Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Part XIII (Nanaki edition)

[IDvsEGO]

I feel like people are still attached to this mythical idea of a rebuild where we blow up all 23 players and then next 23 players were all drafted by the Rangers around the same time.

Players who you can actually build around.
Laf
Kakko
Cuylle
Fox
Schneider
Miller - controversial but I’m fine not moving him
Trocheck - he’s gonna be a 3c but he’s not overpaid for that role so it’s fine.
Berard
Perreault


Chytil needs some health for years before you think of him as a core piece, even tho talent wise he is up there.


That’s means the team needs 2 centers
No top 6 wings
1 LH defenseman (top pair if possible)
1 starting goalie


The 2 centers are the far hardest part to acquire here.

In assets to move
You have
Trouba
Lindgren
Mika
Ck
Shesty

 

[Machinehead]

Players who you can actually build around.
Laf
Kakko
Cuylle
Fox
Schneider
Miller - controversial but I’m fine not moving him
Trocheck - he’s gonna be a 3c but he’s not overpaid for that role so it’s fine.
Berard
Perreault


Chytil needs some health for years before you think of him as a core piece, even tho talent wise he is up there.


That’s means the team needs 2 centers
No top 6 wings
1 LH defenseman (top pair if possible)
1 starting goalie


The 2 centers are the far hardest part to acquire here.

In assets to move
You have
Trouba
Lindgren
Mika
Ck
Shesty

It's actually crazy the extent to which this team has avoided centers at the draft.

It's the old line "you need to pick super high unless you get insanely lucky."

You have to f***ing pick one to get lucky.

 

[IDvsEGO]

It's actually crazy the extent to which this team has avoided centers at the draft.

It's the old line "you need to pick super high unless you get insanely lucky."

You have to f***ing pick one to get lucky.

I mean we’ve drafted a few, but they’re long term projects at best.
Drury has mostly gone BPA, while paying attention to positional needs.
He hasn’t really reached too much and I wouldn’t have wanted him to, because up until last year we thought we had a 1c and a 2c who was coming close to a 1c.

 

[McRanger92]

Kreider and Trouba are the movable core players. If people consider trading them and chaff like Lindgren/Smith as a "rebuild" they can call it what they want. I don't see guys like Miller and Kakko moving. Not Drury's MO. Trocheck fits the direction the Rangers are trying to go and has chemistry with our best players. He's more likely to be an interim captain than dealt.

Between Kreider/Trouba, the trade to make is Kreider. You can get value back and capitalize on a declining asset. We have young wingers all over the lineup that need his ice time. Trouba can at least be relegated to the 3rd pair, and provides more of a physical intimidation element that absolutely matters. Plus the team sees him as a leader. Easier trade to make with 1 year left in the offseason. We all know there is a MIka element to this as well. He won't agree to leave if Kreider sticks around. The trade is coming down the tracks, it's only a matter of when.

 

[NYR Viper]

Kreider and Trouba are the movable core players. If people consider trading them and chaff like Lindgren/Smith as a "rebuild" they can call it what they want. I don't see guys like Miller and Kakko moving. Not Drury's MO. Trocheck fits the direction the Rangers are trying to go and has chemistry with our best players. He's more likely to be an interim captain than dealt.

Between Kreider/Trouba, the trade to make is Kreider. You can get value back and capitalize on a declining asset. We have young wingers all over the lineup that need his ice time. Trouba can at least be relegated to the 3rd pair, and provides more of a physical intimidation element that absolutely matters. Plus the team sees him as a leader. Easier trade to make with 1 year left in the offseason. We all know there is a MIka element to this as well. He won't agree to leave if Kreider sticks around. The trade is coming down the tracks, it's only a matter of when.

The guys to trade, sooner rather than later, are Lindgren, Smith and Kreider. Get those moves done, open up spots for young players and recoup some assets. Retain on Lindgren and Smith as needed as their contracts are up at the end of this season.

I think if Drury can at least start moving in that direction than I think things relax around the team.

 

[McRanger92]

The guys to trade, sooner rather than later, are Lindgren, Smith and Kreider. Get those moves done, open up spots for young players and recoup some assets. Retain on Lindgren and Smith as needed as their contracts are up at the end of this season.

I think if Drury can at least start moving in that direction than I think things relax around the team.

100%. Reality has come like a brick to the head. There's still a very good team in that locker room but they need to pull the trigger. Kreider to Montreal? They have young assets and I think Mike Matheson is a perfect partner for Fox. Kreider can reunite with Gorton and MSL. Provide leadership.

 

[Machinehead]

I mean we’ve drafted a few, but they’re long term projects at best.
Drury has mostly gone BPA, while paying attention to positional needs.
He hasn’t really reached too much and I wouldn’t have wanted him to, because up until last year we thought we had a 1c and a 2c who was coming close to a 1c.

We've never actually had that when the games get big. That's the problem.

The last guys they drafted with any hope whatsoever of playing top six center in the NHL were Chytil and Andersson. Before that, it was JT Miller.

I understand going for BPA but at some point, you also have to pay attention to positions at least a little bit.

Barring the off-chance that BMB pans out, the Rangers literally don't have a prospect that's going to play center in the NHL in their system. That's inexscusable.

 

[McRanger92]

We've never actually had that when the games get big. That's the problem.

The last guys they drafted with any hope whatsoever of playing top six center in the NHL were Chytil and Andersson. Before that, it was JT Miller.

I understand going for BPA but at some point, you also have to pay attention to positions at least a little bit.

Barring the off-chance that BMB pans out, the Rangers literally don't have a prospect that's going to play center in the NHL in their system. That's inexscusable.

Newhook and Matheson for Kreider, who says no?

 

[Machinehead]

Newhook and Matheson for Kreider, who says no?

I would just slide Edstrom over if you're looking for a 4C.

 

[rangers1314]

Newhook and Matheson for Kreider, who says no?

The Rangers do.

 

[UnparalledPark]

Players who you can actually build around.
Laf
Kakko
Cuylle
Fox
Schneider
Miller - controversial but I’m fine not moving him
Trocheck - he’s gonna be a 3c but he’s not overpaid for that role so it’s fine.
Berard
Perreault


Chytil needs some health for years before you think of him as a core piece, even tho talent wise he is up there.


That’s means the team needs 2 centers
No top 6 wings
1 LH defenseman (top pair if possible)
1 starting goalie


The 2 centers are the far hardest part to acquire here.

In assets to move
You have
Trouba
Lindgren
Mika
Ck
Shesty

I don’t consider Kakko and Berard core pieces, but hopefully I’m wrong. I think Shesty will be.

What happened to the Kakko at center experiment? I thought he looked pretty good there.

 

[NYR Viper]

I like Matheson as a player but he has 1 year left after this one and is 30 years old. If they are trading Kreider, get young pieces back. Open up cap space to make a move when it presents itself.

What type of contract do we think a 32 year old Matheson is going to command if he continues playing big minutes? 6-7 year deal @ $6-7m per season. Are the Rangers in a spot to make that type of investment?

 

[McRanger92]

I would just slide Edstrom over if you're looking for a 4C.

Than what about Dach? Young centers take longer to develop, that's why we have none because we are prone to giving up early. The team needs young center depth and a top 4 defenseman. They dont need to "rebuild". Columbus is another team. Would they trade Sillinger or Chinakhov for Kreider? Provorov? These are scenarios that look very enticing.

Regardless of what we do with Igor contract-wise, he's here for this season. he isnt getting traded for anything close to his real value. They can't put their hands up and just say "we suck, oh well".

The Rangers do.

We are a better team for the majority of Kreider's remaining contract if we make a trade like that. Fill 2 team needs and get more ice time for our young stud players. It's a no brainer.

I like Matheson as a player but he has 1 year left after this one and is 30 years old. If they are trading Kreider, get young pieces back. Open up cap space to make a move when it presents itself.

What type of contract do we think a 32 year old Matheson is going to command if he continues playing big minutes? 6-7 year deal @ $6-7m per season. Are the Rangers in a spot to make that type of investment?

Short term flexibility. Maybe Montreal retains? By the time his contract is up Mancini has experience and Fortescue is close. Emery too. Doesnt have to be Matheson but a mobile guy with a bit of size and isnt soft is perfect for Fox. Matheson is fresh in my mind because he always plays well against us.

 

[NickyFotiu]

Kinda funny Drury has to deal with a difficult captain after he himself refused to retire despite a career ending injury and forced the Rangers to buy him out. Homegrown captain next please and thank you

I'm not sure I get this take. Isn't one of the main reasons NHL contracts are guaranteed to protect in case of injury? If Chytil has to retire would you want us not to pay him?

 

[Machinehead]

Than what about Dach? Young centers take longer to develop, that's why we have none because we are prone to giving up early. The team needs young center depth and a top 4 defenseman. They dont need to "rebuild". Columbus is another team. Would they trade Sillinger or Chinakhov for Kreider? Provorov? These are scenarios that look very enticing.

Regardless of what we do with Igor contract-wise, he's here for this season. he isnt getting traded for anything close to his real value. They can't put their hands up and just say "we suck, oh well".

There's no quick fix for the center situation.

It's probably just gonna be Zibanejad for awhile because *gestures glumly at the contract*.

If you can get rid of him, you have Trocheck and Chytil, and you can sign somebody with the savings. You hope Chytil stays healthy and that's what you go with. They have to be happy with it, because they have already f***ed this up, past tense.

Long-term, they just have to stop treating centers like polio at the draft.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

We've never actually had that when the games get big. That's the problem.

The last guys they drafted with any hope whatsoever of playing top six center in the NHL were Chytil and Andersson. Before that, it was JT Miller.

I understand going for BPA but at some point, you also have to pay attention to positions at least a little bit.

Barring the off-chance that BMB pans out, the Rangers literally don't have a prospect that's going to play center in the NHL in their system. That's inexscusable.

Laba.

Being strong at center is overrated though.

 

[McRanger92]

There's no quick fix for the center situation.

It's probably just gonna be Zibanejad for awhile because *gestures glumly at the contract*.

If you can get rid of him, you have Trocheck and Chytil, and you can sign somebody with the savings. You hope Chytil stays healthy and that's what you go with. They have to be happy with it, because they have already f***ed this up, past tense.

Long-term, they just have to stop treating centers like polio at the draft.

There's no doubt about the poor drafting strategy, and they'll have to deal with Zibanejad and his replacement (if any) in the summer. It pains me to say but how much better does this team look if they just kept around Brett Howden. I know they analytics have always sucked but he's and energy player who likes to stay around the net. It's why he's got 10 goals and a smart team just extended him 5 years for a million less than we gave Goodrow to play the same role.

 

[Machinehead]

Laba.

Being strong at center is overrated though.

You have to go back to, what, 2007 the last time a team won the Cup with their best center being on par with Trocheck?

 

[rangers1314]

On this mornings 32T EF makes it sound like NYR are trying to quiet things down. So don’t expect any moves

 

[Machinehead]

There's no doubt about the poor drafting strategy, and they'll have to deal with Zibanejad and his replacement (if any) in the summer. It pains me to say but how much better does this team look if they just kept around Brett Howden. I know they analytics have always sucked but he's and energy player who likes to stay around the net. It's why he's got 10 goals and a smart team just extended him 5 years for a million less than we gave Goodrow to play the same role.

I mean...

The problem with this team is that some of their most relied-upon players have charts like this.

 

[McRanger92]

I mean...

View attachment 938778


The problem with this team is that some of their most relied-upon players have charts like this.

Because they like to remain on the halfwalls and not get hit. If you added a few more guys who dont mind playing a more "go to the net" style, the team would look much better 5v5. And maybe a defenseman who can move the puck without falling down. These should not be unreasonable asks. Players who fit these needs are moved constantly.

 

[Machinehead]

Because they like to remain on the halfwalls and not get hit. If you added a few more guys who dont mind playing a more "go to the net" style, the team would look much better 5v5. And maybe a defenseman who can move the puck without falling down. These should not be unreasonable asks. Players who fit these needs are moved constantly.

I don't disagree but you're attempting to use Brett Howden and "look much better 5v5" in the same context.

The thing about this Vegas core is that they're...not that good? Sorry.

They currently sit 24th in xGF%. Their best xGF% finish in the last four years is 10th. That's the year they won the Cup because they faced .870 goaltending in the final two rounds. Must be nice. Just goes to show you that anything can happen if you do anything remotely close to just staying competitive with the other team.

There are better models. Florida plays a "dirty areas" type of style and they haven't had a bad player on their roster since the f***ing 90's, ignoring Marc Staal, and they won the Cup as soon as they didn't have Marc Staal anymore.

Edmonton also plays great hockey but they have a guy with analytics north of 60% playing 22 minutes, so that's not very repeatable. Colorado and New Jersey are attractive rosters but they won the lottery 16 times each. So did Edmonton.

Just be Florida. Have zero bad players, target a bunch of analytics darlings before they break out, don't be afraid to make a change, and when something falls into your lap (Forsling) don't get rid of it like we did with Stralman.

I'm not saying it's that easy, but at least not having bad players that you knew were bad, honestly is that easy.

 

[The Crypto Guy]

If you are trading Kreider, you are looking for a decent young player in return. Think Brassard/Mika trade. Newhook is teetering in bust territory and I have zero interest.

It's not like Kreider is a rental either.

 

[MrAlmost]

On this mornings 32T EF makes it sound like NYR are trying to quiet things down. So don’t expect any moves

Ugh. f***ing clown show org.

 

[McRanger92]

I don't disagree but you're attempting to use Brett Howden and "look much better 5v5" in the same context.

The thing about this Vegas core is that they're...not that good? Sorry.

They currently sit 24th in xGF%. Their best xGF% finish in the last four years is 10th. That's the year they won the Cup because they faced .870 goaltending in the final two rounds. Must be nice. Just goes to show you that anything can happen if you do anything remotely close to just staying competitive with the other team.

There are better models. Florida plays a "dirty areas" type of style and they haven't had a bad player on their roster since the f***ing 90's, ignoring Marc Staal, and they won the Cup as soon as they didn't have Marc Staal anymore.

Edmonton also plays great hockey but they have a guy with analytics north of 60% playing 22 minutes, so that's not very repeatable. Colorado and New Jersey are attractive rosters but they won the lottery 16 times each. So did Edmonton.

Just be Florida. Have zero bad players, target a bunch of analytics darlings before they break out, don't be afraid to make a change, and when something falls into your lap (Forsling) don't get rid of it like we did with Stralman.

I'm not saying it's that easy, but at least not having bad players that you knew were bad, honestly is that easy.

I dont really care about other teams. There's no magic formula to replicate. I care about how this specific team gets to the next level. The Rangers are soft. Their players play soft because they dont have guys who want to play that game. Mika and Kreider are the chief culprits of relying on the refs and the power play to fight their battles. They dont give any real effort anymore 5v5 due to age related decline or otherwise. And they get away with it because they've never played in front of a bad goalie their entire Ranger careers. Find me a defenseman you would trade Kreider for.