Roster Building thread - Part X - (TDL edition)

[Black Tank]

Would love to be the reasonnthe Islanders don't make the playoffs.

We've already brutally crushed the devils PO fantasy so let's finish the islanders as well. f*** it, let's f*** over the floundering flyers as well and make it a trifecta.

 

[egelband]

I hope Trouba’s issues are some kind of lingering injury because if he is really this slow now, it’s a problem. I think he’ll be back next year anyhow, and hopefully he regains some quickness. Also would like to see him paired with Jones and let Jones carry the puck. Trouba would benefit from simplifying his game, in my humble opinion.

 

[McRanger92]

I hope Trouba’s issues are some kind of lingering injury because if he is really this slow now, it’s a problem. I think he’ll be back next year anyhow, and hopefully he regains some quickness. Also would like to see him paired with Jones and let Jones carry the puck. Trouba would benefit from simplifying his game, in my humble opinion.

The only way Trouba leaves this team in the summer is if they have another embarrassing flameout. The Rangers arent going to have significant cap issues that would force a trade of that magnitude.

 

[NYR Viper]

The only way Trouba leaves this team in the summer is if they have another embarrassing flameout. The Rangers arent going to have significant cap issues that would force a trade of that magnitude.

No, but creating $8m in cap space would allow for them to add where it's needed.

 

[bernmeister]

I hope Trouba’s issues are some kind of lingering injury because if he is really this slow now, it’s a problem. I think he’ll be back next year anyhow, and hopefully he regains some quickness. Also would like to see him paired with Jones and let Jones carry the puck. Trouba would benefit from simplifying his game, in my humble opinion.

If he is really slow = lost too many steps, then yr options are:
deal for as much cap relief as possible to a team that will take bad skating b'c need for clear the crease physical guy righty RD is immediately greater;
or
try to reposition him here as we attempt to phase out/possibly buy out later, but not soon, too much lack of cap recovery

If we go w/repostion, then we are looking at F, and obv that should be his natural W, i.e., rw, and not pivot, where C has more skating + other demands

While not set in stone, at this pt, I see DET
Rs retain 1.5
Trouba + 3 3rds
for
Gettinger + 3 2nds

something like dat

Also want to flip Jones + Lindgren, sell high. Get ahead of the curve.

The only way Trouba leaves this team in the summer is if they have another embarrassing flameout. The Rangers arent going to have significant cap issues that would force a trade of that magnitude.

Disagree
Cap hits by bread, Zib + Troub are each structural limitations; you can't treat same as smaller pieces of cap adding to same #, but mo flexibility how you juggle/handle

Yeah, we + whole league will get SOME cap relief, but we should be nimble about trimming Troub's hit + looking to manage space mo carefully going forward

 

[bhamill]

Well considering reporting statistics is voluntary, and ya can't rank in what ya don't report...

Fun fact, look it up.

Which is the case in every city.

 

[bhamill]

I wonder why there was less crime outside in 2020. Hmmm...

Someone else said it too, but you obviously didn't walk around in the 70's, 80's, heck, even 90's.

It's "prophet," and status quo means neither better nor worse, so that's sort of tautological at face value. LOL

Nicky Fotiu used to ride the subway with an axe in his hockey bag. Hahaha.
I started riding the subways in the mid 70’s. I spit out my coffee when I hear people talking about how it’s so much worse now than the good old days. Hahaha. Parts of NYC were like Beirut in the 70’s and 80’s. Yeah crime and such are cyclical and on the rise EVERYWHERE, but NYC is Disneyland now in comparison. There’s more than 8 million people, and more than a billion subway rides a year. Open 24 hours a day. With like 5 murders last year. That’s AMAZINGLY low.

 

[bhamill]

They had enough room.


There was less crime in past years because nowadays so many people are not charged.

If a crime is reported then it is in the statistics. Whether anyone is ever charged or a suspect is ever even identified is irrelevant.

 

[SA16]

No, but creating $8m in cap space would allow for them to add where it's needed.

Would you sign him for 2 years $16M if he was a FA this off season? If the answer is no, then why is anyone trading for him without sending a bad contract back? He has a NTC so it's not like a team can trade for him if he wasn't interested in signing there as a FA.

 

[bhamill]

The cars and traffic are horrendous…
The added bike lanes have seen to make drivers more aggressive

Traffic here IS a crime. Hahaha. That’s one thing that gets steadily worse unless there’s a pandemic. Despite people saying there’s a “mass exodus,” the city population continues to rise, along with property values, and the number of people it employs from outside the city continues to rise as well. And the traffic goes up with it.

Would you sign him for 2 years $16M if he was a FA this off season? If the answer is no, then why is anyone trading for him without sending a bad contract back?

Because not every team has a cap issue or the same roster as we do. He could have way more value for a team that is desperate for a physical presence on the blue line.

 

[NYR Viper]

Would you sign him for 2 years $16M if he was a FA this off season? If the answer is no, then why is anyone trading for him without sending a bad contract back?

This isn't a very good question honestly. There are teams out there who would gladly sign Trouba for (2) years @ $8m (by the way he makes $6m per season in real $$). Not every team can sign UFA's like the Rangers can normally attract.

But lets assume there is no team in the NHL that would take him, which I believe to be untrue, what if the Rangers retained $2m, or took back a depth player on an okay contract to help off-set some of those dollars?

Let's just use a few examples of what I mean:

To BUF:
Trouba

To NYR:
Greenway + picks


To DET:
Trouba

To NYR:
Maata + Picks


To NSH:
Trouba

To NYR:
Glass or Lauzon + picks



There are options and honestly, I doubt any of those (3) teams above are on his list. MAYBE Buffalo but possibly not. Buffalo isn't far from home (Michigan) for him.

 

[SA16]

This isn't a very good question honestly. There are teams out there who would gladly sign Trouba for (2) years @ $8m (by the way he makes $6m per season in real $$). Not every team can sign UFA's like the Rangers can normally attract.

But lets assume there is no team in the NHL that would take him, which I believe to be untrue, what if the Rangers retained $2m, or took back a depth player on an okay contract to help off-set some of those dollars?

Let's just use a few examples of what I mean:

To BUF:
Trouba

To NYR:
Greenway + picks


To DET:
Trouba

To NYR:
Maata + Picks


To NSH:
Trouba

To NYR:
Glass or Lauzon + picks



There are options and honestly, I doubt any of those (3) teams above are on his list. MAYBE Buffalo but possibly not. Buffalo isn't far from home (Michigan) for him.

I guess I’m failing to see how things line up. This board is insistent Trouba is a bad defenseman. Not that he’s not worth his money. That he should be third pair or a healthy scratch. Yet at the same time someone is going to trade him, fake the full cap hit, and open up 8M space to be used elsewhere? Yea the real money is less that’s a minor factor. If the rangers retained 2M and then took someone like Greenway now they only have 3M to spend on his replacement which will be somehow who likely isn’t any good.

 

[TGWL]

Would you sign him for 2 years $16M if he was a FA this off season? If the answer is no, then why is anyone trading for him without sending a bad contract back? He has a NTC so it's not like a team can trade for him if he wasn't interested in signing there as a FA.

I think if he were a free agent, a team easily gives him a 7x2 contract. So we're talking about a million here. But obviously it's not that simple as it requires a team on his list.

 

[bernmeister]

Nicky Fotiu used to ride the subway with an axe in his hockey bag. Hahaha.
I started riding the subways in the mid 70’s. I spit out my coffee when I hear people talking about how it’s so much worse now than the good old days. Hahaha. Parts of NYC were like Beirut in the 70’s and 80’s. Yeah crime and such are cyclical and on the rise EVERYWHERE, but NYC is Disneyland now in comparison. There’s more than 8 million people, and more than a billion subway rides a year. Open 24 hours a day. With like 5 murders last year. That’s AMAZINGLY low.

There is a general tendency to wax poetic about "the good old days", everywhere.
In the 70s etc peeps complained about stuff.
If you go far back enuf, great depression
Complain about rampant drug use?
Remember the opium dens of early 1900s.

All laws are subservient to the conditions that create and maintain them -- bern.
Life = socio-politico-economic equation, what happens in 1 usually impacts other 2 -- bern

We can every improve tho
-- bern academic work
and as and for a motto:
will you try to change things/with the power that you have/the power of a million new ideas?
-- Robert Lamm, Chicago

 

[NYR Viper]

I guess I’m failing to see how things line up. This board is insistent Trouba is a bad defenseman. Not that he’s not worth his money. That he should be third pair or a healthy scratch. Yet at the same time someone is going to trade him, fake the full cap hit, and open up 8M space to be used elsewhere? Yea the real money is less that’s a minor factor. If the rangers retained 2M and then took someone like Greenway now they only have 3M to spend on his replacement which will be somehow who likely isn’t any good.

You know how this board works. Trouba is probably an average middle-pairing d-man with above average physicality and leadership. I am doubtful the team would need to retain and take back someone like Greenway. It would be one or the other

 

[bernmeister]

... Because not every team has a cap issue or the same roster as we do. He could have way more value for a team that is desperate for a physical presence on the blue line.

this^

 

[SA16]

You know how this board works. Trouba is probably an average middle-pairing d-man with above average physicality and leadership. I am doubtful the team would need to retain and take back someone like Greenway. It would be one or the other

The Rangers obviously wouldn't do it but do you think someone would claim him if he was waived? Keep in mind there are limited teams that would even have $8M in cap space available to add a player. I guess Chicago might since they like overpaying players for leadership at this point.

 

[bernmeister]

I guess I’m failing to see how things line up. This board is insistent Trouba is a bad defenseman. Not that he’s not worth his money. That he should be third pair or a healthy scratch. Yet at the same time someone is going to trade him, fake the full cap hit, and open up 8M space to be used elsewhere? Yea the real money is less that’s a minor factor. If the rangers retained 2M and then took someone like Greenway now they only have 3M to spend on his replacement which will be somehow who likely isn’t any good.

fair pts but don't forget:
1. no one has to take the FULL cap hit. 6.5 is enuf
2. If you add a Greenway, you get the benefit of having greenway, whether he is kept and allows someone else to be dealt or he is directly flipped. Either way, we recover cap if that is the priority.

 

[NYR Viper]

The Rangers obviously wouldn't do it but do you think someone would claim him if he was waived? Keep in mind there are limited teams that would even have $8M in cap space available to add a player. I guess Chicago might since they like overpaying players for leadership at this point.

I do think there would be teams who would claim him if he was waived. Especially in the off-season when teams have more flexibility.

Lets just look at Nashville:

They have Josi, McDonagh, Schenn, Fabbro and Lauzon signed for next year. Stastney is a RFA. Trouba's contract runs out at the same time as McDonagh's. They are rebuilding while still contending, as evidenced by this years run. They have a boatload of cap space (~$19m) and a need on defense.

With 2 years left, what's the worst case scenario here for a team like Nashville? Trade for the player and keep him for a single season. If he doesn't rebound there will still be a market for him as a trade for a veteran d-man with money retained where they can recoup their assets pretty easily. The only concern is real dollars for the owner and even that won't be that bad.

Best case scenario is he rebounds a bit and continues to play as a good top-4 physical d-man who needs a new contract at 32 years old in a couple of years. With the age of that team and the way they are rebuilding, having Josi and Trouba on the back-end as veteran leaders won't be a bad thing, especially considering I am sure Troub'a next contract will be more reasonable.

 

[DanielBrassard]

I guess I’m failing to see how things line up. This board is insistent Trouba is a bad defenseman. Not that he’s not worth his money. That he should be third pair or a healthy scratch. Yet at the same time someone is going to trade him, fake the full cap hit, and open up 8M space to be used elsewhere? Yea the real money is less that’s a minor factor. If the rangers retained 2M and then took someone like Greenway now they only have 3M to spend on his replacement which will be somehow who likely isn’t any good.

Just because people like us think Trouba is bad or not worth his cap hit doesn’t mean GMs around the league feel the same way.

 

[noncents]

can i ignore users? the smarm with which this guy regards his own ideas is bothersome. yeah sure we're gonna "reposition" trouba into a RW.

oh no i'm disagreeing i must be saying water isn't wet!!

 

[SA16]

Just because people like us think Trouba is bad or not worth his cap hit doesn’t mean GMs around the league feel the same way.

I think he's average and not worth his cap hit. I also think he's the best option on the team in that role right now. People like Schneider there because he's young, home grown, a former first round pick, on a cheap contract, and physical. From everything I've seen Schneider is not remotely ready to step into a bigger role and his results when doing so were much worse than Trouba's. For this year, that's what it is. People always overvalue these young guys and especially the ones that look good in extremely sheltered roles.

In a future year if they can get rid of his cap hit without taking things back that would be great but I highly doubt that is going to be possible. Retaining on him, adding a bad contract, and then signing someone to replace him isn't going to get you someone any better since you're only going to have a few million to spend.

 

[mas0764]

Just looked at the remaining schedule for us, only two teams out of playoff contention are OTT and MON. NYI x2, PHI and DET. This is not an easy schedule, these teams are fighting for their lives. DAL has a much easier schedule, as does CAR I think. It’ll be a tough road to the end.

I'm more interested in being first in the conference than winning the President's trophy, so I don't care if Dallas passes us.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Just because people like us think Trouba is bad or not worth his cap hit doesn’t mean GMs around the league feel the same way.

Yea, unfortunately Drury is quite possibly one of them

 

[DanielBrassard]

I think he's average and not worth his cap hit. I also think he's the best option on the team in that role right now. People like Schneider there because he's young, home grown, a former first round pick, on a cheap contract, and physical. From everything I've seen Schneider is not remotely ready to step into a bigger role and his results when doing so were much worse than Trouba's. For this year, that's what it is. People always overvalue these young guys and especially the ones that look good in extremely sheltered roles.

In a future year if they can get rid of his cap hit without taking things back that would be great but I highly doubt that is going to be possible. Retaining on him, adding a bad contract, and then signing someone to replace him isn't going to get you someone any better since you're only going to have a few million to spend.

He might be the best option right now, although I could make a case that the Rangers would be better off playing Gustafsson on the first or 2nd pairing but that would require moving guys around which isn’t going to happen. But going forward Schneider doesn’t have to be the answer, I think there are upgrades available in UFA who would be cheaper as well.

I also don’t think trading him would require taking back a bad salary necessarily or retaining that much. There are teams out there that would value Trouba enough to where the Rangers could get rid of most if not all of his salary. We see it all the time.

I don’t think it’s likely they trade him, but I don’t think they would have a problem doing so.