Speculation: Roster Building Thread: Part LXXIX - Clever Title

[kovazub94]

Top 2 picks, forwards only, NHL points in D+1 season:

2019 - Jack Hughes (21); Kaapo Kakko (23)
2018 - Andrei Svechnikov (37)
2017 - Nico Hirschier (52); Nolan Patrick (30)
2016 - Austin Mathews (69); Patrik Laine (64)
2015 - Connor McDavid (48); Jack Eichel (56)
2014 - Sam Reinhart (1)
2013 - Nathan MacKinnon (63); Aleksander Barkov (24)
2012 - Nail Yakupov (31)
2011 - Ryan Nugent-Hopkins (52); Gabriel Landeskog (52)
2010 - Taylor Hall (42); Tyler Seguin (22)
2009 - John Tavares (54)
2008 - Steven Stamkos (46)
2007 - Patrick Kane (72)
2006 - Jordan Staal (42)
2005 - Sidney Crosby (102)

I thought you'd show points through the first 11 game or some other early mark. Typically these points got "accrued" toward later part of the season.

 

[LiveLongandProspal]

How about trading for Adam Fox?

Yeah, that would count

 

[Daves a mess]

I have $3 that says ADA drives a black escalade

I'm mostly Italian and thats funny. With a Drakar Noir air freshener?

 

[Edge]

The Blackhawks didn’t hit on every top-10 pick, to say the least lol.

There’s a huge difference between acceptance and indifference.

Funny thing is I don't know if indifference is a viable option for our board.

The end result will likely float between acceptance and happiness with the overall score card, or acceptance and disapproval of the overall score card. With many hot takes in-between.

 

[SRHRangers]

It would be nice to see how some of the main cogs that post in here view the shape of our roster for season 22-23 and how they arrived at new additions / roster changes and a cap figure for each . Any chance of that guys ? It would help show how the money will be spent and how hard it could be and of course all speculation at best . It would also be a change of pace from the same old day in and day out posts of much the same .....

I'll give it a whirl.

LW: Panarin, LaF, Krieder, PDG.

RW: Kakko, Kravtsov, UFA 3rd line, Lemmy.

C: Zibs, Chytil, Matty Beniers, Barron.

Defense:

Miller/Trouba
Lindgren/Fox.
Reunanen/Schneider

Igor and ???

I use Lundkvist to move up to get Beniers in this draft if it is necessary.

Deal Buch for a cheaper RW option.

I dunno how the flat cap will affect UFAs over the course of the next 2 years, but this would have Beniers, LaF, Miller, Schneider, Barron, Kravtsov, and Reunanen under ELCs.

Chytil and Kakko under some sort of bridge deals. (maybe Fox as well)

 

[TominNC]

Nobody here thinks he should be playing every game. What he shouldn’t be doing is sharing the crease like this.

Sharing the crease like what?

 

[Kocur Dill]

I have $3 that says ADA drives a black escalade

I'll double down on that bet that its a Black with gold letters 80's IROCz.

Vanity plate: JERZSHOR

 

[Amazing Kreiderman]

How about trading for Adam Fox?

Trading up to draft Miller seems to be a great move
Trading Nash at the deadline for a 1st, Lindgren, Spooner and Beleskey
Trading Spooner then for Strome

Gorton has made a lot more good moves than bad

 

[Daves a mess]

How anyone sees this and with a straight face says that they aren’t at all concerned about our guys is beyond me. Patience is a virtue, sure, but patience when it comes to successful top picks usually means waiting for them to go from 0.5PPG (conservatively) to PPG+.

Barkov is a big time outlier on that list and hanging our hats on our guys following his trajectory is basically hopes and prayers.

What am I missing?

Exactly why I asked about it earlier. I know I was not so subtle with the implication and also getting concerned with the company our top two are in.

105 pts for Sydney in D+1 year. Get out of here with that awesomeness.
What did Ovi get in year 1 again?

Yes, I'm aware of the "sample size" haha.

 

[Synergy27]

Exactly why I asked about it earlier. I know I was not so subtle with the implication and also getting concerned with the company our top two are in.

105 pts for Sydney in D+1 year. Get out of here with that awesomeness.
What did Ovi get in year 1 again?

Yes, I'm aware of the "sample size" haha.

I’m not asking for Sid level production. We knew all along that we were not picking 1OA in generational years. Laf was billed as only a step below that, though, so if his rookie year ends up being on par with Hughes/Kakko, who themselves were undeniable disappointments, that’s concerning.

Yes COVID and “unprecedented weird season” are mitigating circumstances but that only buys down a part of the failure to meet expectations.

Let’s hope that these early season woes are completely forgettable a couple months from now. Until then I will remain concerned.

 

[Edge]

How anyone sees this and with a straight face says that they aren’t at all concerned about our guys is beyond me. Patience is a virtue, sure, but patience when it comes to successful top picks usually means waiting for them to go from 0.5PPG (conservatively) to PPG+.

Barkov is a big time outlier on that list and hanging our hats on our guys following his trajectory is basically hopes and prayers.

What am I missing?

Nothing that hasn't been explained in countless pages, a half-a-dozen different ways. I'm not really sure there's too terribly much to add.

I kind of feel like that this point it's pretty much a personality test. People are set in how they're going to interpret it, and very little is likely to change their basic instinct response.

 

[Doriva]

I’m not asking for Sid level production. We knew all along that we were not picking 1OA in generational years. Laf was billed as only a step below that, though, so if his rookie year ends up being on par with Hughes/Kakko, who themselves were undeniable disappointments, that’s concerning.

Yes COVID and “unprecedented weird season” are mitigating circumstances but that only buys down a part of the failure to meet expectations.

Let’s hope that these early season woes are completely forgettable a couple months from now. Until then I will remain concerned.

I think it's key to remember that every player is unique and will have different development curves, like look how late Zibby bloomed. The potential with Laf is clear and I think by age 22-23 he could explode and become an absolute monster in terms of stats and on ice impact.

At this point I'd be happy with Laf getting consistent ice-time with the same line mates.....
Which would hopefully in turn bring solid and noticeable play from Laf, which to this point has came in fits and starts.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

delete

 

[NYR]

I think they need to learn how to win tight games, no question. They have enough veteran leadership on the team. The question is, do they have enough gamers? I think there's a few on the roster probably could use a few more.



That would be an absolute disaster. And yes, Isles. Sorry.

Idk man.. I think they have the players to compete but they had a really good looking PP and now they're just standing still because they're afraid of a scoring chances against.

When 101 lapses dictate a game, you have problems..

 

[DutchShamrock]

Sorry folks but Shesterkin isn’t playing every game.

So you got him last night. That means no Shesty for one of the Bruins games.

We can't yell at Quinn for running Igor into the ground if he rests him in a compressed season.

 

[Daves a mess]

I’m not asking for Sid level production. We knew all along that we were not picking 1OA in generational years. Laf was billed as only a step below that, though, so if his rookie year ends up being on par with Hughes/Kakko, who themselves were undeniable disappointments, that’s concerning.

Yes COVID and “unprecedented weird season” are mitigating circumstances but that only buys down a part of the failure to meet expectations.

Let’s hope that these early season woes are completely forgettable a couple months from now. Until then I will remain concerned.

None of us ( i think) were asking for Sid levels of production.

But its not a stretch to say that 1 point in 11 games for LAF and what 3 for Kakko in 10 isn't starting to make most of us at least slightly concerned. I agree with your concern.

Most of those players on the list that @Crease posted I seem to recall showed more "wow" talent to me in their first season.
I remember Tavares' first season. He was so weak on the puck at 18 but you could see the skill the first time he laced up against the Rangers . Kane I remember being ridiculously good. Toews too. Not even going to mention McJesus, Austin ( I pissed on your car) Matthew's or Patrick Laine.

But to me this conversation has some more significance at around game 30.

But game 10 started the "hmm" for me. I'll go there.
Guilty with the premature nose crinkle.

 

[cwede]

sorry guys, this idea that guys' production, in year
1 or 2, is reliable predictor of career arc is very often false
especially immediately following their drafts
NYR's O has been out of synch all season so far.

i am not worried about Laf or Kakk at all

but i never get too concerned during guys' ELC's
you don't draft them for what they'll be at 20 ... just my subjective opinion

 

[Fitzy]

While it was a great miracle that NYR got both Kakko and Laf, and I'm sure both will turn into good players, there's sort of a cruel irony to the fact that the player who was the easy choice at each pick was a winger, not a center.

 

[Synergy27]

None of us ( i think) were asking for Sid levels of production.

But its not a stretch to say that 1 point in 11 games for LAF and what 3 for Kakko in 10 isn't starting to make most of us at least slightly concerned. I agree with your concern.

Most of those players on the list that @Crease posted I seem to recall showed more "wow" talent to me in their first season.
I remember Tavares' first season. He was so weak on the puck at 18 but you could see the skill the first time he laced up against the Rangers . Kane I remember being ridiculously good. Toews too. Not even going to mention McJesus, Austin ( I pissed on your car) Matthew's or Patrick Laine.

But to me this conversation has some more significance at around game 30.

But game 10 started the "hmm" for me. I'll go there.
Guilty with the premature nose crinkle.

This is exactly where I am. I think we’ll continue to be looked at as naysayers or doomsdayers while everyone else rationalizes their way around the lack of production we are seeing.

I want to make one thing clear though. I’m not here proclaiming these kids to be busts, or actively advocating that we trade them or something. I want them to succeed really, really badly. I am just voicing what I feel to be rational concern over the disappointing early returns on this team’s highest ever draft picks.

 

[Synergy27]

Nothing that hasn't been explained in countless pages, a half-a-dozen different ways. I'm not really sure there's too terribly much to add.

I kind of feel like that this point it's pretty much a personality test. People are set in how they're going to interpret it, and very little is likely to change their basic instinct response.

Do you think this logic applies to just being “concerned”? I think you are clearly in the right in arguing with people who are trying to declare these kids to be busts already. But some degree of concern is absolutely rational at this point.

 

[Edge]

Do you think this logic applies to just being “concerned”? I think you are clearly in the right in arguing with people who are trying to declare these kids to be busts already. But some degree of concern is absolutely rational at this point.

I think it depends on what information you're using for the basis and the context in which you use that information.

The eye-test and some advanced stats aren't really raising red flags right now and the biggest chatter on this topic really does seem to be focused on here, with some pockets on social media. It's not something that's really coming up in scouting circles, or with veteran pundits or observers.

I mean right now, it ultimately comes down to a few more pucks going in for each kid (which easily could've happened) and how the stat line looks.

Neither kid looks overwhelmed out there. There's not glaring metrics that show a problem right now. It's a fear that more or less kind of feeds itself.

 

[True Blue]

This roster screams nothing.

they literally are not collectively good at anything.

Funny, but when I think of those with scorching hot takes, your name does not usually come to mind.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Funny, but when I think of those with scorching hot takes, your name does not usually come to mind.

what do they do well?

 

[True Blue]

what do they do well?

They can sew! Takers on who knows where that is from (without Google you cheaters)?

Seriously, as the youngest team in the league, with a roster that is not filled with vets, they can figure it out. But i would say that outshooting your opponents while limiting his opportunity chances says a thing or two

 

[True Blue]

i understand, but i am more concerned about getting our starter going than our backup.

And that is a very fair point. It "looks" like Shesterkin is finding his groove. Let's put it this way, it's Friday against the B's or Sunday against Philly.