Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XLVI

[NYRKING30]

it may be overly optimistic, but with progression from kakko, buch, kravtsov, chytil, deangelo, fox, hajek and the addition of panarin/hall/different free agent signings, i think this team can surprise. hank mentoring shesterkin will be good for him, and any team with an elite goalie and some firepower can make a run.

obviously making a run and contending aren't really the same thing, but imo 3-4 years is a good estimate as to when this team will be making deep runs again.

also, i wouldn't classify karlsson and panarin as everyone who wants to play in new york. these guys are elite talents that don't always come around for just cap space. otherwise we'd need to really hit on a draft pick or give up signifigant assets to acquire

Between the 7 players you have mentioned, there is a grand total of 5 NHL games played combined. They could all hit the ground running and possibly even stall their development for a year or two who knows. Just because their “free” doesn’t necessarily make them the perfect addition. Part of a rebuild IMO, is also having some foresight about your timeline and cap situation looks like down the road. Maintaining flexibility at this juncture is very important. Rebuilding teams don’t add an 11 million dollar player 1.25 years after declaring a rebuild is taking place. We still have a lot of moving parts.

I was just asking if because a player has a desire to play in NY should we sign them? Karlsson is breaking down faster then a 2 dollar prostitute with all of his piling injuries.

There will be a time where it is the right move to start adding significant players. That time is not right now.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Karlsson won't sign that type of contract. This is likely his last contract he will get big money for and will want it long term before other teams figure out that they aren't getting the great Karlsson of old. I'm hoping he signs else where. That contract will be horrendous in even his first 3 years. And I'm okay with signing panarin but ho estly with the crazy money that skinner just got the breadman will be looking to cash In and while he is worth inking, I just dont think that he is worth paying over market value compared to a guy like McDavid. Panarin. Will want 12-13 after skinners albatross contract. To me I'd much rather wait, let our own ****ty contracts run out and in 2 years we have money to go after big name free agents. Stay the course and sign players like Simmonds, Panik, Ennis, whatever for cheap and short term deals. Trade them at the deadline for draft capital to continue to build through the draft like championship teams. I mean why not just wait for Taylor hall next year then we have 3 expiring contracts that we can trade in shatty Smith and Staal. Nothing wrong with waiting and doing rebuilding the right way. I'd rather have a few more blahs seasons and be a power house than just squeak into the playoffs and be up against the cap

I dont think Karlsson is gonna have much of a choice really. Either his per year is going to have to come down or his term,there is too much risk involved in signing that deal.

 

[Chalfdiggity3]

i can get on board with the hall signing, but if panarin can be had at 11, i think you pull the trigger now. if he's looking at skinner and saying 12-13, let him be paid that much elsewhere, and attempt to sign hall to a large deal like that.

Panarin will not sign for 11 especially after seeing what skinner got. I'm all for 11aav for panarin but I just dont see it happening. It will be a bidding war and 11 will be the starting point for him.

Instead like I stated before let's sign Simmonds to a 1yr 4m contract, and a player or two of panik who is like grabner and Ennis who can be a very good 3rd liner who a contending team for 1 year a few million each. Their contracts this year was all around 1.5-2m. They will be great trade bait and trading them for multiple 1st through 3rd round picks would be awesome. Then we can sign hall, have our bad contracts go bye bye and be able to use our draft capital to move up high into the 1st and get more top tier prospects

 

[HFsNumber1Heel]

I dont think Karlsson is gonna have much of a choice really. Either his per year is going to have to come down or his term,there is too much risk involved in signing that deal.

Signing Karlsson even to a four year deal is dangerous. It's going to be Shattenkirk all over again.

 

[Leetch3]

it may be overly optimistic, but with progression from kakko, buch, kravtsov, chytil, deangelo, fox, hajek and the addition of panarin/hall/different free agent signings, i think this team can surprise. hank mentoring shesterkin will be good for him, and any team with an elite goalie and some firepower can make a run.

obviously making a run and contending aren't really the same thing, but imo 3-4 years is a good estimate as to when this team will be making deep runs again.

also, i wouldn't classify karlsson and panarin as everyone who wants to play in new york. these guys are elite talents that don't always come around for just cap space. otherwise we'd need to really hit on a draft pick or give up signifigant assets to acquire

I think it is definitely overly optimistic to expect so much out of those kids. Most kids aren’t stars from day one. Even with many of the young elite players it takes to their 3rd or 4th season to bust out...

I would rather have lower more realistic expectations for the kids with the chance of them exceeding those and being pleasantly surprise over setting expectations too high and then being disappointed

 

[Chalfdiggity3]

I dont think Karlsson is gonna have much of a choice really. Either his per year is going to have to come down or his term,there is too much risk involved in signing that deal.

Which is why we dont sign him at all. I dont want to touch that kind of contract with him.

 

[Fitzy]

Signing Karlsson even to a four year deal is dangerous. It's going to be Shattenkirk all over again.

It's not a certainty, but it's not a risk I'm willing to take.

I'd say there's a 20% chance that he's total crap in 2 years, a 50% chance that he declines and is an overpaid 50 point PP specialist for much of the contract, and around a 25% chance that he declines gradually and still produces 70+ points for the next 4-5 years.

5% that he finds amazing longevity and plays great until 36-37

Ultimately that's not a positive gamble for a contract that is going to be 7x11 at least.

 

[Hire Sather]

No interest in even discussing terms with Karlsson

He's about as sure fire a pick to decline rapidly as I've ever seen

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Signing Karlsson even to a four year deal is dangerous. It's going to be Shattenkirk all over again.

I want no part of him, was just saying he is gonna have to come down from what he was offered in Ottawa.

 

[Shesterkybomb]

Which is why we dont sign him at all. I dont want to touch that kind of contract with him.

I wasn't saying I wanted him, just saying he is gonna have to accept a lower contract wherever he goes.

 

[Fitzy]

Like, who realistically sees Karlsson getting that much less than Doughty? There are no Duncan Keith style contracts any more. Teams can't stretch the cap hit with years in the late 30's.

 

[tradenashnow]

Why sign him when you just acquired Fox. With DeAngelo hopefully continue to mature and Fox, the Rangers have 2, talented, offensive D righty defenseman. Now they need a big, nasty, righty D man to round out the right side.

 

[Lindberg Cheese]

Between the 7 players you have mentioned, there is a grand total of 5 NHL games played combined. They could all hit the ground running and possibly even stall their development for a year or two who knows. Just because their “free” doesn’t necessarily make them the perfect addition. Part of a rebuild IMO, is also having some foresight about your timeline and cap situation looks like down the road. Maintaining flexibility at this juncture is very important. Rebuilding teams don’t add an 11 million dollar player 1.25 years after declaring a rebuild is taking place. We still have a lot of moving parts.

I was just asking if because a player has a desire to play in NY should we sign them? Karlsson is breaking down faster then a 2 dollar prostitute with all of his piling injuries.

There will be a time where it is the right move to start adding significant players. That time is not right now.

You don’t know what you’re talking about, $2 prossies are some of the toughest people on earth

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

Why sign him when you just acquired Fox. With DeAngelo hopefully continue to mature and Fox, the Rangers have 2, talented, offensive D righty defenseman. Now they need a big, nasty, righty D man to round out the right side.

It's not 1989 anymore

 

[Fitzy]

It's not 1989 anymore

I think big and nasty can also be interpreted as big, puck separating blueliner who is good at handling tougher possession style players like Kakko and Nash.

Not everyone needs to be a jitterbug on defense.

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

I think big and nasty can also be interpreted as big, puck separating blueliner who is good at handling tougher possession style players like Kakko and Nash.

Not everyone needs to be a jitterbug on defense.

I want a good defenseman first. If "big and nasty" is your priority, you end up with McIlrath

 

[kinger8998]

I think it is definitely overly optimistic to expect so much out of those kids. Most kids aren’t stars from day one. Even with many of the young elite players it takes to their 3rd or 4th season to bust out...

I would rather have lower more realistic expectations for the kids with the chance of them exceeding those and being pleasantly surprise over setting expectations too high and then being disappointed

i said we could make a run in 3 to 4 years. that would be andersson, chytil and howdens 4th or 5th season. kravtsov and kakko's 3rd or 4th too. So based on your own rpediction, they would be busted out by then?

DeAngelos 5ht or 6th, Fox's 3rd or 4th. Zibanejad will still be in his prime, Buchnevich will be better. We won't need other young kids like hajek/lindgren to be broken out becasue we have all the other guys.

This isn't counting any free agent signings, whether it be huge like panarin or just one like RNH when he gets there. this isn't counting our 20th overall pick this year, or an NHL ready talent in 2020 if we get a good enough pick.

Also, if we aren't getting Panarin, I'm sure were doing all we can to re-up Kreider. He will still be a contributing power forward. Even if one of our young players missteps and isn't busted out quite yet, theres enough good already here, and enough good to be potentially added via trades (names, vesey, shattenkirk, georgiev), FA, or Draft that I think some of you are just as pessimistic as I may be optimistic. 3-4 years brings us to 4.25-5.25 years since the letter. 2.25 spent of that rebuilding, 1-2 building and that last year would be the first year we make a run with what we've got. don't get me wrong I'm not saying we buy at that Trade Deadline, it's just that with what we've got in house and have to potential to add before that moment, I think there is plenty of reason to be optimistic

 

[Fitzy]

I want a good defenseman first. If "big and nasty" is your priority, you end up with McIlrath

Could also end up with Parayko or Suter/Weber. Just depends on your definition of nasty.

 

[kinger8998]

No interest in even discussing terms with Karlsson

He's about as sure fire a pick to decline rapidly as I've ever seen

I'll have to be the one that won't agree with the majority here. Karlsson will likely end up shorter term 4-5 years at 10.5M and that's a contract I'd take every day for him, especially at 4 years.

if another team signs him hopefully |I'm wrong and you can all quote this saying you told me so, because if he signs that deal elsewhere and doesn't break down, ill sure as hell quote this and put it in here to gloat LOL

 

[ETTER DE]

I don’t want this. Anyways, it’s not whether or not to get rid of the contracts, it’s how much are we willing to pay to do it. There’s virtually no immediate benefit to clearing the caproom, so I’m not willing to pay much of anything to move the contracts. Let the contracts expire and they can rot in a press box if a rookie takes their spot. If you can find a trading partner that makes sense, great. But let’s be realistic here.

I think you take this way to easy. We are talking about 7-8 million for Smith alone. 20 million if you add Shattenkirk. 20 million. Actual money. Thats terrible to pay two guys in the press box. I know if I was the owner, I would like to see some effort to get rid of these contracts, or parts of them at least. Rangers is not near the cap floor.

 

[NoQuitInNewMexico]

If EK wants to sign here for 3-4 years to be in the NYC tabloids and hang out with Hank, I wouldn't hate it. On the surface it would be a hilariously "dark ages Rangers" move but I still wouldn't hate it. Maybe I'm just in a good mood today.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I think you take this way to easy. We are talking about 7-8 million for Smith alone. 20 million if you add Shattenkirk. 20 million. Actual money. Thats terrible to pay two guys in the press box. I know if I was the owner, I would like to see some effort to get rid of these contracts, or parts of them at least. Rangers is not near the cap floor.

They've basically paid for players to play for other teams.

They don't need the space, so why do it?

 

[GeorgeKaplan]

I think you take this way to easy. We are talking about 7-8 million for Smith alone. 20 million if you add Shattenkirk. 20 million. Actual money. Thats terrible to pay two guys in the press box. I know if I was the owner, I would like to see some effort to get rid of these contracts, or parts of them at least. Rangers is not near the cap floor.

Dolan probably pays more for his band to play shows

 

[Avery16]

I think you take this way to easy. We are talking about 7-8 million for Smith alone. 20 million if you add Shattenkirk. 20 million. Actual money. Thats terrible to pay two guys in the press box. I know if I was the owner, I would like to see some effort to get rid of these contracts, or parts of them at least. Rangers is not near the cap floor.

1) Actual money means absolutely nothing to Dolan. 2) cap hits are assessed annually, not the total worth of the contract 3) we are not in danger of exceeding the cap or having to make caproom based decisions in the next two seasons.

 

[NYRKING30]

You don’t know what you’re talking about, $2 prossies are some of the toughest people on earth

Tough? Yes, but far more damaged goods than toughness.