Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XXXII

[GAGLine]

$3.2m ($3.1m?) is a high cap hit?

RB was sort of right. His QO in 2020 will be 3.2 mil. I wouldn't be at all surprised though if Gorton were to re-sign him to a 2-3 year deal at a lower number. It depends on what he does next year. Strome is in a good situation here. He might be willing to take less for more stability. Unless his numbers jump way up next year, he's isn't going to command a high salary anyway.

Either way, there's no rush. He has another year on his contract and will be an RFA at the end of it. His cap hit isn't a problem.

 

[JimmyG89]

I've never quite understood, or bought into the arguments where a guy will never get better than he is right now, because he's overachieving, but somehow we're the only ones who know that so we can get better trade value.

If Strome is a solid third line type, I'm perfectly okay with that. I don't really see the need to take what's working, trade it for a middling return, and then attempt to replace what we already have via free agency.

Strome's contract isn't a problem and it's not like we're going to get an amazing return for him. I'm not really following the thought process on this one.

It's not an issue for the contract, but the way that it works out is that Strome can be bought out for pennies on the dollar. A team that really needs space could acquire him and buy him out. I'm arguing that we could leverage this to get a pending UFA and another asset (pick/prospect), then flip that pending UFA at the deadline for assets (i.e. Trade Strome to Tampa for Callahan + pick then trade Callahan for another pick).

I understand Gorton says he wants to accelerate the rebuild, but we should still be in the mode of acquiring more swings at the draft, or at least more ammo to make moves at the draft to move up. Players like Strome, Names, Fast, and to a lesser extent Vesey are good players for a 3rd or 4th line on winning teams. We do need players to take spots in the NHL next season while others develop, but we don't need all of them. I know we cannot go entirely young, but if I'm moving one of these vet type players this offseason, Strome is the guy.

 

[Tawnos]

RB was sort of right. His QO in 2020 will be 3.2 mil. I wouldn't be at all surprised though if Gorton were to re-sign him to a 2-3 year deal at a lower number. It depends on what he does next year. Strome is in a good situation here. He might be willing to take less for more stability. Unless his numbers jump way up next year, he's isn't going to command a high salary anyway.

Either way, there's no rush. He has another year on his contract and will be an RFA at the end of it. His cap hit isn't a problem.

That's fair about the QO.

I was more laughing about the idea that $3.2m represents a high salary. A full 22-man roster that's right at the cap has an average salary of $3.5m.

 

[NYR Viper]

The problem is that he's like that for maybe 50 games as season, out of the 60 some odd he averages. That's not going to change as he gets older.

And while he reminds me of McD, I don't find him to be as good as McD. Especially when I look at his support cast and what is asked of him.

So I find myself staring at a player who is coming from an environment that benefits him more than ours will, compares unfavorably to the guy he reminds us of, and has consistently missed a quarter of the season for the past half-decade. And I'm going to ask him to come here, to a lesser team, that will rely on him more, as he gets older.

That just seems like a recipe for disappointment and frustration.

Well thought out rebuttal.

Out of the guys in the league who MAY be available, who would you pursue?

 

[Ghost of jas]

Gorton tried to acquire Trouba in 2016 when he was holding out as s group II. Winnipeg wasn’t very interested in trading him at that time.

There really wasn’t much trade talk last year. Winnipeg was content going with the one year contract.

Trouba is one year away from group III now. He was 4 years away in 2016.

Why is Karlsson even in the discussion? If you look at what Gorton told Custance last week, Karlsson doesn’t fit.

Karlsson is part of the conversation because there are people both here and in the media that have said the Rangers should/will target him this off-season.

 

[GAGLine]

It's not an issue for the contract, but the way that it works out is that Strome can be bought out for pennies on the dollar. A team that really needs space could acquire him and buy him out. I'm arguing that we could leverage this to get a pending UFA and another asset (pick/prospect), then flip that pending UFA at the deadline for assets (i.e. Trade Strome to Tampa for Callahan + pick then trade Callahan for another pick).

I'm not sure I get the logic. Wouldn't Tampa save more money if we didn't include Strome in the deal? Maybe if we want to save the cap space after taking Callahan, so we make them buy out Strome instead of us doing it ourselves, but the difference isn't much.

 

[Edge]

It's not an issue for the contract, but the way that it works out is that Strome can be bought out for pennies on the dollar. A team that really needs space could acquire him and buy him out. I'm arguing that we could leverage this to get a pending UFA and another asset (pick/prospect), then flip that pending UFA at the deadline for assets (i.e. Trade Strome to Tampa for Callahan + pick then trade Callahan for another pick).

I understand Gorton says he wants to accelerate the rebuild, but we should still be in the mode of acquiring more swings at the draft, or at least more ammo to make moves at the draft to move up. Players like Strome, Names, Fast, and to a lesser extent Vesey are good players for a 3rd or 4th line on winning teams. We do need players to take spots in the NHL next season while others develop, but we don't need all of them. I know we cannot go entirely young, but if I'm moving one of these vet type players this offseason, Strome is the guy.

Not really sure the juice will be worth the squeeze with a Strome move. I mean it plausible, but I'm not sure its probable.

 

[nyr2k2]

If you *must* move out one of these guys, I'd make it Fast. Will be 28 a couple months into next season, so he's not old but not exactly young, has a totally reasonable contract for next season before free agency, and is an established, know quantity who is also very consistent. I think a lot of teams could conceivably be interested in a guy like him, particularly at this price.

Again, this is if we have to move someone.

 

[Edge]

Well thought out rebuttal.

Out of the guys in the league who MAY be available, who would you pursue?

Honestly, I'd have to see a list of names.

It's kind of like asking how I'd pick in the draft, my brain tends to work better with a scenario in mind.

 

[NYR Viper]

Not really sure the juice will be worth the squeeze with a Strome move. I mean it plausible, but I'm not its probable.

Piggybacking on this

Let's all look a year from now. Players who could be gone:
Namestnikov
Fast
Nieves

These are the UFA's. This team will need some vets in the bottom-6. Guys who can maneuver and play all over in all situations. Strome is a good guy for that, especially if his next contract is reasonable. If the team loses all (3) of those guys, depth is going to be an issue for a little while until some of the younger guys get going.

 

[Edge]

Let's all look a year from now. Players who could be gone:
Namestnikov
Fast
Nieves

These are the UFA's. This team will need some vets in the bottom-6. Guys who can maneuver and play all over in all situations. Strome is a good guy for that, especially if his next contract is reasonable. If the team loses all (3) of those guys, depth is going to be an issue for a little while until some of the younger guys get going.

If the right deal comes along, everyone is negotiable. But in some cases, I'm not sure there's a ton of assets to be had. So you we end up in this weird scenario where we tend to need the player more than the assets, even though the player isn't someone we'd consider "essential."

In Strome's case we'd be looking at maybe a late second rounder?

 

[True Blue]

So I find myself staring at a player who is coming from an environment that benefits him more than ours will, compares unfavorably to the guy he reminds us of, and has consistently missed a quarter of the season for the past half-decade. And I'm going to ask him to come here, to a lesser team, that will rely on him more, as he gets older.

That just seems like a recipe for disappointment and frustration.

Didn't we just see this with Shattenkirk?

 

[True Blue]

I think the difference is expectations and fit.

I think that is a big part of it. As Gorton said, he is on here to be the 5th overall pick. Management's expectations for Strome were a lot lower. One also needs to take into account that Quinn has shown that he can get players to play better. Strome, in turn, has changed his game around to fit in what what Quinn wants and is having some of the better results in his career. Let's also remember that clearly there was something in Strome to where he was drafted.

Again, seems to be finding comfort in a new locker room with a coach whom you trust and do as he demands. He may note be a $3.5-$4m player, but can be a very nice 3rd liner for the team.

 

[Edge]

Didn't we just see this with Shattenkirk?

I'm also concerned about that gap between what we want a player to be, versus what they are.

In a world where someone like Trouba consistently plays 75+ games, and is coming from a weaker team, he's an attractive option.

In a world where he's struggling to play more than 66 in a given year, and is coming from one of the stronger teams in the league, not quite as much.

 

[True Blue]

We do need players to take spots in the NHL next season while others develop, but we don't need all of them. I know we cannot go entirely young, but if I'm moving one of these vet type players this offseason, Strome is the guy.

What kind of a return do you believe that you will get for him? Is a 4th rounder worth it?

Not everyone needs to be a superstar. I could be pretty happy if Strome and Namestinikov are your third line players.

 

[Mac n Gs]

If you *must* move out one of these guys, I'd make it Fast. Will be 28 a couple months into next season, so he's not old but not exactly young, has a totally reasonable contract for next season before free agency, and is an established, know quantity who is also very consistent. I think a lot of teams could conceivably be interested in a guy like him, particularly at this price.

Again, this is if we have to move someone.

He’s also been playing hurt all year, which doesn’t really bode well for long-term play here. I love Quickie, but he seems like a huge risk to start breaking down physically while not really playing that great and being due a sizable raise soon. We can’t get caught up overpaying depth.

 

[JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK]

yeah you definitely don’t pay Fast. Love the guy, but he’s not gonna be worth the contract.

hopefully we can get a Hansen like return for him.

 

[Crease]

Holy crap Fast is 27?

 

[Thirty One]

Holy crap Fast is 27?

That happened.... suddenly.

 

[Crease]

That happened.... suddenly.

For some reason I think of Fast breaking in at 20 and being in his like fourth season. I'll show myself out.

 

[Paulie Walnutz]

I think the difference is expectations and fit.

There's no expectation from Strome to score 25-30 goals, and 55-60 points. We didn't draft him, he wasn't out top pick, we never counted on him to evolve into that. We didn't trade a key piece of our team for him, etc.

He's also a really good fit for this particular team. He can slide around between center and wing, the system we utilize seems to play to his strengths, and we're using him in situations that play to his strengths.

In many ways, he kind of reminds me a little bit of Pouliot in terms of his journey to get here. Former high first round pick, his production here isn't really all that different than what it was in other places, but the environment is different.

Now having said that, his 20 goal pace would mark a career high, and his 38 points amount to the second highest season total of his career. So outside of his 17 goal/50 point campaign, he's definitely on the higher end of his career spectrum.

And not only that, Strome has shown a feistiness to his game as well, which I love.

 

[Inferno]

Ranger need to find the next Kessel, Seguin, etc. Good player who wants out of wherever he's playing.

Not sure who that is without doing a deep dive..but we have the assets to make a move ike that... And it's something Gorton basically hinted at.

Nylander might be a good grab this off-season.

 

[Mr Saji]

I know we've talked about RHD prospects like Fox and Fabbro, but wonder if Chicago would be willing to part with Ian Mitchell? He's made mention of staying in college all four years and there's the fear he won't sign with Chicago. Probably needs another season in the NCAA before he turns pro, but could be a good young D to continue to build around. And especially could be attracted to our lack of RD Depth.

 

[NernieBichols]

Come the end of the season, we need to unload Strome somewhere. Get a pick in return. Sell high on his unsustainable production that he has had since being traded. I think he'd return more than Names. I know Strome will be an RFA, but I don't see the production being duplicated next season. I can see Names being productive next season and being a desirable rental at the TDL.

I don’t think it’s unsustainable. I think Strome is a 20-20 guy

I want to keep Strome and see what he’d want next year on a deal. Remember, players will also take the expansion draft into account. If Strome wants a multi year deal anywhere, he’s most likely gonna be exposed to Seattle. He could control that by signing a yr deal next summer and than signing a longer term contract after the expansion summer.
Players should protect themselves from an unexpected move to the Pacific Northwest unless they are OK with the prospect. Beautiful place, but very different than the metro area

 

[Ghost of jas]

Ranger need to find the next Kessel, Seguin, etc. Good player who wants out of wherever he's playing.

Not sure who that is without doing a deep dive..but we have the assets to make a move ike that... And it's something Gorton basically hinted at.

Nylander might be a good grab this off-season.

Kreider, Andersson and Pionk for Nylander and a 3rd? Yes or no, and who’s says no?