Speculation: Roster Building Thread Part XIV: There ain't no gettin' off of this train we're on

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I just don't see where he fits in long term.
Spooner is under RFA control and may be better on the wing. With the Rangers wing depth in shambles, he will have a spot, especially if a guy like Zuccarello is moved.

The Rangers forward depth is pretty interesting right now.

They can get their A Line back together now. Also they still can have an offense line and a Defense line.

Kreider Zibanejad Buchnevich
Spooner Namestnikov Zuccarello
Vesey Hayes Fast

4th line is still a revolving door but there are worse problems a team can have. It’s not great, but the Rangers are rebuilding. I don’t think it’s necessarily BAD though.

The defense is going to take lumps but they have a ton of depth at those spots now, especially when Rykov comes over.

Gorton handpicked guys like Hajek, Rykov, Lindgren in these trades. You can throw Howden in there too, and he will be likely judged on how those players perform.
 
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Alright it's been a while, but now that the dust is settled, I'll take a crack at a plan:
  • Keep both Spooner and Namestnikov as guys who can be productive, might blossom a la Brassard, and buy time for the kids, so they don't have to play. (Barring crazy Stepan-esque camps, I want all of Chytil, Andersson, Howden, and the new D to go down to the AHL and get called up sometime in-season when their play demands it.)
  • Re-sign Carey to a similar deal – but with the intent of letting him be a AAAA player on a very good HFD team.
  • Let Pavelic, Desharnais, and McLeod walk.
  • Trade Kreider at the draft to Edmonton for Lucic (50% retained), Puljujarvi, and their 1st.
  • Trade Zucc to Dallas at the draft for Spezza (50% retained), their 1st, and a conditional 1st in 2019 (if they make the WCF becomes a 1st, otherwise a 2nd), and a prospect not named Heiskanen.
  • Sign Grabner as an UFA to a reasonable deal. (2 x $2.75MM?)
  • Sign JVR as an UFA to a hometown deal a la Shattenkirk. (4 x $6MM, limited NTC?)
  • Smith works his ass off and comes into camp in decent shape.
JVR-Zibanejad-Buch
Lucic-Spezza-Puljujarvi
Spooner-Hayes-Fast
Vesey-Namestnikov-Grabner

Skjei-Pionk
Staal-Shattenkirk
Smith-DeAngelo

Lundqvist
Georgiev

Hire a new, young-ish coach with good experience with younger players, but also some familiarity with the NHL. Maybe a guy like Eakins on his second shot. Bring in some promising ex-players (MSL?) as assistant coaches. Give Spezza the C, Lucic and Staal the A's.

Play the season out to the TDL. See if Spooner, Namestnikov, and Hayes are young vets you want to be part of the leadership going forward. See if Pionk and DeAngelo can stick. Sell again at the deadline – does a (hopefully) rejuvenated Smith have value? Does a team want Staal with only 2 years left at 50% cap hit? Does a team want a reduced-cost Spezza as a rental? How about whichever of Spooner, Namestnikov, Hayes you decide you don't want to keep? Perhaps make a hockey trade for a guy like Trouba if WPG gets the sense he's going to arbitration with the intent of taking a one-year deal and leaving the next year (presuming their recent play hasn't won him back into the fold).

Bring up a bunch of the kids at the end of the year to replace the guys you moved out. Go into the 2019 FA class as buyers again.
 
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I might be the only guy but I don't see Zucc being traded. MAYBE at next year's deadline, if an extension isn't signed by then.

I don't understand the mindset of some people on this board. A team needs some form of veteran presence.
 
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I'll repost this here. Didn't see a new thread.

One thing I thought about, that may give some perspective, is there really is no trade that would feel satisfactory other than a complete and total rip-off. That’s because we traded away two major contributors to the past 5-7 years of relative success for this franchise and acquired players we know little about, as far as what impact they will have at the NHL level. It stings. As much as this organizations needs a reboot, it stings to know that it’s over, and they didn’t get it done.

That being said, we have some solid contributors still here. Kreider, Zibanejad, Hayes, Fast, Zuccarello, Spooner, Namestnikov, Buchnevich. They’re all above average NHL players. Vesey is an average player. We have pieces up front.

On defense, we have Skjei, Shattenkirk, and Staal. Above average NHL players. Smith should be, but I won’t count him right now because he’s currently being punished. But add him in and you have 4 average to above average NHL players.

In the pipeline, you have:

Andersson
Chytil
Howden
Ronning
Nieves

All who project to possibly contribute at the NHL level, in varying degrees. I won’t include other prospects, but we could also have some late bloomers.

On defense, you have:

Hajek
Pionk
DeAngelo
Lindgren
Rykov
Day (who I still think is a dark horse)
Gilmour

All who can possibly contribute at the NHL level in varying degrees. Add Sproul in there too.

Let’s say, hypothetically, the Rangers decide Zuccarello is the captain and sign him 3x5. Spooner and Namestnikov are signed to 4 year deals between 3-4 million. Skjei 5x4.5. Hayes 4x4.5. We have cap space. We also have a plethora of assets at reasonable rates to move in the next 1-3 years, if a guy like Andersson or Howden or Chytil proves they are ready for prime time. That will create more cap space.

It’s obvious the Rangers are trying to acquire talented Russian players in an attempt to lure KHL Free Agents and prospects to the NHL. It’s a savvy decision. It’s New York City and plenty of your brethren are here. Come join them. As much as I like Miller, and he was one of my favorite players, Namestnikov is very, very talented. He brings a different kind of game. He has ties to NA and Russia. We acquired Rykov. We have Buchnevich and Georgiev already and Shesty in SKA.

Kovalchuk wants to play here. See if he’ll sign a 2 year contract. What if we get the #2 pick and draft Svechnikov?

Kovalchuk-Namestnikov-Svechnikov
Kreider-Zibanejad-Buchnevich
Spooner-Hayes-Zuccarello
Vesey-Nieves-Fast

Chytil, Andersson, and Howden start in Hartford. Maybe we trade Zibanejad for more futures and let one of those prospects center the 3rd line. More cap space.

The following year, Rykov and Shestyorkin come over.

On defense, possibly:

Skjei-Shattenkirk
Staal-DeAngelo
Smith-Pionk

Potential disaster there. But maybe we buy out Smith and play Gilmour, or sign a UFA. Hank and Georgiev/Mazanec. That’s a really solid lineup. Maybe we luck into Dahlin and don’t get Svechnikov. We’d be fine up front.

And Hajek/Rykov playing in Hartford soon. Available in case of injuries. The more I look at this team going forward, I can see hope. Some things need to break right. But one thing is for sure. That group didn’t get it done. I enjoyed the run. But they didn’t get it done. I’d hate to see them get it done elsewhere. But we had to cut the cord. This is a first class organization with a plan. Developing an identity. I’m ready to embrace this rebuild and trust Gorton.

But he must fire AV.
 
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I might be the only guy but I don't see Zucc being traded. MAYBE at next year's deadline, if an extension isn't signed by then.

I don't understand the mindset of some people on this board. A team needs some form of veteran presence.

The only other returning alternate captain is Zuccarello, who most definitely was on the trade block and is only still a Ranger because the return for him, from interested teams, wasn’t good enough before the deadline.

Zuccarello and others will go back on the trade market at the draft, and/or throughout the summer. Maybe some of the restricted free agents’ rights will be dealt, too.

What will the Rangers roster look like in October?
 
I'll repost this here. Didn't see a new thread.

One thing I thought about, that may give some perspective, is there really is no trade that would feel satisfactory other than a complete and total rip-off. That’s because we traded away two major contributors to the past 5-7 years of relative success for this franchise and acquired players we know little about, as far as what impact they will have at the NHL level. It stings. As much as this organizations needs a reboot, it stings to know that it’s over, and they didn’t get it done.

That being said, we have some solid contributors still here. Kreider, Zibanejad, Hayes, Fast, Zuccarello, Spooner, Namestnikov, Buchnevich. They’re all above average NHL players. Vesey is an average player. We have pieces up front.

On defense, we have Skjei, Shattenkirk, and Staal. Above average NHL players. Smith should be, but I won’t count him right now because he’s currently being punished. But add him in and you have 4 average to above average NHL players.

In the pipeline, you have:

Andersson
Chytil
Howden
Ronning
Nieves

All who project to possibly contribute at the NHL level, in varying degrees. I won’t include other prospects, but we could also have some late bloomers.

On defense, you have:

Hajek
Pionk
DeAngelo
Lindgren
Rykov
Day (who I still think is a dark horse)
Gilmour

All who can possibly contribute at the NHL level in varying degrees. Add Sproul in there too.

Let’s say, hypothetically, the Rangers decide Zuccarello is the captain and sign him 3x5. Spooner and Namestnikov are signed to 4 year deals between 3-4 million. Skjei 5x4.5. Hayes 4x4.5. We have cap space. We also have a plethora of assets at reasonable rates to move in the next 1-3 years, if a guy like Andersson or Howden or Chytil proves they are ready for prime time. That will create more cap space.

It’s obvious the Rangers are trying to acquire talented Russian players in an attempt to lure KHL Free Agents and prospects to the NHL. It’s a savvy decision. It’s New York City and plenty of your brethren are here. Come join them. As much as I like Miller, and he was one of my favorite players, Namestnikov is very, very talented. He brings a different kind of game. He has ties to NA and Russia. We acquired Rykov. We have Buchnevich and Georgiev already and Shesty in SKA.

Kovalchuk wants to play here. See if he’ll sign a 2 year contract. What if we get the #2 pick and draft Svechnikov?

Kovalchuk-Namestnikov-Svechnikov
Kreider-Zibanejad-Buchnevich
Spooner-Hayes-Zuccarello
Vesey-Nieves-Fast

Chytil, Andersson, and Howden start in Hartford. Maybe we trade Zibanejad for more futures and let one of those prospects center the 3rd line. More cap space.

The following year, Rykov and Shestyorkin come over.

On defense, possibly:

Skjei-Shattenkirk
Staal-DeAngelo
Smith-Pionk

Potential disaster there. But maybe we buy out Smith and play Gilmour, or sign a UFA. Hank and Georgiev/Mazanec. That’s a really solid lineup. Maybe we luck into Dahlin and don’t get Svechnikov. We’d be fine up front.

And Hajek/Rykov playing in Hartford soon. Available in case of injuries. The more I look at this team going forward, I can see hope. Some things need to break right. But one thing is for sure. That group didn’t get it done. I enjoyed the run. But they didn’t get it done. I’d hate to see them get it done elsewhere. But we had to cut the cord. This is a first class organization with a plan. Developing an identity. I’m ready to embrace this rebuild and trust Gorton.

But he must fire AV.
No reason to buy out anyone unless we have plans for the cap room.
 
It's a good point re: the RFAs. Even looking at my plan above, you've got one more 25/26-y-o RFA center/LW than you really need. That spot I've got going to Namestnikov on the fourth line could easily go to a Nieves/Lettieri on an ELC, or a vet UFA on a minimum deal. So the question becomes: which 2 of the 3 between Hayes, Spooner, and Namestnikov do you decide to keep?
 
They’ll wade redden his ass before they buy him out. He should start looking for a residence in Hartford.

I don't think so. You don't want disgruntled vets around kids you're trying to develop. You can also get some cap savings buying him out. I get that some people are mad at him and want to see him punished in some way. There's no real point to that though--it hampers your going forward. In any case I'm sure if Brendan could do it over again he would come to camp in much better shape. There's no point hating on the guy. Turning the corner though is another thing. I think they've turned it with him. He's going to be gone.
 
It's a good point re: the RFAs. Even looking at my plan above, you've got one more 25/26-y-o RFA center/LW than you really need. That spot I've got going to Namestnikov on the fourth line could easily go to a Nieves/Lettieri on an ELC, or a vet UFA on a minimum deal. So the question becomes: which 2 of the 3 between Hayes, Spooner, and Namestnikov do you decide to keep?

My gut says it comes down to Spooner or Namestnikov. But, it also matters how Gorton approaches the value of each player. Does he look to deal the player with the most trade value? Is the consideration what each player is going to cost contract-wise? Do they keep the player that fits the best?
 
Spooner will be the one to go IMO. He's going to make a decent amount of coin after arbitration (if it goes that far.) Talented and quick, but he's pretty one dimensional.

I think they like Hayes' progression this year (or at least they should.) I can't imagine that they flipped JT for Namestinkov with out the intention of keeping him. He should come in at right under 4 mill on his next deal.
 
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Not that I'm suggesting we re-sign Nick Holden as a UFA over the summer but using him as an example when I say we will sign some vets---we already know that 'if' (operative word) we re-signed Nick that there's real potential that he'll get us another 3rd round pick at next year's deadline. In the meantime he will most nights play passable--sometimes maybe even pretty decent defense that will allow us to ease a young defenseman into our lineup and expand the situations we can put that younger D in as the season progresses. That is a tried and true way to help develop young players. Our defense group as is now is tantamount to throwing a bunch of young kids to the wolves. They're in what amounts to an impossible situation. That's not something that would be smart to do for any kind of elongated period of time. Just saying.
 
I don't think so. You don't want disgruntled vets around kids you're trying to develop. You can also get some cap savings buying him out. I get that some people are mad at him and want to see him punished in some way. There's no real point to that though--it hampers your going forward. In any case I'm sure if Brendan could do it over again he would come to camp in much better shape. There's no point hating on the guy. Turning the corner though is another thing. I think they've turned it with him. He's going to be gone.
It’s not about punishing him it’s about not rewarding him further at our own expense. We don’t need the cap room as far as I can tell, so no reason to carry a hit on him for any longer than we have to. He does have it all over to do again, every day and he continues to disappoint in Hartford. He’s a bum.
 
Should the Rangers take on a bunch of bad contracts expiring in the next two years in enhange for picks and prospects?
 
It’s not about punishing him it’s about not rewarding him further at our own expense. We don’t need the cap room as far as I can tell, so no reason to carry a hit on him for any longer than we have to. He does have it all over to do again, every day and he continues to disappoint in Hartford. He’s a bum.

Well I wouldn't want to turn him into a negative influence though either. Redden apparently was willing to be a positive influence at least to some degree. That doesn't mean Smith will.
 
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Not that I'm suggesting we re-sign Nick Holden as a UFA over the summer but using him as an example when I say we will sign some vets---we already know that 'if' (operative word) we re-signed Nick that there's real potential that he'll get us another 3rd round pick at next year's deadline. In the meantime he will most nights play passable--sometimes maybe even pretty decent defense that will allow us to ease a young defenseman into our lineup and expand the situations we can put that younger D in as the season progresses. That is a tried and true way to help develop young players. Our defense group as is now is tantamount to throwing a bunch of young kids to the wolves. They're in what amounts to an impossible situation. That's not something that would be smart to do for any kind of elongated period of time. Just saying.

They should 100% sign some stop gap UFA vets to 1 year deals in order to insulate the kids.

Hamhuis gets my vote for the D.
 
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