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Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XXII

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haohmaru said:
How so? Stamkos just won two Cups @ 29 and 30 years old. I think a lot of it depends on who is centering that 2nd line.

And, part 2, the Rangers haven't drafted a #1C since... uh... hrm... uh... Savard? Weight? IDK that they really ever have had a true home-grown elite 1C.

I never considered Stepan a 1C. Though, Arizona did.
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How is stamkos relevant to the center conversation for Stanley cup winners, he's been playing wing primarily for years now. Tb just won two cups w point and Cirelli as their top 2, stammer either didn't play or he was used as a winger...
 
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bleedblue94 said:
How is stamkos relevant to the center conversation for Stanley cup winners, he's been playing wing primarily for years now. Tb just won two cups w point and Cirelli as their top 2, stammer either didn't play or he was used as a winger...
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It’s true. But I wouldn’t get too excited about Cirelli. Point is pretty good though. Just not a regular ppg player.......
 
The longer we go without a center trade the more I think Goodrow may have been brought in to play 3C.

My preference would be that he plays the Dubinsky role to Chytil's Anisimov but maybe not.
 
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brakeyawself said:
It’s true. But I wouldn’t get too excited about Cirelli. Point is pretty good though. Just not a regular ppg player.......
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I'm commenting on the fact stammer status as a center on a cup winner at his age has no bearing on examining zibs' place on this roster going forward bc stammer wasn't even a center on those cup teams.
 
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Fitzy said:
JT Miller has the exact same set of holes and strengths in his game as Ryan Strome.

Like with Monahan, I'd rather just keep the devil we know with the proven chemistry.
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The Rangers have a boatload of money invested in Panarin. Strome can play with him. They know each other. We don't know how Panarin will play with another center.

The Rangers had Nylander to play with Jagr. Nylander got greedy and the Rangers went into another direction. Gomez and Drury. It was only one season but Jagr couldn't play with those guys.

The Rangers need Strome unless a better option comes along.
 
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RangerBoy said:
The Rangers have a boatload of money invested in Panarin. Strome can play with him. They know each other. We don't know how Panarin will play with another center.

The Rangers had Nylander to play with Jagr. Nylander got greedy and the Rangers went into another direction. Gomez and Drury. It was only one season but Jagr couldn't play with those guys.

The Rangers need Strome unless a better option comes along.
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Panarin has played very well with Chytil in the past. And Strome is good on faceoffs. Strome is well suited for the wing anyway.

Anyway, I think Panarin would be fine with either Chytil or Strome as his center.

Which is why I still think a Panarin-Chytil-Strome line could be plausible. And could be a highly effective line, which would be Chytil's theoretical "breakout".

Chytil and Strome would be fairly interchangeable between center and wing. Strome takes the faceoffs. Chytil defensively responsible. Not saying it's going to happen. Just that it's plausible and could work out very well for all three. Which means we would still need someone to step up as 3C though. And I am not sure if Goodrow is the guy for that. Rooney definitely isn't. Barron probably not ready, or at least not ready to play 3C.

Heh, can Blais play center?

Just throwing it out there. I did think we might have brought in a 3C option at some point, which hasn't happened yet. But it's still summer. And I think that's more likely at this point than bringing in a 1C.
 
RangerBoy said:
The Rangers have a boatload of money invested in Panarin. Strome can play with him. They know each other. We don't know how Panarin will play with another center.

The Rangers had Nylander to play with Jagr. Nylander got greedy and the Rangers went into another direction. Gomez and Drury. It was only one season but Jagr couldn't play with those guys.

The Rangers need Strome unless a better option comes along.
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We did not get to see much of Chytil and Panarin last year, which makes it harder to decide if we can move on from Strome. I hope Gallant has a bit more foresight than Quinn in this department.
 
mas0764 said:
Don't be held hostage. Trade him and move on. Chase young prospect centers. The Kings have tons.
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The Kings have tons of prospects but they hedged their bets by giving Danault 6 years and $33M.

Kupari has had an OK pro career and Turcotte hasn't had a smooth transition to pro hockey.

Byfield might spend the year in the AHL and both of the other young centers will be on the wing.

 
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mas0764 said:
Point per game or nearly point per game offensive dominance combined with excellent if not Selke level defense.

I do not think we get that from Zibanejad in 2-3 years. I think he's gonna age poorly. He'd be fine if the goal was to win this year, but that's kind of a pipe dream.

I think the problem here might be that you don't really know or understand your history. Eric Staal wasn't "decent," when he won with the Canes, he scored like 100 points.

Yeah, ok, the Devils. That's about as far as we have to go back in history to find a relevant example. We're talking 2002, literally like 20 years ago now.
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I totally agree with you here. I rather have Eichel then Zibby for the next 5 season, even with the neck surgery looming.
I doubt it’s going to be an option though.
As far as younger guys go, I think Turcotte will be an NHL wing. He’s also a player they don’t want to trade.
Imo, Kong’s targets would be Kupari or Villardi. One or the other could/should be available in a years time. They are going to face a similar problem at center that we will have on D. Too many good players arriving in the same time frame and not enough spots. Signing Danault added to their future log Jam. Odds are Byfield will be up soon, 1 of Thomas/Madden will likely be their 3C and Villardi Kupari as trade bait.
I’d be way more comfortable with a Larkin/Villardi or Eichel 1 and 2 but I highly doubt it will be an option cap wise.
Zibby is pretty much a guarantee to resign at this point, which sucks. There’s not a lot out there that can match up with his talent in the timeframe we want.
When they resign Zibby, the key is going to be to get a cost controlled option back for at least 3-4 seasons who is young and can get better. There aren’t too many of them that come on the market either. It’s tough because whoever it is, must be at least able to keep up with panarin and whoever on 2nd line from the get go. He could have potential to get better sure, but they aren’t going to want a guy that could take years to develop. It’s not the timeframe they are looking for
 
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bleedblue94 said:
How is stamkos relevant to the center conversation for Stanley cup winners, he's been playing wing primarily for years now. Tb just won two cups w point and Cirelli as their top 2, stammer either didn't play or he was used as a winger...
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A winger that took 188 face offs. Just in the playoffs. Not really your traditional winger.

What was being addressed was this: "It's a terrible idea to hitch our wagon to Zibanejad for 8 years because history will be entirely against us winning a Cup in that circumstance."

I just brought up a guy of a similar age that signed a lengthy and expensive eight year 1C deal that ended up winning two Cups to refute the "history will be entirely against us". It won't. I didn't make an argument about his contribution(s) to that Cup.

And, sure, getting lucky or being "right" and drafting guys like Tampa did will surely help but I don't think signing Zibanejad long term will be our doom.
 
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Looks like even Panarin is getting ready to take on Wilson this season :naughty:
fPsUIY4.png
 
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RangerBoy said:
The Kings have tons of prospects but they hedged their bets by giving Danault 6 years and $33M.

Kupari has had an OK pro career and Turcotte hasn't had a smooth transition to pro hockey.

Byfield might spend the year in the AHL and both of the other young centers will be on the wing.

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I think Kings may plan to put Turcotte at wing. But just because they do, doesn't mean we would have to. So I still wouldn't mind him as an option.
Vilardi and Kupari I think could theoretically both work out. Vilardi might end up at wing also I guess. But I don't think Kupari will. At least I don't think he's as suited to the wing as those two if they are experimenting.

But they still have Madden, JAD, Thomas and now Pinelli.

Pinelli was a guy I really wanted in the draft, hoping Drury would trade up into the 2nd to grab him when he fell. But I doubt Kings would be looking to move him.

JAD, I am not so sure about. I've liked him, but I don't know if he really has what we are looking for if we go that young player route.

To me, it would be between Turcotte, Vilardi, Kupari and Madden. And I don't think we would have to pay as much for Kupari or Madden, which theoretically could be good, but then, their ceilings might not be as high. All though I don't want to sell Kupari short.

I still think Turcotte could play center in the NHL though, I think he would be a player worth taking a chance on. Vilardi, I have a feeling they really want to keep, but I also question whether he can hold up long term having the injury history he does.
I think the sneaky plays are Kupari or Madden. Turcotte would be the big hope. But Kupari or Madden, a little cheaper, could still turn into what we would need. There certainly is risk involved with all of them. I mean, if we could get Turcotte right now for Lundkvist I would do it. But if we could get Madden or Kupari for like Jones or Miller instead, I would probably do that too.
 
Chalfdiggity3 said:
I do not believe that this would be the deal or even one that the rangers would go for since it was Detriots asking price. Now obviously since the draft is over already i havent heard much from @Edge since then.

But if you can trade strome at the deadline for assets and use those along with some of our own to get larkin im all in. I wouldnt trade Kravy or nils but if you can move our 1st and a lesser prospect like jones. How do you not for a top 25 center who is just turning 25?

That then gives you Larkin and Chytl. You can even move Zibs then for more assets..
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Yeah if that's the exchange (Strome for assets, those assets for Larkin), then I'm in. Cause then I still have the assets to go get a 1C if Larkin ends up my 2C.
 
haohmaru said:
A winger that took 188 face offs. Just in the playoffs. Not really your traditional winger.

What was being addressed was this: "It's a terrible idea to hitch our wagon to Zibanejad for 8 years because history will be entirely against us winning a Cup in that circumstance."

I just brought up a guy of a similar age that signed a lengthy and expensive eight year 1C deal that ended up winning two Cups to refute the "history will be entirely against us". It won't. I didn't make an argument about his contribution(s) to that Cup.

And, sure, getting lucky or being "right" and drafting guys like Tampa did will surely help but I don't think signing Zibanejad long term will be our doom.
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The convo I quoted was about stammer being a center on a cup winner.

That being said wingers take faceoffs at times, landaskog takes more faceoffs than makinnon and he's not a center so quoting faceoff stats means nothing. Stammer is no longer a center on the bolts except for filling in on injuries. He was not a center on a cup winning team. Those are all facts. Let's not argue facts
 
bleedblue94 said:
The convo I quoted was about stammer being a center on a cup winner.

That being said wingers take faceoffs at times, landaskog takes more faceoffs than makinnon and he's not a center so quoting faceoff stats means nothing. Stammer is no longer a center on the bolts except for filling in on injuries. He was not a center on a cup winning team. Those are all facts. Let's not argue facts
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The conversation you quoted wasn't about Stamkos' role with Tampa Bay at all. I pointed out that he signed a large contract, as a 1C, and that didn't kill TB's chances to win a Cup. My second sentence was referring to who will center the 2nd line behind ZIBANEJAD, not Stamkos. These are also facts. I never made any kind of argument about Stamkos' role in either Cup win for Tampa, merely that his contract didn't preclude them from winning anything. It didn't, obviously, because they won twice.

And as far as your wingers taking face-offs take - yes, so? I merely said it's not a traditional winger's function. It isn't. That's also a fact.

My entire point was to refute the notion that "history shows" if a guy like Zibanejad signs a long term deal that it'll kill the team's chances of winning a Cup and providing an example to support that argument. Please point to where I was talking about Stamkos' role in either Cup win.
 
brakeyawself said:
That's what I'm saying. Send them Lundkvist and a protected 1st and just get Turcotte over here. Or Vilardi, or even Kupari. Hell, they might not even need to move Lundkvist to get Kupari, it might cost Jones. Or see if the Jets will move Perfetti or PLD. They have Scheifele, just drafted Lucius. Maybe they can send one of the other 2.
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I think once Lundkvist gets into the league, your trade proposals may look a lot different. He is going to be a special player.
 
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