Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part XLIV

[egelband]

Colin Miller appears to be the righty version of Brendan Smith. In terms of discipline/consistency. Not sure he's what we want.

 

[Michal]

Shatty (50% retention), Names (50% retention), 2 rd 2019, 2 rd 2020
for
Milan Lucic (6m , 4 yrs bad contract), 8OA 2019, 1 rd 2020.

What do you think?

I am obviously against signing long term expensive UFAs until at least summer 2021 or 2022. I prefer gaining youth assets.

 

[I Eat Crow]

Colin Miller appears to be the righty version of Brendan Smith. In terms of discipline/consistency. Not sure he's what we want.

Not even close, my friend.

Despite heavy offensive usage, Miller had a CF% of 56.9. 56.3% the year before. 60.3% in his last year with Boston. The guy is a chance generating machine.

Smith's numbers, were, uh...not as good.

 

[I Eat Crow]

Shatty (50% retention), Names (50% retention), 2 rd 2019, 2 rd 2020
for
Milan Lucic (6m , 4 yrs bad contract), 8OA 2019, 1 rd 2020.

What do you think?

I am obviously against signing long term expensive UFAs until at least summer 2021 or 2022. I prefer gaining youth assets.

The committments to Shattenkirk and Namestnikov are only two and one more years long, respectively. The Rangers having to take on Lucic's full contract for the next three years makes acquiring just about anyone else to help out the team with a high cap hit almost impossible. Taking on that toxic contract is not worth the 8th overall pick, even if Zegras or Turcotte drop that far.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

Shatty (50% retention), Names (50% retention), 2 rd 2019, 2 rd 2020
for
Milan Lucic (6m , 4 yrs bad contract), 8OA 2019, 1 rd 2020.

What do you think?

I am obviously against signing long term expensive UFAs until at least summer 2021 or 2022. I prefer gaining youth assets.

Either remove the retention or the picks on the Rangers' side and I do it. Have Edmonton retain on Lucic and I do it. Otherwise, no.

That Lucic contract is a monster; I'm not taking it on at full price for FOUR more years while also blowing up our last two retention slots just to move up a round in two drafts, even if one of them is the #8 in this year's draft.

(Also, it should be noted: it is almost a lock that EDM is one of the teams on Shattenkirk's limited NMC.)

 

[Tawnos]

I would not trade for Lucic for one single reason: he requires protection in the expansion draft.

 

[Brooklyn Rangers Fan]

I would not trade for Lucic for one single reason: he requires protection in the expansion draft.

Oo. Had not considered that.

Yeah, I think that scuttles the deal, even with the #8 on the table.

 

[Rangerfan4life90]

Eh, I honestly don't know. If the #8 pick is on the table, I at least consider it. That pick could be a Zegras or Turcotte.

 

[LORDE]

I would not trade for Lucic for one single reason: he requires protection in the expansion draft.

IF he waves AND we trade for him, we don't have to honor his NTC and then could expose him right?

I think it's a moot point as #8 wouldn't be on the table for him, but I thought that was the deal.

 

[Irishguy42]

IF he waves AND we trade for him, we don't have to honor his NTC and then could expose him right?

I think it's a moot point as #8 wouldn't be on the table for him, but I thought that was the deal.

AFAIK, you have to honor the clauses currently active, even if they are waived. However, you don't have to honor future clauses that haven't activated yet.

Happened with Subban/Nashville, I believe.

 

[Leetch3]

The committments to Shattenkirk and Namestnikov are only two and one more years long, respectively. The Rangers having to take on Lucic's full contract for the next three years makes acquiring just about anyone else to help out the team with a high cap hit almost impossible. Taking on that toxic contract is not worth the 8th overall pick, even if Zegras or Turcotte drop that far.

that was my initial reaction as well...I can't think of a worse idea than taking on lucic's contract...that said though if the 8th overall gets you zegras or turcotte plus a 2020 1st which is guaranteed to be a top 10 cause the oilers are the oilers thats tempting. of course the oilers would never give up that much to dump his contract so doesn't matter

and just to note, lucic's contract is virtually buyout proof. even if you wait a few years there is no point in buying him out

 

[LORDE]

AFAIK, you have to honor the clauses currently active, even if they are waived. However, you don't have to honor future clauses that haven't activated yet.

Happened with Subban/Nashville, I believe.

I could've sworn that the acquiring team can choose to do so, therefor it would be a part of the discussion prior to the trade, but they weren't required to. If not, then there's NO F-ING WAY we use a protection on him or anyone else not a part of the long term plan.

 

[Tawnos]

I could've sworn that the acquiring team can choose to do so, therefor it would be a part of the discussion prior to the trade, but they weren't required to. If not, then there's NO F-ING WAY we use a protection on him or anyone else not a part of the long term plan.

No @Irishguy42 is right. The choice to honor a NTC/NMC is only if that clause isn't already active. Like Jeff Carter. Derek Stepan is another one where the acquiring team had the choice, but Carter is the best example since not only did Columbus choose not to allow the clause to come into effect, but they dealt him during a period of time where it would have been there.

This is the Lucic buyout if they do it right before the expansion draft:

2021-22	$2,500,000	$6,000,000	$583,333	$1,916,667	$4,083,333
2022-23	$1,000,000	$6,000,000	$583,333	$416,667	$5,583,333
2023-24	$0	$0	$583,333	-$583,333	$583,333
2024-25	$0	$0	$583,333	-$583,333	$583,333
TOTAL	$3,500,000	$12,000,000	$2,333,333	$1,166,667	$10,833,333

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

 

[Tawnos]

Honestly, I'd be more on board with Lucic if the expansion draft were next year. But since it's 2021, the Rangers are going to have to protect Chytil and Andersson. That's two very likely important forward slots, so we need to preserve as many as we can.

 

[SA16]

I would not trade for Lucic for one single reason: he requires protection in the expansion draft.

I wouldn't trade for him but I'm not sure it really matters. They can ask him to waive similar to MAF and there would be roughly zero chance he is claimed.

 

[Tawnos]

I wouldn't trade for him but I'm not sure it really matters. They can ask him to waive similar to MAF and there would be roughly zero chance he is claimed.

And if he refuses?

 

[SA16]

And if he refuses?

Make the trade for him contingent on him agreeing to waive for the expansion draft?

 

[DutchShamrock]

From the most recent 31 thoughts, item 1:

I’d heard things went badly last season between him and the organization, and this confirms it. He knows he will be traded because there’s no benefit to staying, but he’s going to make sure it is on his terms if the Penguins want to send him anywhere other than his eight-team list. My guess is Arizona would be high on his choice of destinations, but I don’t see an easy fit. The Penguins want scoring in return and the Coyotes finished 28th in goals-for.

Let's acknowledge that 3 way trades are beyond rare, but playing fantasy for a second...
Kessel to Arizona, Kreider to Pit, we get the Arizona #1. Minor pieces move to balance. But everyone addresses their wants. Pit adds speed and scoring at a lower cap, cap flexibility with only a year left. Arizona gets their scoring upgrade that has 3 years committed. We get in range for our center.

Freidman also said he thinks the Arizona sale gets approved which opens up their purse more.

 

[Tawnos]

Make the trade for him contingent on him agreeing to waive for the expansion draft?

Not sure that'd actually be allowed in any way that'd be enforceable.. But maybe.

 

[Thirty One]

And if he refuses?

Then he's a real dick, because there's no chance he'd be claimed. He is a dick though, so...

 

[Michal]

No @Irishguy42 is right. The choice to honor a NTC/NMC is only if that clause isn't already active. Like Jeff Carter. Derek Stepan is another one where the acquiring team had the choice, but Carter is the best example since not only did Columbus choose not to allow the clause to come into effect, but they dealt him during a period of time where it would have been there.

This is the Lucic buyout if they do it right before the expansion draft:

2021-22	$2,500,000	$6,000,000	$583,333	$1,916,667	$4,083,333
2022-23	$1,000,000	$6,000,000	$583,333	$416,667	$5,583,333
2023-24	$0	$0	$583,333	-$583,333	$583,333
2024-25	$0	$0	$583,333	-$583,333	$583,333
TOTAL	$3,500,000	$12,000,000	$2,333,333	$1,166,667	$10,833,333

[TBODY] [/TBODY]

I would trade for Lucic and buy out just before the expansion draft

 

[Vitto79]

I would trade for Lucic and buy out just before the expansion draft

Just let the Oilers buy him out ... they are the dummies that went 7 years

 

[bobbop]

Any of the 7-8 obviously rebuilding teams in the NHL are not going to trade a first draft pick, even to dump a lousy contract. It's the same strategy that has people here to say lets ride out the Staal and Shattenkirk contracts.

The only way to get more capital in the first round is to find a team doesn't see itself as rebuilding (e.g. Colorado) and teams that should be but may think they are not (e.g. Anaheim)

 

[Michal]

Any of the 7-8 obviously rebuilding teams in the NHL are not going to trade a first draft pick, even to dump a lousy contract. It's the same strategy that has people here to say lets ride out the Staal and Shattenkirk contracts.

The only way to get more capital in the first round is to find a team doesn't see itself as rebuilding (e.g. Colorado) and teams that should be but may think they are not (e.g. Anaheim)

Edmonton has been rebuilding for 10 years. McDavid and Draisatl are not going to wait until 2019 and 2020 picks will be ready. They want to contend now. I think they prefer sign UFAs and do hockey trades than drafting high (they have drafted so many high picks for years. It's enough). I think they don't see themselves as a rebuilding team.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Which teams are "obviously rebuilding"?

NYR
NJD
OTT
DET

Then we have

BUF? Kinda sorta?
MIN? Same thing.
VAN? Rumored to want to take huge steps forward next year.

LA should but I'll believe it when I see it. They may very well feel like last year was an anomaly. Ditto Anaheim who I actually wouldn't be surprise to see back in the playoff picture next year.

A lot of the teams that just missed out will be looking for help, along with a few teams that went a bit deeper in the playoffs than expected. Arizona, Colorado, Minnesota, even Floridaa - These are the teams we should be targeting.