Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XXI

[True Blue]

I think that is easier to say now than it will be after next season when the Rangers are likely to be pretty bad again.

I realize that. But to me, he represents the leader that will lead them through the rebuild and emerge on the other side.

Again, no one is untradeable. But to get Kreider, the other organization is going to have to cringe. And if they are not willing, then they do not need to get him.

 

[True Blue]

i love kreider, but panarin is a top 15-20 player in the league....that is something kreids will never be

And the Rangers do not need him to. Nor does a rebuilding team need t sign a 27 year old to a 8-10 year contract that is probably worth north of $10m.

 

[Thirty One]

And the Rangers do not need him to. Nor does a rebuilding team need t sign a 27 year old to a 8-10 year contract that is probably worth north of $10m.

Doubt we give him an 8-10 year contract.

 

[True Blue]

It's all a bit of semantics. Skinner was sort of in a similar situation this summer and look what Carolina got for him. Is that fair market value for a guy that age who can score 30 goals and has a year and a half left on this deal? We better hope not. I'm just saying I'd want a hefty premium for a guy who Id have no problem extending for 6 more years.

Oh, don't misunderstand. As I have said all along, nothing short of a king's ransom if you want to get Kreider

 

[Edge]

The challenge with someone like Panarin is that the best years of his contract are when the team isn't there with him, and the downside years are when they start to hit their stride.

It's as much about timing as it is talent.

And that might be the question that comes up concerning Kreider. Is he looking for 6 years or 8? Etc., etc.

With some of these players, we have to keep in mind that it's not a one way street. For someone like Kreider, this next contract is going to be his biggest payday in the NHL. Depending on the length of the deal, it's also potentially his last payday in the NHL.

Just something to keep in mind when we look at how we want to keep. It's not entirely based on whether or not we want them on the team.

 

[True Blue]

Maybe a nice game of chutes and ladders?

It's Chess!

 

[Off Sides]

I realize that. But to me, he represents the leader that will lead them through the rebuild and emerge on the other side.

Again, no one is untradeable. But to get Kreider, the other organization is going to have to cringe. And if they are not willing, then they do not need to get him.

I'm more on, they would be trading for these playoffs, his next season and those playoffs, so something like two rental returns would be where I'd be at.

I don't consider extending him if he is going to ask for a clause that protects him from more than 5 teams , 6 years, 7M. I think he will ask for more than that so I'm just trying to maximize the return I could get for him before I basically turn him into one rental return.

It's not that I do not understand your point of view, I guess I just see this whole rebuild if they let it play out more or less organically, taking a timeline that goes beyond Kreider's remaining effective years.

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

Panarin can only be given a 7 year max deal...unless the Rangers trade for him in the next 7 weeks which is not happening.

I'm not trying to be overly optimistic but you get a guy like Hughes or Kakko and Kravstov comes over, going after and getting Panarin becomes exponentially more appealing and logical.

All of a sudden your top 6 and especially middle 6 become much much better, and if any of the prospects they get in trades this TDL OR one of Virta/Paju are ahead of schedule, that forward core is pretty pretty good. That's not even factoring in Lias who should be with the big club next year or if a guy like Meskannen, Gettinger, or some college UFA can steal a spot.

 

[Machinehead]

Panarin can only be given a 7 year max deal...unless the Rangers trade for him in the next 7 weeks which is not happening.

I'm not trying to be overly optimistic but you get a guy like Hughes or Kakko and Kravstov comes over, going after and getting Panarin becomes exponentially more appealing and logical.

All of a sudden your top 6 and especially middle 6 become much much better, and if any of the prospects they get in trades this TDL OR one of Virta/Paju are ahead of schedule, that forward core is pretty pretty good. That's not even factoring in Lias who should be with the big club next year or if a guy like Meskannen, Gettinger, or some college UFA can steal a spot.

Things become a lot clearer and the game changes when we know where our pick is.

 

[Edge]

I would say someone like Hughes, and to a lesser extent Kakko would shift the conversation considerably.

How much? Hard to say right now. But I do think if start getting into the realm, you would see some possibilities increase.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Avs and Jets are two teams that would like Hayes as a rental and maybe more if he would stay.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Panarin takes some pressure off of Kravtsov, Chytil, Anderson and Howden. I've said it before but not having solid wingers outside of Kreider has heaped undo pressure on Chytil, and even though his stay was short Andersson too and probably Howden who looks like he is holding his stick too tight when he is getting chances. Adding a 30 goal scoring winger takes the pressure off the kids. I'm all in on Panarin or Stone if they are available.

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

As @Machinehead said, a lot depends on the pick. Anything in the top 5 you get Hughes/Kakko/Dach/Podz/Cozens then go all in for one of Panarin or Stone.

If Byram is the guy or the scouts like him more than let's say Cozens (based on Rangers drafting I see Byram as 5th best on their board behind Hughes/Kakko/Podz/Dach..no factual information just based on trends and recent history) it changes the approach.

I'm really hoping they get a late 1st and can draft Hoglander. That would be an amazing jersey and every time he scores at MSG they can play the Napolean in Bill & Ted Ziggy Piggy scene (for those too young, google it).

 

[Machinehead]

You can always use more Swedish guys.

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

You can always use more Swedish guys.

I can know nothing about the specific player, but I’ll always be into the idea of taking a Swede in the mid-late rounds

 

[NYRFANMANI]

Holy shit, I could trade anybody. Get what you can for Shattenkirk and Skjei ...

 

[Ghost of jas]

I would say someone like Hughes, and to a lesser extent Kakko would shift the conversation considerably.

How much? Hard to say right now. But I do think if start getting into the realm, you would see some possibilities increase.

I still see a disaster on defense.

 

[Edge]

I still see a disaster on defense.

I think the Rangers would then pursue moves on defense. Not that it would solve everything, but I think with Hughes/Zibanejad/Chytil/Andersson/Howden on the roster, you either have multiple moves to the wings, or you see some trades.

Job wouldn't be done by any stretch, but I do think the Rangers would look to get a little more aggressive a little sooner. Maybe not all on July 1, but ahead of where they would without.

As @Machinehead said, a lot depends on the pick. Anything in the top 5 you get Hughes/Kakko/Dach/Podz/Cozens then go all in for one of Panarin or Stone.

If Byram is the guy or the scouts like him more than let's say Cozens (based on Rangers drafting I see Byram as 5th best on their board behind Hughes/Kakko/Podz/Dach..no factual information just based on trends and recent history) it changes the approach.

I'm really hoping they get a late 1st and can draft Hoglander. That would be an amazing jersey and every time he scores at MSG they can play the Napolean in Bill & Ted Ziggy Piggy scene (for those too young, google it).

I dunno, I think if it's anyone other than Hughes and (to a lesser extent) Kakko, I don't think much changes.

Those other names are going to be a little longer ways out, and while impactful, are not on the level of the top 2. There's a pretty good gap there with talent, timeline, and talent and timeline in some cases.

 

[Lundy HOF]

I still see a disaster on defense.

That is true but if you trade Hayes and Zucc and have another 3 1st picks to play with (assuming good returns of course) and you luck into Hughes or Kakko.

You now have a franchise type player on your hands and more assets to make a move.

Would you, in that case, sign Panarin and trade Kreider + a pick for a high quality D? Consider EK?

It opens up a lot of interesting roads on the decision tree and certainly kicks this rebuild into an entire other gear.

 

[FIRE DRURY]

East
TB: 68
TO: 56
Caps: 56
BOS: 54
PIT: 54
Buf: 52
CLB: 51
Habs: 51
______
NYI: 50
CAR: 45
FLA: 41

West
CAL: 60
VGS: 58
NSH: 57
SJS: 57
WPG:56
DAL: 50
COL: 48
ANA: 46
______
MIN: 45
Van: 44
EDM: 43
CHI: 40

8 points separates teams 2~9 in the East.

7 points separates teams 6~11 in the West.

There are a lot of teams separated by just a couple of points. A 3-game slide for most teams in the race can be crippling.

I see 4-5 teams that don’t the luxury of patience. There’s pressure for sure.

There will be plenty of buyers. There’s also going to likely be some key injuries between now and the deadline.

Hayes not only a great insurance as a C, he adds depth, versatility and experience. He’s played 34 games of playoff hockey.

Zucc has 60 playoff games. McQuaid is a RHD with 68.

The Panthers are a mess. Too much talent there and they can’t stop ****ing up. Min, EDM, Van and Chi are all in arms length of being a wild card team. They’re right behind Dal, Col, and ANA.

This is going to be a very interesting deadline. Gorton has chips and he likes to gamble. That’s the last of my poker references for the day

 

[Gardner McKay]

In a tournament with the pressure of increasing blinds, then yes. Absolutely.

In a cash game where you have the luxury of patience, then I’d have to disagree.

Very fair.

 

[Ola]

I don't think any of those teams would be interested or would acquire him to play center.

Only the Rangers are dumb enough to pay for 1st liners at the deadline and put them on the 3rd line.

Pittsburgh trades for Kessel and used him on a 3rd line, worked well for them...

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Pittsburgh trades for Kessel and used him on a 3rd line, worked well for them...

Who happens to be playing with our former 1st line center Brassard

 

[NYR Viper]

The key at this deadline is to continue to add pieces that can allow Gorton to be flexible in his approach. Resigning Hayes does not do that. Same goes for Zuccarello. That’s another reason moving them make sense. It’s flexibiltiy and more pieces to use as the team moves forward

 

[Matz03]

Kreider is a good enough left wing to keep around long term. If you can shed one of the crappy D, you take a swing to grab a high end right winger like Panarin or Stone. Stone is younger and very different than Panarin, wonder who will cost more. Having two high end wingers would really help the younger guys not be overwhelmed as we’ve recently seen and we could be adding to rookies into the top 9 with Kravstov and our first. Zucc will be gone and likely Hayes, and we need to insulate guys like Chytil, Howden hopefully Andersson with some players. Vesey, Strome, Buch, even Fast can’t be expected to do that.

They must get away from 2 of Smith, Shatty, and McQuaid. Ada needs to play everyday, even if just to build some value. Cleasson need to get one of those super cheap 2-3 year deals so we have that good flexible vet in place. Shatty also needs to play to maybe become a chip the next trade deadline.