Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XXX

[Savant]

Wyshinski (who I don’t love) has something interesting tonight…he’s speculating Vegas might move William Karlsson as a way to make salary cap,room for Jack Eichel. 5 years left at $5.9MM. Really good two way player, big ticket.

Money would be very tight but I would think Drury would be in on this if it has any legs.

I thought I was the only one who didn’t like Greg W.

Karlsson feels like it would come at the cost of Strome extension. Which there are obviously pros and cons too. Smith still feels like the obvious target there

 

[jay from jersey]

9th pick.

If you go back and look at the draft, there’s a little bit of a delay with Edmonton. Discussions ran into the final minute.

Correct amundo

 

[jay from jersey]

Wyshinski (who I don’t love) has something interesting tonight…he’s speculating Vegas might move William Karlsson as a way to make salary cap,room for Jack Eichel. 5 years left at $5.9MM. Really good two way player, big ticket.

Money would be very tight but I would think Drury would be in on this if it has any legs.

that’s what I was thinking. Stephenson is on a Beauty of a contract, and just as good as Karlsson imo. They also have Roy, Howden, and Patrick all locked you for the 2 bottom 6 center spots.
If I were a betting man, I think they deal Karlsson before Stephenson.
However, if you go by what Knights fans say, he’s not even going to be remotely available.... so who knows.
I watched a lot of Vegas games over the last 2 months while bored out of my mind working double shifts.
The common theme from the coaches to the fans to the announcers is how important and how consistent Reilly Smith is to the team on the ice and in the locker room.
As far as giving effort every night he steps on the ice, and performing to what they’ve be accustomed to since Vegas 1st nhl season, Smith basically epitomizes Golden Knights hockey with his effort and play.
Yea, he’s a FA at the end of the year, yes if Eichel comes back early they need to clear some cap.
But I bet they do everything in their power to not trade Smith if they don’t have to.
That’s why I think this Karlsson rumor could potentially have some legs.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

For better or worse, the Rangers focused on a specific guy they wanted and wanted to roll the dice based on where type of player they felt he could be for them.

Time will tell if they are right. But all the chatter around Blais was that he was a specific target. And I like Blais, just not at that cost.

I like Blais but he is often injured and while this year's injury was unrelated to previous ones and the result of a dirty play it was unlikely we were going to get a full season from him anyway, that's my issue with the trade. I believe trading Buchnevich was likely the right idea but the return was redundant with Hunt, Rooney, Reaves, Gauthier in the bottom 6. Not to harp on things but if we're trading Buch we needed to either move Kravtsov for a top 6 winger or ensure he was in the lineup because our right side went from a position of strength to a weakness.

 

[jay from jersey]

I thought I was the only one who didn’t like Greg W.

Karlsson feels like it would come at the cost of Strome extension. Which there are obviously pros and cons too. Smith still feels like the obvious target there

I don’t think they deal Smith if they can help it.
If you talk to the Vegas fans, you’ll see what he means to them. They had the injury/covid bug pretty bad too.
The only reason I think Karlsson is possible, is the guys that have at Center, and Stephenson/Karlsson playing a similar game fighting for 2C minutes.
But Stephenson is a fraction of the price.
I doubt either guy wants to lose their top 6 center role and minutes....

 

[Savant]

I don’t think they deal Smith if they can help it.
If you talk to the Vegas fans, you’ll see what he means to them. They had the injury/covid bug pretty bad too.
The only reason I think Karlsson is possible, is the guys that have at Center, and Stephenson/Karlsson playing a similar game fighting for 2C minutes.
But Stephenson is a fraction of the price.

For sure. I wouldn’t mind Karlsson for the Rangers at all but they have to make sure that’s an upgrade, if it’s going to cost them Strome and possibly upset Panarin in the process. Not saying he is or or he isn’t but they need to evaluate that. Vegas isn’t my first choice to deal with either way.

 

[jay from jersey]

For sure. I wouldn’t mind Karlsson for the Rangers at all but they have to make sure that’s an upgrade, if it’s going to cost them Strome and possibly upset Panarin in the process. Not saying he is or or he isn’t but they need to evaluate that. Vegas isn’t my first choice to deal with either way.

Yea of course. Probably not my first choice either. But he does bring that different style of play we need, and he’s familiar with Gallant.
Karlsson/Strome are both 28, which is another thing I’m not crazy about.
But Karlsson signed for 5.9 x 5 years will likely 100% be the cheaper option opposed to Strome after this year.
Then you have to factor in what they want for him as well.
At least with Karlsson, I could see him possibly being available on the trading block makes sense in accordance with what they have, and the cap they have to move for Eichel..
Unlike some of the other fantasy targets that people waste oxygen talking about that have little to no chance of even becoming available.

 

[McRanger92]

Wyshinski (who I don’t love) has something interesting tonight…he’s speculating Vegas might move William Karlsson as a way to make salary cap,room for Jack Eichel. 5 years left at $5.9MM. Really good two way player, big ticket.

Money would be very tight but I would think Drury would be in on this if it has any legs.

I like it. Roll with Mika-Strome-Karlsson down the middle this year, and Karlsson slots in for Strome next year. The money isn’t unreasonable that they can’t make it work

 

[Overcast]

For sure. I wouldn’t mind Karlsson for the Rangers at all but they have to make sure that’s an upgrade, if it’s going to cost them Strome and possibly upset Panarin in the process. Not saying he is or or he isn’t but they need to evaluate that. Vegas isn’t my first choice to deal with either way.

At some point this line of thinking has to end, these guys aren't middle school sweethearts who are going to collapse at the thought of not being with each other once they graduate to high school. Panarin has played for 3 teams now, undoubtedly with guys he has liked. I'm sure he liked playing with Patty Kane & Co. and he managed to survive and land in NY where he continues to play at an elite level. When the day comes where Strome is moved/signs elsewhere and Panarin is still here, what's Panarin going to do? Is he incapable of playing without Strome? Come on. I'm not against re-signing Strome, but it's just as much of a possibility that he's not here next season.

 

[bobbop]

yea NYR was all over the place trying to wheel and deal.
We won the Kakko pick, tried like hell to get the EDM pick at 8 to get Zergas before the ducks at 9 and offered Kreider to col for the 16OA( Newhook) straight up.
I don’t know how close we were with EDM. I know they were serious talks, but I don’t know how close a potential trade was.
The kreider for 16 ( newhook) was at the goal line though.
The Avs had already Picked Byram at 4, and really had a need for a big fast talented wing.
I think in the end kreiders contract status might have given them pause??? Or they were just so super high on Newhook they pulled out at the last minute.
Maybe a combo of both.

The Rangers wanted to move Kreider for #16 but Colorado had no interest. Gorton shopped Kreider all over the league that summer.

 

[tlk]

Panarin of all people has proved he can play with different linemates.
With regards to Strome specifically, I doubt Breads going to wish to cling to him. Strome isn't Kane after all.

 

[Savant]

At some point this line of thinking has to end, these guys aren't middle school sweethearts who are going to collapse at the thought of not being with each other once they graduate to high school. Panarin has played for 3 teams now, undoubtedly with guys he has liked. I'm sure he liked playing with Patty Kane & Co. and he managed to survive and land in NY where he continues to play at an elite level. When the day comes where Strome is moved/signs elsewhere and Panarin is still here, what's Panarin going to do? Is he incapable of playing without Strome? Come on. I'm not against re-signing Strome, but it's just as much of a possibility that he's not here next season.

I mean that’s his best friend on the team off ice too. Again not saying it’s right or wrong but they need to evaluate if they want Strome or the mystery box.

 

[n8]

yea NYR was all over the place trying to wheel and deal.
We won the Kakko pick, tried like hell to get the EDM pick at 8 to get Zergas before the ducks at 9 and offered Kreider to col for the 16OA( Newhook) straight up.
I don’t know how close we were with EDM. I know they were serious talks, but I don’t know how close a potential trade was.
The kreider for 16 ( newhook) was at the goal line though.
The Avs had already Picked Byram at 4, and really had a need for a big fast talented wing.
I think in the end kreiders contract status might have given them pause??? Or they were just so super high on Newhook they pulled out at the last minute.
Maybe a combo of both.

Man would it have been crazy if we were able to trade Kakko's 2nd OA pick to Anaheim for their 9OA and a 2020 1st (top ten protected which is totally reasonable - which would then turn to the 3OA in 2021. 2nd OA totally seems worth a top 10 pick and a magic beans 1st in a future draft. Some would argue not enough without knowing the pick would turn into Mason McTavish or whoever the Rangers had high on their list last year. Oh well, pointless what-ifs. What if Jeff Gorton got all 6 infinity stones in 2019?

 

[jay from jersey]

The Rangers wanted to move Kreider for #16 but Colorado had no interest. Gorton shopped Kreider all over the league that summer.

There was interest there for sure. But once Newhook fell they decided against Kreider. Kreider was a savage up to the TDL that year.
Besides this season so far, that was probably the best hockey of his career as well as the longest stretch.
But you’re right, he was being pretty heavily shopped for a while.
I wonder what some of the offers might have been??? We really didn’t get any almost trades, or “ trades that didn’t happen” as TSN puts it.
The only little info we got was from Edge about potentially Robertson + late 1st from Dallas.

When it comes to the Kreider and McDonaugh moves, I would have loved to have been a fly on the wall to hear some of the offers that were floating around.
I know EDM had serious McDonaugh talks at one point. I wana say it was the year prior to when he was dealt at the deadline, but I’m not sure and I know the Leafs were interested at the Deadline. I think they were neck and neck with Tampa, that’s why the trade got done so late in the day.
But no word about the players/picks they were offering in return...

 

[Ned Braden]

Should it be met with snark and dismissal? No. Should people be expected to just accept “we could have done a LOT better” as gospel truth? Also no.
In the end it’s just a stated opinion with nothing but subjective judgement to to back it up.

Agreed. And I'll offer the opinion that the Rangers are a better team this year than they were last year (which is an opinion backed pretty soundly by the Rangers record).

This has happened - again in my opinion - because the Rangers have changed their overall *roster building* philosophy. Knocking the Blais - Buch deal only works in a vacuum as an individual trade...but Blais was clearly a part of an overall Blais-Hunt-Reaves (shit, even Tinordi) philosophy to get harder to play against. And that philosophy hasn't just manifested in the tougher individuals they brought in...it has permeated the entire lineup. Everyone is playing a more physical game. Gautier is up an entire hit a game this year...Laf is fighting...Fox is fighting...Trouba is basically hunting people.

The philosophy behind the summer moves has made the whole lineup tougher. Probably the whole organization.

And they're winning. I liked Buch. I get the angst. But, in my opinion, that deal was part of the philosophy change that's leading to the winning.

 

[ETTER DE]

Kyriou and Thomas have taken major strides this year for the blues. Kyriou looks like a bonafide stud and Thomas looks like he has the talent to be a very high end 2C. He would have been a good trade target last offseason.
Assuming Chytil doesn’t deliver production wise the rest of the season, what are some realistic trade targets for 2C for us long term??
This season well add some mercenaries and try to catch fire in the postseason. Next year the cap crunch is tighter.
I expect Georgiev, Strome, And possibly all of Nemeth, Chytil, and Rooney not to be here by the start of next season.
Assuming all of the above happens, what do we do?? Our likely trade ammo will be some of a combo of Chytil, Kravtsov, Nemeth, 1 of Lundkvist/Jones/Robertson, 22 late 1st, 1 of or 22 2nds, possibly more???
Overall, I don’t expect too much Roster turnover, but at least 2-3 new faces. And maybe another 2 kids from our system.
Our line yo likely looks something like

kreider-Zibanejad-kakko
Panarin-Trade/New guy- Blais/kakko
LaF-Barron-Goodrow
Hunt- UFA Derek Ryan type-Reaves
Ex Gauthier

Lindgren-Fox
Miller-Trouba
Jones-Schneider / maybe Lundkvist
Ex UFA vet/Nemeth

Shesty
UFA Greiss/Halak type etc

It’s not terribly different. The hope is LaF at least takes a developmental bump to where he’s skating /playing like Kakko is this year. I think he’ll have an easier time producing points, especially if he steps into the top PP role vacated by strome.
This line up gives you a lot of options for movement. Hopefully LaF can move up and run
LaF-Zibby-Kreider or even Panarin-Zibby-Kreider if necessary.
Then 3rd line of Goodrow-Barron-Blais/kakko ?
It allows Gallant a lot of movement to try and find the right combos/chemistry.
Rooney most likely pricing himself out is the biggest blow behind finding the strome replacement.
Finding the Right guy for 2C duty is very important for line up balance...whose the main targets???
Larkin/Lindholm/Cirelli - all unlikely and expensive in cap/assets
Lundell/Zergas /Hintz/Pettersson- not a snowballs chance in hell
Horvat??? Perhaps but Canucks seem to be playing better.
Norris/Pinto/PLD/Hirchier- all also highly unlikely
Can we try to pry Stephenson or Karlsson out of Vegas with Eichel now there?? Maybe
Canes and Kings both seem like potential trading partners. Both have a lot of capital at center?
Don’t really want to pay A lot of assets for Trochek/Kotkaniemi or Villardi. Byfield and Turcotte are going no where. Turcotte will likely shift to wing.

Finding a young long term guy might prove to be impossible. We might have to pay for another stop gap/ band aid.
Any ideas??? Anyone? Anyone? Bueller.....? Bueller....?

If Carolina do not qualify Kotkaniemi he will be UFA?

 

[jay from jersey]

If Carolina do not qualify Kotkaniemi he will be UFA?

I don’t think they’d Qualify him at the current hit. More then likely he’ll get a longer term deal at a smaller/similar cap hit.
I’m not sure what their plan is regarding Kotka or what they are looking to offer him as a long term deal.
They certainly have different options if they want to go that way. Necas could move to the middle perhaps?
They Got Seth Jarvis playing well so far, Jack Drury in the minors probably not too far off bottom 6 duty. A guy like Lorentz for that as well....
I’m guessing if they resign kotka long term, Trochek is the goner ???

 

[McRanger92]

Agreed. And I'll offer the opinion that the Rangers are a better team this year than they were last year (which is an opinion backed pretty soundly by the Rangers record).

This has happened - again in my opinion - because the Rangers have changed their overall *roster building* philosophy. Knocking the Blais - Buch deal only works in a vacuum as an individual trade...but Blais was clearly a part of an overall Blais-Hunt-Reaves (shit, even Tinordi) philosophy to get harder to play against. And that philosophy hasn't just manifested in the tougher individuals they brought in...it has permeated the entire lineup. Everyone is playing a more physical game. Gautier is up an entire hit a game this year...Laf is fighting...Fox is fighting...Trouba is basically hunting people.

The philosophy behind the summer moves has made the whole lineup tougher. Probably the whole organization.

And they're winning. I liked Buch. I get the angst. But, in my opinion, that deal was part of the philosophy change that's leading to the winning.

Spot on with your roster building point. Buch is clearly a good top 6 F, but he was more of the same with this team: very good in the wide open games, but when they tightened up he generally disappeared like the rest. The fact that he would throw a crosscheck once in awhile and played well on the PK, doesnt mean he thrived in playoff type games

 

[Paul Padovano]

If the bpa is Crosby, Ovechkin, or McDavid, it's a no brainer. But this is at least the third year in a row (fourth if u consider the fact Kravtsov was the Rangers first overall pick in 18') where they haven't addressed the Center position. We passed on Zegras, Dach, Turcotte, Byfield, and Stutzle, and soon it will be time to pay. Last draft Svechkov, Lucius, and Bolduc were available. So that leaves Korczak, who looks to be the only Center in the pipeline who has any promise. I would have said Henriksson 3-4 years ago. Teams know to win a cup, you want to be strong down the middle, so know ones gonna do us any favors. Sorry, the thought of going into next season with Chytil at 2C, makes my stomach churn. So do we buy out a contract in order to keep Strome??

Now that I see Othmann and Berard can play the right side, that does address needs at second and third line rw. When I think of it, another option could be parting with one or more defensive prospects, in order to obtain some help at Center. Just anxious to see what Drury has in mind.

 

[bigdog16]

Agreed. And I'll offer the opinion that the Rangers are a better team this year than they were last year (which is an opinion backed pretty soundly by the Rangers record).

This has happened - again in my opinion - because the Rangers have changed their overall *roster building* philosophy. Knocking the Blais - Buch deal only works in a vacuum as an individual trade...but Blais was clearly a part of an overall Blais-Hunt-Reaves (shit, even Tinordi) philosophy to get harder to play against. And that philosophy hasn't just manifested in the tougher individuals they brought in...it has permeated the entire lineup. Everyone is playing a more physical game. Gautier is up an entire hit a game this year...Laf is fighting...Fox is fighting...Trouba is basically hunting people.

The philosophy behind the summer moves has made the whole lineup tougher. Probably the whole organization.

And they're winning. I liked Buch. I get the angst. But, in my opinion, that deal was part of the philosophy change that's leading to the winning.

Spot on. Buch was a good player but like others were saying, when it got tough he hid in a corner. Reality is that he is soft as doggy doo doo and nobody in the NHL is afraid of him. My daughter could put up a fight against him

 

[Vitto79]

So is Bitetto going to the taxi ?

 

[fm]

Buch was the only guy who went after Wilson on his big night.

 

[haohmaru]

They never would have dealt Buch at the deadline if they were in playoff contention. It just doesn’t happen.

Yeah, like I said, it's only a scenario that would work if it was the plan from the beginning and sends a terrible message to the team.

I don't doubt Edge as a source but I'm wondering if it was the Rangers or the other team(s) that pulled the plug on those deals.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

Buch was the only guy who went after Wilson on his big night.

What? Brendan Smith fought Wilson.

Buch cross checked Anthony Mantha in the face though which was nice.

 

[NYRFANMANI]

Spot on. Buch was a good player but like others were saying, when it got tough he hid in a corner. Reality is that he is soft as doggy doo doo and nobody in the NHL is afraid of him. My daughter could put up a fight against him

I mean that's just a ridiculous take ... all of it, not just the part about your daughter.

Buchnevich entered the league soft af, but he became a ride or die mofo ...