Roster Building thread - Part X - (TDL edition)

[mas0764]

1st overall in the league kinda slaps that bitch in the face. I mean, they’re right there in the conversation and not a hypothetical spit ball.

Being first in the league doesn’t really answer much. If they win the whole thing that answers it. The 5v5 thing continues to stare them in the face. We will see if it can be overcome.

What has helped tremendously is the emergence of Lafreniere and the sustained dominance of Panarin. We are right on the edge of the decline of Mika and Kreider so at least one of the kids may have developed just barely in time. That one line is carrying us.

I’m skeptical that they can win the Cup with just one line like they can win in the regular season but we will find out.

Which is a ridiculous take. Let's be Buffalo and hope in 10 years we can have the best record in the league. Because that's exact what we'd have if the "trade everyone" crowd had their way.

Which is a ridiculous take, no one ever said that and it’s not even implied. Dishonesty is the favorite fallback of the homer.

 

[KennyWu]

This is exactly what I think.
5 mill - years is pretty much market value for him
If 5 years, cap hit goes to 4.5-4.75….
Also very tradeable 2-3 years down the road if need be….

I have no prob signing him to a deal like this. Lindgren 30-31 years old, I don’t want to sign a deal to

I like Lindgren more than most on here, but has he really done enough to warrant a 50-60% raise?

I'm not against keeping him, but 4.5 feels like the max..

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

4.5 for Lindgren would be horrible.

A strong playoff will do a lot to re-write the story of this year for him (which has largely been complete and utter shit) but even with that the smart play would be to just move him. Other top D have better partners than him and 4.5 is too much to pay for a bottom pair guy.

Fox will get over losing a friend if you get him a partner who is top pairing quality. I can't imagine that Vegas would look to move Theodore, but thats a guy I'd love to have if Vegas really need to navigate the cap.

 

[Ruggs225]

Anybody else hate the fact cuylle os on the 4th line.

The third line seemed to play really well together when he was on it.

Hope lav brings back cuylle-wen-kakko line.

I like brodz but cuylle seems to make the line work better

 

[PuckLuck3043]

Being first in the league doesn’t really answer much. If they win the whole thing that answers it. The 5v5 thing continues to stare them in the face. We will see if it can be overcome.

What has helped tremendously is the emergence of Lafreniere and the sustained dominance of Panarin. We are right on the edge of the decline of Mika and Kreider so at least one of the kids may have developed just barely in time. That one line is carrying us.

I’m skeptical that they can win the Cup with just one line like they can win in the regular season but we will find out.



Which is a ridiculous take, no one ever said that and it’s not even implied. Dishonesty is the favorite fallback of the homer.

You will have to forgive the homers like myself for being excited about a 1st place team that currently is at the top of the league standings and all it does is win. They just beat Carolina, Florida, Boston, and Colorado the last 2 weeks(three of those games on the road). This is a damn good, well balanced team. I mean, they have lost 5 times in the last 2 months. Will they win the cup? Who knows? Could they? Sure can. I'm just enjoying the season. I guess that's better than the vultures waiting to pounce because the team isn't perfect.

 

[LaffyTaffy13]

what's the most any of you would pay lindgren?

Apparently he wants term more than anything. So id make him 2 offers if im drury.

1) 7 years X $3.75
2) 3 years X $5

Id also ship trouba out this offseason.

Lindy-Fox
Kandre-Schneider
Jones-Ruhwedel
Robertson

Thats how id start 2024-2025 season and then improve 6D at TDL

 

[mas0764]

You will have to forgive the homers like myself for being excited about a 1st place team that currently is at the top of the league standings and all it does is win. They just beat Carolina, Florida, Boston, and Colorado the last 2 weeks(three of those games on the road). This is a damn good, well balanced team. I mean, they have lost 5 times in the last 2 months. Will they win the cup? Who knows? Could they? Sure can. I'm just enjoying the season. I guess that's better than the vultures waiting to pounce because the team isn't perfect.

Who is saying you can’t enjoy it? I’m enjoying it.

This is such a misleading digression. If anyone points out the team has flaws it must mean they hate the team, should go be a fan of another team, want to rebuild for 20 years like Buffalo (actually impossible for us by the way, so that’s the most disingenuous thing that people say, of all) and all other BS nonsense that gets repeated with zero basis. This is why I say that the homers have to resort to dishonesty. No one is saying we shouldn’t enjoy this season. It’s a special season and yes they could win the Cup and we should all be ecstatic if they do: I certainly will be.

You can enjoy the ride and also admit the team has some problems that should be on the list of things to address ASAP: they still do not excel at 5v5 which is USUALLY a hallmark of a Cup winning team, Trouba and possibly Lindgren need immediate attention in terms of replacement or upgrade, and if Mika can’t bounce back in the playoffs he also enters the conversation to be moved, because if they flame out, your 1C who is playing like a 3C will be a massive culprit. Here’s another point to consider: even if they win the Cup, do they want to win again? Guess who may have to go then?

I dont understand why talking about these things is somehow saying you can’t enjoy the season. I’m enjoying this season tremendously. All that stuff remains true though.

Much of it stems from irrational attachment to personal favorites. Someone says let’s get better players, and there is an outcry AGAINST upgrading. It’s because we like such and such and don’t want to see him go so we rationalize why losing that player would be bad, instead of focusing on the part where you are losing him but gaining a better player. People have been doing it regarding Trouba for years now. The guy flat out sucks. But he’s a locker room favorite, delivers big hits, and the fans eat that shit up. There is no scenario where we do not get immediately better by moving Trouba. None. Nothing he brings cannot be replaced by better on ice performance, which any targeted upgrade would deliver for way less money.

 

[jay from jersey]

I like Lindgren more than most on here, but has he really done enough to warrant a 50-60% raise?

I'm not against keeping him, but 4.5 feels like the max..

It’s similar to Trouba.. you’re buying prime UFA years….. it’s how the business end works

 

[jay from jersey]

4.5 for Lindgren would be horrible.

A strong playoff will do a lot to re-write the story of this year for him (which has largely been complete and utter shit) but even with that the smart play would be to just move him. Other top D have better partners than him and 4.5 is too much to pay for a bottom pair guy.

Fox will get over losing a friend if you get him a partner who is top pairing quality. I can't imagine that Vegas would look to move Theodore, but thats a guy I'd love to have if Vegas really need to navigate the cap.

Lindgren body of work isn’t 60-70% of 1 bad season… yes he gets injured, yes he plays thru injuries, but there was absolutely no one complaining about him prior to this season.
And at 26 years old, he has a lot more in the tank.
Cap is going up, I’d absolutely sign him.
He doesn’t have to be foxs partners through the entirety of the deal.
He gives you some versatility. Maybe he becomes a solid partner with Schneider? Or a great mentor on 3rd pair for a kid….
What we have and what’s out there isn’t great….
I’m not trading Lindgren til LD is more stable as a whole

Laf/panarin/zibby/lindgren/kakko//schneider/kreider// there were even some that wanted to deal shesty when he went thru a rough stretch.
when your fan base is so reactionary it’s pretty hard to build a cohesive corp….
Some care more for ELC/salary cap and youth in the system then the actual on ice product( which is the Main thing)

 

[bernmeister]

Anybody else hate the fact cuylle os on the 4th line.

The third line seemed to play really well together when he was on it.

Hope lav brings back cuylle-wen-kakko line.

I like brodz but cuylle seems to make the line work better

It is beyond stupid to separate Cuylle-KK
Understand the experimentation there.

stopgap

Long term, wenn would be superior/elite 4C, but he is good, not great above that.

Should have been giving Ed mo mins, and that is our future, not Wenn.
Also Rempe needs to be playing more

 

[TominNC]

Being first in the league doesn’t really answer much. If they win the whole thing that answers it. The 5v5 thing continues to stare them in the face. We will see if it can be overcome.

What has helped tremendously is the emergence of Lafreniere and the sustained dominance of Panarin. We are right on the edge of the decline of Mika and Kreider so at least one of the kids may have developed just barely in time. That one line is carrying us.

I’m skeptical that they can win the Cup with just one line like they can win in the regular season but we will find out.



Which is a ridiculous take, no one ever said that and it’s not even implied. Dishonesty is the favorite fallback of the homer.

It’s the example of doing a full rebuild which means clearing out anything of value over a certain an age. I much prefer the process the team used. We’re already the top team in the league.

Also, does anyone know where we rank in 5v5 goals?

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

It’s the example of doing a full rebuild which means clearing out anything of value over a certain an age. I much prefer the process the team used. We’re already the top team in the league.

Also, does anyone know where we rank in 5v5 goals?

all i know is that the Trochek line ranks the best in the NHL.

And i'd assume the Zibanejad line ranks the worst.

 

[PuckLuck3043]

Who is saying you can’t enjoy it? I’m enjoying it.

This is such a misleading digression. If anyone points out the team has flaws it must mean they hate the team, should go be a fan of another team, want to rebuild for 20 years like Buffalo (actually impossible for us by the way, so that’s the most disingenuous thing that people say, of all) and all other BS nonsense that gets repeated with zero basis. This is why I say that the homers have to resort to dishonesty. No one is saying we shouldn’t enjoy this season. It’s a special season and yes they could win the Cup and we should all be ecstatic if they do: I certainly will be.

You can enjoy the ride and also admit the team has some problems that should be on the list of things to address ASAP: they still do not excel at 5v5 which is USUALLY a hallmark of a Cup winning team, Trouba and possibly Lindgren need immediate attention in terms of replacement or upgrade, and if Mika can’t bounce back in the playoffs he also enters the conversation to be moved, because if they flame out, your 1C who is playing like a 3C will be a massive culprit. Here’s another point to consider: even if they win the Cup, do they want to win again? Guess who may have to go then?

I dont understand why talking about these things is somehow saying you can’t enjoy the season. I’m enjoying this season tremendously. All that stuff remains true though.

Much of it stems from irrational attachment to personal favorites. Someone says let’s get better players, and there is an outcry AGAINST upgrading. It’s because we like such and such and don’t want to see him go so we rationalize why losing that player would be bad, instead of focusing on the part where you are losing him but gaining a better player. People have been doing it regarding Trouba for years now. The guy flat out sucks. But he’s a locker room favorite, delivers big hits, and the fans eat that shit up. There is no scenario where we do not get immediately better by moving Trouba. None. Nothing he brings cannot be replaced by better on ice performance, which any targeted upgrade would deliver for way less money.

You make some good points but what is just as dishonest is garbage like we have a 1 line team and only 1 good Dman. The results on the ice say that is just flat out wrong. You talk about 5 on 5 but it's really not that bad and way better than last year. The results speak volumes. This team is 1st in the league in points, win, and winning %. They are top 5 in PP and PK. They are top 7 in GF/G and GA/G. They have a top goaltending tandem. No team is perfect and every team has some flaws otherwise they would be leading the league.
There is also never an outcry about upgrading the roster but it's debatable as to how to go about that. I would think most fans want to see Trouba traded if it means additional cap space and adding a better player.

 

[JimmyG89]

It is beyond stupid to separate Cuylle-KK
Understand the experimentation there.

stopgap

Long term, wenn would be superior/elite 4C, but he is good, not great above that.

Should have been giving Ed mo mins, and that is our future, not Wenn.
Also Rempe needs to be playing more

Wennberg has had a lot on his plate in three weeks, moving to a new city with a very pregnant wife can't be the easiest thing to do.

I think we'll see a better version of Wennberg moving forward, and even with how he has been, he's done solidly in his role.

The schedule will give him almost 4 full weeks around his family. A lot of the stresses from the beginning of a new child will start to pass.

 

[Glen Sathers Cigar]

A lot of the negativity stems from abandoning the rebuild and ppl not feeling like the team has enough talent to win a Cup.

Dude, you have to get past the rebuild. This team has been out of the rebuild for like 3 seasons now. They're first overall in the league with less than 10 games until the playoffs.

What is the point of a rebuild anyway, if not to have a team capable of winning the President's Trophy? Seriously man, I feel like you're missing out on what is a really good team having a great season because they're not perfect. No team is in today's NHL. Should we have dug deeper into the rebuild and ended up like Buffalo? This team rebuilt, whether you like the way they did it or not, and are back to being an elite team in the league.

This team has elite talent, has a Hart candidate this year, a top 2 D man in the league and a goalie capable of carrying a team. It's not some smoke and mirrors, this is a good team with as good a chance as any of the other top teams to realistically win the cup this season.

 

[80s Kid]

I am curious about how this team compares 5v5 vs the league this year vs last year.

This team just looks better. Our PP was white hot the first couple of months this year but cooled off around December/January. After the January funk, the PP still wasn't good if I'm not mistaken but we still won a lot of games. It's picked up a bit over the past couple of weeks but still not where it was early on.

It's no secret the Rangers have one of the best PP units and while I don't have stats to back this up, I do feel like teams play more conservatively against us to stay out of the box. It's smart but you can't be as aggressive and most importantly, the Rangers are still winning.

That team last year just felt off after the Kane debacle and Gallant didn't seem to have an answer. This year, we still have issues but I feel like they're not as widespread compared to last year. This team has better chemistry. Also, the Eastern Conference was a gauntlet last season and that doesn't appear to be the case this year.

What do our 5v5 #s look like as a trend from the beginning of the season to now? I agree it's important but to what extent? I never hear any context around 5v5. Is it as simple as the top 5v5 teams always do well and the cup winners all are great 5v5? I would think trends and consistency matter.

Bottom line, I think 5v5 matters but there has to be more context.

 

[jay from jersey]

Who is saying you can’t enjoy it? I’m enjoying it.

This is such a misleading digression. If anyone points out the team has flaws it must mean they hate the team, should go be a fan of another team, want to rebuild for 20 years like Buffalo (actually impossible for us by the way, so that’s the most disingenuous thing that people say, of all) and all other BS nonsense that gets repeated with zero basis. This is why I say that the homers have to resort to dishonesty. No one is saying we shouldn’t enjoy this season. It’s a special season and yes they could win the Cup and we should all be ecstatic if they do: I certainly will be.

You can enjoy the ride and also admit the team has some problems that should be on the list of things to address ASAP: they still do not excel at 5v5 which is USUALLY a hallmark of a Cup winning team, Trouba and possibly Lindgren need immediate attention in terms of replacement or upgrade, and if Mika can’t bounce back in the playoffs he also enters the conversation to be moved, because if they flame out, your 1C who is playing like a 3C will be a massive culprit. Here’s another point to consider: even if they win the Cup, do they want to win again? Guess who may have to go then?

I dont understand why talking about these things is somehow saying you can’t enjoy the season. I’m enjoying this season tremendously. All that stuff remains true though.

Much of it stems from irrational attachment to personal favorites. Someone says let’s get better players, and there is an outcry AGAINST upgrading. It’s because we like such and such and don’t want to see him go so we rationalize why losing that player would be bad, instead of focusing on the part where you are losing him but gaining a better player. People have been doing it regarding Trouba for years now. The guy flat out sucks. But he’s a locker room favorite, delivers big hits, and the fans eat that shit up. There is no scenario where we do not get immediately better by moving Trouba. None. Nothing he brings cannot be replaced by better on ice performance, which any targeted upgrade would deliver for way less money.

It’s fine to admit there are some problems, but constantly harping on a few each season grows tiring. Especially when the team is overachieving in first place.
This will be a playoff team competing for a cup, this season, next and beyond.
Players will get moved, UFA. S will be signed, and new ones drafted and brought in.
It seems that if the team doesn’t live up to a certain criteria, it’s all for nothing……
Pointing out problems is fine, but neither is giving credit where it’s due either…..
You love to bring up the negatives from Drury but seem to gloss over the things he’s positively done.
Also, complaining about trades that never took place is useless.
Kreider could have been dealt for Robertson 1st
He coulda been dealt for Newhook
Or 3-4 other trades we don’t know about.
We signed him. He’s out performing the deal we gave him… there’s no use playing the what if game……
Moving /wanting to move Trouba is fine, when it actually makes sense.
Not when he has 3-4 years left and a NMC…..
You are harping on the same thing with Zibby…6 years left and a NMC.
It’s a waste of time. He’s not going anywhere in the near future….

We all know the bad
Nemeth
Not getting a 1 for Buch
Etc

But this team has 5 players 30 or older.
A 26 year old Norris D
A 28 year old Vezina G

A solid but not loaded farm.
It is and will remain 1 of the top destinations for UFA talent…
There’s a ton more to be positive about.

Looking at Stats and watching the condensed game doesn’t tell the entire story of how important certain guys are to the team and culture of winning. Especially in a city like NY.
Distractions and bad ideas don’t sleep here.

No one is saying NYR will be buff /OTT or Pho….
Good teams don’t just roll out all young kids on ELCs with loaded farms.
And breaking a losing culture when it’s been entrenched in an organization for so long is hard to break.
I’m sure you, myself and many others remember the dark times here….
We are miles and miles from where we were Pre-lockout.

Enjoy the ride a bit more

 

[UAGoalieGuy]

It’s the example of doing a full rebuild which means clearing out anything of value over a certain an age. I much prefer the process the team used. We’re already the top team in the league.

Also, does anyone know where we rank in 5v5 goals?

Quick mental math (Its 130am so cut me some slack if some of my math is wrong lol), Rangers have a total of 254 goals so far this season with 58 on the power play and 6 on the PK. So that's 190 5v5 goals.

From what I can see, only teams w more 5v5 goals are the Avs, Oilers, Leafs, Stars and Canucks. Smallest gap is 7 more 5v5 goals (Canucks) and largest is 18 (Stars).

So the Rangers have the 6th most 5v5 goals this season.

Another fun fact, Kreider and Zib account for 29 of the 64 special teams goals (45%).

2023-24 NHL Summary | Hockey-Reference.com

Check out the Eastern, Western Conference and Playoff series Standings, Statistics, Leaders and more for the 2023-24 NHL season on Hockey-Reference.com

www.hockey-reference.com

 

[egelband]

It's surprising, to me, the amount of negativity around a team that's going to end up having the best three year regular season stretch in a nearly one hundred year history.

The East is wide open - if they play the right way they certainly have an outstanding chance at getting to the Final.

Some of the players are 30 years old and not homegrown. So it’s just crappy poop frown.

 

[egelband]

Tough to say…
Definitely worse. But NYR as a franchise would never sit on that much Cap/money.
They would have def traded/signed someone else.

i would love to snag Guhle from them some how….
He’s a guy who I think who be ideal for a Fox partner…
MTL also has a loaded stable of D prospects and are in need of nhl ready Fwds
He’s going through the trials and tribulations of a sophomore slump this season, but he’s going to be a really good player.
Drury and gorton don’t like each other, so I don’t think they will be looking to deal tbh.
If NYR were to deal Kakko, ( not saying they should or will) Guhle would be the type of trade I’d want in return.

I like Guhle too. But I wouldn’t move Kakko.

 

[haohmaru]

Being first in the league doesn’t really answer much. If they win the whole thing that answers it. The 5v5 thing continues to stare them in the face. We will see if it can be overcome.

What has helped tremendously is the emergence of Lafreniere and the sustained dominance of Panarin. We are right on the edge of the decline of Mika and Kreider so at least one of the kids may have developed just barely in time. That one line is carrying us.

I’m skeptical that they can win the Cup with just one line like they can win in the regular season but we will find out.

You should be skeptical. Hell, you should be skeptical about ANY of the 32 teams winning the Cup. Everyone was talking about the Devils at the beginning of the year. Look where they're at. There's a 3% chance of winning the Cup for every team, every year.

Is this team in the conversation of the top 5 or 6 teams vying for that? Of course it is.

 

[egelband]

I def don’t expect Wennberg back.
Even if he loves NY, he’s making 4 4.5 per now.
The cap is going up. I doubt he’ll take much of a pay cut.
The only UFA center I like on the market is Stephenson.
He solves all issues with top 3 C. Any one of him Tro or zibby can get hot and center a #1 line. But he’s going to cost 5.5-6 mill per easy.

UFA or trade are the only viable options to fix 3C long term( 2-3 years +)

Banking on chytil even if he comes back is too risky. And even if they draft a stud C he’s likely 2 years away at a minimum….

I can’t see Wennberg making over 3 or 3.5. He’s a smallish defensive center now. I think 3 is even pushing it but sometimes weird deals happen.

 

[RangerBoy]

Keep the Lindgren contract as short as possible. Another 3 year contract. One year of group II. Two years of group III. $4M-$4.5M. He will want some of NTC clause in years 2 & 3. The salary cap will be approaching $100M in the summer of 2027. Lindgren will still be under 30. He will get another decent contract.

$87.675M 2024-25
$92M 2025-26

CBA expires after 25-26. New CBA will be negotiated. The set formula coming out of Covid will be gone.

 

[mas0764]

It’s the example of doing a full rebuild which means clearing out anything of value over a certain an age. I much prefer the process the team used. We’re already the top team in the league.

Also, does anyone know where we rank in 5v5 goals?

It’s not the example of doing a full rebuild. Thats the dishonesty part. You are citing an incompetent franchise to scare people off a rebuild with the spectre of a poorly run franchise that can’t ever do anything right, just like Arizona.

We are never, ever in danger of a sustained period of complete irrelevance for many reasons. Our history, original 6 status, market, willingness to spend, and attractiveness to free agents all guarantee we will never be Buffalo or Arizona. Dropping them into the argument for rhetorical purposes is dishonesty.

I dunno, how come you didn’t cite Colorado? Oh.

 

[egelband]

Anybody else hate the fact cuylle os on the 4th line.

The third line seemed to play really well together when he was on it.

Hope lav brings back cuylle-wen-kakko line.

I like brodz but cuylle seems to make the line work better

I think his future is in the middle six but right now he’s getting some much needed rest and lower exposure usage.