the 3rd.

Laffy Zibs Kreider
Panarin Strome Kakko
Lekhonen Goodrow Chytil
Hunt Rooney Reaves

Our defense is part of the problem when it comes to getting the puck out or transition. Jones-Schneider need to be our 3rd pair. There's no excuses anymore besides poor management.

Are they going to be patient with KAM? who's an absolute wild-card right now. I think he will also benefit from the break. Or is he turned into a Chychrun?

Let's remember a lot of these guys have not played this much hockey before, in their entire existence. With our insane travel schedule and condensed game schedule, the wheels are starting to come off. Is Gallant going too easy on them? He's stated at the beginning of the year, he would because of the crazy scheduling. Did it work early on and now it's turning for the worse? The team is running on fumes and it definitely looks like it