Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XXI

[NYSPORTS]

You can’t compare these situations. Fox was a completely unproven prospect and I don’t think anyone thought he’d be be quite this good.

well, i just did compare them and i felt Fox was going to be very good just as i think Nils will be very good. Rangers are in good shape so long as they don’t award these long, expensive contracts with NTCs.

 

[brakeyawself]

Feels like a matter of when, not if, now with Eichel. Drury has purposely left around 10 mil in cap space for flexibility to make the trade whenever Buffalo faces the music. The way i see it its probably Kravtsov+Lundkvist+2022 1st with maybe Georgiev thrown in. Could also see Kakko+Jones+2021 1st as an alternative, which would hurt, but you have to give to get. After that i assume they would flip Strome to Vegas for Reilly Smith to plug the RW hole.

Theres a 4-6 year stretch in which Panarin/Kreider/Goodrow/Shesterkin/Trouba/Eichel/Zibanejad(presumably) all come off the books. This is the window in which they will and should try to win a Cup. The team wont let Fox & Lafreniere go i think thats clear, but difficult decisions will need to be made. We need to start thinking in the Now, not worrying about future value as much. The rebuild is over.

No, not when. I’m not sure why people think it’s so close . Drury would have made any of those moves all ready. If he were going to. He’s not giving up most of those players and not biting until price drops way more.

Drury knows EICHEl would just be a luxury player for us. HE won’t move those assets for a player we don’t really need.

 

[Ola]

I agree with most of what is being said about Drury, albeit judgement should be reserved until we know the quality of the acquired players and see how they fit in here. Sammy Blais for example, I recognize the name and have some recollections of him playing with intensity. I don't know if he is an NHLer or not, how can I judge that trade?

With that said, -- what talks in Drury's favor -- is that there is a lot of room for improvement after Gorton. Build up a professional winning organization. Adding capable persons to the room when decisions are made. Ensuring that we have a professional environment in HFD.

All topics are so complex and can be debated back and forth forever. But past all the circumstances that can be debated, it really be questioned that management in several areas did a piss poor job. No matter what you think about Lias Andersson, I would bet my right arm that nobody of Gorton, Clarke or Drury today would argue that it was a good call to decide to bring him to NA and rush him to the NHL at 18 y/o. No matter what people think of different components of the JT Miller and McDonagh trade, I would be my right arm that the organization aren't happy with the value they assigned to Namestnikov in that trade. I would bet my right arm that the organization wasn't happy with how HFD had functioned before the 'overhaul' came.

And I mean, its not good that you can't look at a Lias Andersson and say, hey this kid is if nothing else going to need some time. Its not good that you cannot recognize that a Namestnikov is a talented albeit headless player. Its not good that we totally neglected HFD for a long time. On top of these issues we have a boatload of ones that can be discussed back and forth forever, but on which I think convincing cases can be made in a more severe direction. Dave Quinn. The bridge deals. All that crap.

In all honesty, I think the boat sailed for Gorton when we signed JD. JD is an amazing guy who has a lot of abilities, but he was never going to be the professional manager this franchise required.

 

[jay from jersey]

ty - so the Rangers have some flexibility and not completely handcuffed like Hank.

Yes. Trouba and his wife/girlfriend, whatever also have a home in FLA they live there in the offseason.
Trouba will be easier to move, he won’t even be 30 when his NMC switches and he’s a big Mobile top 4 RD that moves the puck well in transition and plays heavy minutes. Team are always looking for that. I don’t see them magically just stopping in a few years.
Kreids is also not really too hard to move either. Playoff teams are always looking for net front guys and speed guys to add to their roster come playoff time. At the moment, Kreids does both. He might require some retention, but nothing too crazy. Fans that think we are stuck with them til their deals run out are wrong. There’s always LTIR, and burying them or buying them out if things become too crazy. Obviously, they’d rather trade though.

 

[Blueshirts777]

He def forced himself here. That’s how we got him for 2 2nds. Wouldn’t sign with Calgary and wouldn’t sign with canes when traded. It was common knowledge he wanted to be a ranger

Yes I understand how he got here, I was quoting the point that he "literally won't play for any other team besides the NYR" which somehow correlates to a deep discount. Like he would retire if he wasn't offered a deal. Jumping to that conclusion because he wouldn't sign with two teams seems a little far fetched.

 

[McRanger92]

No, not when. I’m not sure why people think it’s so close . Drury would have made any of those moves all ready. If he were going to. He’s not giving up most of those players and not biting until price drops way more.

Drury knows EICHEl would just be a luxury player for us. HE won’t move those assets for a player we don’t really rally no wedlock need.

Im not saying a deal is close, im just saying this feels like the Nash trade where theres 2 teams staring each other down waiting for the other to blink

 

[duhmetreE]

I think you may be setting your expectations for Blais a little high. He was a regular healthy scratch, he is NOT a 3rd line player. He is a 4th liner/scratch. And he is not a good skater in any capacity, Reaves is a better skater than him.

So was Gauthier. Does he not have potential? Blais could be a good middle6 winger.

I don't know where you got he's a bad skater. Worse than Reaves?

 

[Tob]

As far as playing his cards right, Drury has played the mind games on Mika's negotiation and the mind games on Adam's negotiation right. We are both immensely interested in Eichel and a foregone conclusion to a lot of people and yet not that interested at all. Vally and Larry have both been reporting a lot of mish mash back and forth bull crap. I don't think anyone can genuinely tell if Drury's desired end game is a cheaper Mika or to trade the farm for Eichel.

 

[brakeyawself]

well, i just did compare them and i felt Fox was going to be very good just as i think Nils will be very good. Rangers are in good shape so long as they don’t award these long, expensive contracts with NTCs.

You’re silly. Of course people thought he was going to be very good. BUt he’s more than that now even RANgers didnt know it. IM sure Lundqvist will be, hes a higher rated prospect than Fox ever was.

 

[McRanger92]

If they were gonna trade Kakko for him it would have happened already.

Could be. Its very unlikely but if BUF retained even 1-2 million on Eichel, id include Kakko. It would certainly make it easier to stomach Eichel + Zibanejad contracts

 

[jay from jersey]

Yes I understand how he got here, I was quoting the point that he "literally won't play for any other team besides the NYR" which somehow correlates to a deep discount. Like he would retire if he wasn't offered a deal. Jumping to that conclusion because he wouldn't sign with two teams seems a little far fetched.

Ohh, sorry. I misunderstood. I thought you said there was no evidence of him wanting rangers.
I doubt he’d retire, but he’s a guy that would likely want to stay close to home. Think NJ, NYI, maybe philly. Def staying in the northeast was very important to him.
Carolina isn’t too far away, they were a contender and on the east coast and he still wouldn’t sign. I see why they took a shot.
I think staying close to family and friends was tremendously important to fox.
He left money on the table early, and was intent on going Unsigned UFA

 

[haohmaru]

Spidey sense tingling that nothing is going to happen today.

 

[Ola]

We still don't have a AGM or a GM for the AHL. Both of these were Drurys previous roles, are we saying that they aren't important? In early May, Friedman wrote that interest around the league in working for Drury was high. What happened to that? They were in for Ryan Hardy but he choose to go work for Dubas & Toronto. Lilley has been here for 2 seconds. Has this just been the Drury & Grier show?

I called out Drury for the same thing about the same time too IIRC.

It is more of the same old that must be corrected with this organization. Two years ago we hired Kris Knoblauch in early August. Was like season end, two month until the fire Gernander, another two months before a replacement is signed. This means that the coach wasn't in the room or in the loop in any way when players were brought in for the team. Its of course not the end of the world and might not have any kind of significant impact whatsoever on things. But when you run a professional organization it can only be done by impact the circumstances you can impact in the best way possible -- and we are constantly behind on these issues. Across the board.

 

[haohmaru]

Could be. Its very unlikely but if BUF retained even 1-2 million on Eichel, id include Kakko. It would certainly make it easier to stomach Eichel + Zibanejad contracts

Nope. Not trading the 20 year old 2nd 2OA in franchise history for a guy with a neck injury and no medical report. Screw that.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

As far as playing his cards right, Drury has played the mind games on Mika's negotiation and the mind games on Adam's negotiation right. We are both immensely interested in Eichel and a foregone conclusion to a lot of people and yet not that interested at all. Vally and Larry have both been reporting a lot of mish mash back and forth bull crap. I don't think anyone can genuinely tell if Drury's desired end game is a cheaper Mika or to trade the farm for Eichel.

There are no mind game to be played with Fox.

He has been one of the best, if not the best defenseman in the league since the middle of his rookie season, people who got hip to him last year (not anyone here) only did so because they were drooling over the "make something out of nothing" nature of Makar and Hughes while completely ignoring that they were just as likely to "make nothing out of something."

Fox will continue to be one of the best, if not the best defenseman in the league moving forward unless he has a down year, which I wouldn't anticipate happening at all. The more hes had put on his plate, the better hes gotten. Everyone knows hes going to get paid - It's just a matter of whether or not he wants to stay here for max term or if he wants to bet on himself and cash in now with a chance to cash in even harder in 5 years ala Makar.

On Eichel: Vally's thrown some shit out there, he's likely just having fun. The people who are really worth listening to have all indicated that they have either made serious low ball offers or aren't really all that crazy about him. Maybe this is the ultimate mind game being played here by Drury, but we know that he's at least pursued a different option (Danault) and who knows what else hes got cooking right now.

 

[SA16]

I called out Drury for the same thing about the same time too IIRC.

It is more of the same old that must be corrected with this organization. Two years ago we hired Kris Knoblauch in early August. Was like season end, two month until the fire Gernander, another two months before a replacement is signed. This means that the coach wasn't in the room or in the loop in any way when players were brought in for the team. Its of course not the end of the world and might not have any kind of significant impact whatsoever on things. But when you run a professional organization it can only be done by impact the circumstances you can impact in the best way possible -- and we are constantly behind on these issues. Across the board.

Probably a good thing. Whenever coaches have input on the roster it is just to advise to bring in their favorite terrible players like Glass and Johnson.

 

[EdJovanovski]

So was Gauthier. Does he not have potential? Blais could be a good middle6 winger.

I don't know where you got he's a bad skater. Worse than Reaves?

Gauthier is 23 & Blais is 25, Blais was picked 174th overall & Gauthier was 21st overall.
Sure they have some limited potential but I wouldn't trade Buchnevich for Gauthier either lol.
Watching his highlights he is pretty darn slow. I'm not going to blame him for Drury being a moron though so I hope he does well

 

[jay from jersey]

You’re silly. Of course people thought he was going to be very good. BUt he’s more than that now even RANgers didnt know it. IM sure Lundqvist will be, hes a higher rated prospect than Fox ever was.

I do think nils is a very good prospect. I don’t see where he gets the opportunity to showcase and develop all the excellent things he can do if he’s on 3rd pair, playing 3rd pair minutes for longer then 1 season. I see only 2 conclusions with him.
1- he’s moved to the left where he can assume a top 4 role as early as next year( which would likely make Miller available)
2- he’s traded for a high end C

 

[jay from jersey]

Gauthier is 23 & Blais is 25, Blais was picked 174th overall & Gauthier was 21st overall.
Sure they have some limited potential but I wouldn't trade Buchnevich for Gauthier either lol.
Watching his highlights he is pretty darn slow. I'm not going to blame him for Drury being a moron though so I hope he does well

From my understanding from talking to blues fans was that Blais was scratched a lot due to injury. He would go at high speeds hitting everything and sometimes he wouldn’t hold up when he should and wound up getting hurt. He for sure had his time on the bottom 6 but also time on ROR s line. They all say he has good hands and a sneaky good shot that fools goalies. He’s also very good on defense and the forecheck.
As far as his skating, I don’t think I’ve heard anyone say he’s a poor skater, but I don’t think he’s a burner or Nylander level either.

 

[EdJovanovski]

I do think nils is a very good prospect. I don’t see where he gets the opportunity to showcase and develop all the excellent things he can do if he’s on 3rd pair, playing 3rd pair minutes for longer then 1 season. I see only 2 conclusions with him.
1- he’s moved to the left where he can assume a top 4 role as early as next year( which would likely make Miller available)
2- he’s traded for a high end C

He could start on the 3rd pair & PP, DeAngelo flourished doing just that. But I don't know if he'll get much time on PP2, not sure if we'd want both him & Fox on PP1. So many right hand shots.

I think we start him on 3rd pair & PP2, we could sort of have more equal ice time for our pairings. Eventually we might be able to force Trouba out somehow and then have Fox-Lundkvist-Schneider

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I do think nils is a very good prospect. I don’t see where he gets the opportunity to showcase and develop all the excellent things he can do if he’s on 3rd pair, playing 3rd pair minutes for longer then 1 season. I see only 2 conclusions with him.
1- he’s moved to the left where he can assume a top 4 role as early as next year( which would likely make Miller available)
2- he’s traded for a high end C

The 3rd pair isn't the problem. Sheltering him at ES is what would be best for him and the team, especially off the bat.

The issue is he won't get on PP1 as long as Fox is here. Thats going to be where he makes his biggest impact in this league.

 

[Tob]

There are no mind game to be played with Fox.

He has been one of the best, if not the best defenseman in the league since the middle of his rookie season, people who got hip to him last year (not anyone here) only did so because they were drooling over the "make something out of nothing" nature of Makar and Hughes while completely ignoring that they were just as likely to "make nothing out of something."

Fox will continue to be one of the best, if not the best defenseman in the league moving forward unless he has a down year, which I wouldn't anticipate happening at all. The more hes had put on his plate, the better hes gotten. Everyone knows hes going to get paid - It's just a matter of whether or not he wants to stay here for max term or if he wants to bet on himself and cash in now with a chance to cash in even harder in 5 years ala Makar.

On Eichel: Vally's thrown some shit out there, he's likely just having fun. The people who are really worth listening to have all indicated that they have either made serious low ball offers or aren't really all that crazy about him. Maybe this is the ultimate mind game being played here by Drury, but we know that he's at least pursued a different option (Danault) and who knows what else hes got cooking right now.

oops i left out an s on Adams. I was talking about Kevyn, not Adam.

lmfao imagine calling Adam Fox Adam. Adam isn't even a real name.

 

[jay from jersey]

He could start on the 3rd pair & PP, DeAngelo flourished doing just that. But I don't know if he'll get much time on PP2, not sure if we'd want both him & Fox on PP1. So many right hand shots.

I think we start him on 3rd pair & PP2, we could sort of have more equal ice time for our pairings. Eventually we might be able to force Trouba out somehow and then have Fox-Lundkvist-Schneider

that would require moving trouba 2 years early. I think nils is fine on 3rd pair this season. Next season is the problem.
Trouba and fox still going nowhere and Schneider is likely ready to step in for 3rd pair duty. They aren’t going to hinder Schneider’s development

 

[jay from jersey]

The 3rd pair isn't the problem. Sheltering him at ES is what would be best for him and the team, especially off the bat.

The issue is he won't get on PP1 as long as Fox is here. Thats going to be where he makes his biggest impact in this league.

Yes, I agree. And unless he gets on 1st PP in a shooters spot, where he can use that laser, it’s almost pointless to keep him if you can repeatedly use his best assets.

LD- with heavy minutes or a trade. That’s his future. No doubt in my mind

 

[Clark Kellogg]

I know this will go over like a led balloon and the odds of it ever happening would be astronomical; If I where in the Rangers front office I would suggest trading with the Toronto Maple Leafs an the two centerpieces of the trade being Adam Fox and Austin Matthews. Same age, helps each teams needs and the Rangers depth at defense.I believe that a top 5OA NHL Center has more value than a Norris Trophy winning Defenseman with two years in the league.
Keep in mind PK Suban won a Norris Trophy early in his career.