Roster Building thread - Part IX - (2024 edition)

[McRanger92]

Ive been critical of Lindgren plenty so Ill leave him be specifically, but the whole left side of the D has been a big disappointment. I was expecting Miller to take a big jump this year into being a top pair guy, but so far it is hasnt happened outside of a few games where he is so good he almost wills the team to victory. Still time left in the season and I love his tools but outside of transition defense he has regressed on that side of the puck. He can't make a first pass and doesnt handle pressure with any urgency. I know Trouba's chart are gnarly and he is slumping since getting off to a hot start (new baby) but Miller doesnt help him at all. Not great support on breakouts and Miller's bonehead plays leave Jacob in a lot of no win situations. Trouba can actually make a first pass.

Gus is simply a solid offensive bottom pair D. Nothing more nothing less. Massive upgrade on Nemeth, Braun, Harpur but still just a guy. He fits Laviolette's system though and I dont think Miller and Lindgren are great fits. They certainly havent figured out how to play it well yet. If the team is going to add a significant piece, it needs to be a left defenseman. Having 7 good defenseman is a feature not a bug so dont ask me "who comes out???". That will work itself out organically.

 

[hardnosed]

Ive been critical of Lindgren plenty so Ill leave him be specifically, but the whole left side of the D has been a big disappointment. I was expecting Miller to take a big jump this year into being a top pair guy, but so far it is hasnt happened outside of a few games where he is so good he almost wills the team to victory. Still time left in the season and I love his tools but outside of transition defense he has regressed on that side of the puck. He can't make a first pass and doesnt handle pressure with any urgency. I know Trouba's chart are gnarly and he is slumping since getting off to a hot start (new baby) but Miller doesnt help him at all. Not great support on breakouts and Miller's bonehead plays leave Jacob in a lot of no win situations. Trouba can actually make a first pass.

Gus is simply a solid offensive bottom pair D. Nothing more nothing less. Massive upgrade on Nemeth, Braun, Harpur but still just a guy. He fits Laviolette's system though and I dont think Miller and Lindgren are great fits. They certainly havent figured out how to play it well yet. If the team is going to add a significant piece, it needs to be a left defenseman. Having 7 good defenseman is a feature not a bug so dont ask me "who comes out???". That will work itself out organically.

This is a good synopsis. I agree about Gus being a JAG and suppose you are right about him being a good fit in this system. No sense wasting time on Lindgren. He is what he is. But you hit the nail on the head with Miller. For our 6 to be sufficient, he should have progressed to being a star already, not a detriment to Trouba. Trading Lindgren accomplishes nothing to fix Miller/Trouba and doesn't get you much without other assets. And we don't have the cap to get a big upgrade 7th D without moving a contract. That's why my conclusion is to trade Miller. Teams would want him.

 

[TGWL]

Gus moves the puck. That's defense. We can get into the "what does he do when the other team is holding the puck", but at the end of the day getting the puck to another player or out of danger is solid defense. I don't think fans are arguing that he's better at bodying up players, taking one for his teammates, or saving a goal with his face. (Although in fairness, Lindgren looks much better at that because you always see him trying, more than how much he succeeds.) Nobody is going to argue his heart or that his body appears to be breaking down on him by how much he's sacrificing it.

 

[McRanger92]

This is a good synopsis. I agree about Gus being a JAG and suppose you are right about him being a good fit in this system. No sense wasting time on Lindgren. He is what he is. But you hit the nail on the head with Miller. For our 6 to be sufficient, he should have progressed to being a star already, not a detriment to Trouba. Trading Lindgren accomplishes nothing to fix Miller/Trouba and doesn't get you much without other assets. And we don't have the cap to get a big upgrade 7th D without moving a contract. That's why my conclusion is to trade Miller. Teams would want him.

I think they need to break up Miller and Trouba before they think about trading Miller. His upside is still very high, he's young and defenseman take longer to develop (Adam Fox notwithstanding). I know what Laviolette is going for with that pair. In theory 2 big long defensman against other teams top lines should work but Miller just isnt playing his game. He should skate the puck/dump and chase into the zone as much as he can. When he starts passing it becomes hot potato. No one can stop him when hes on the move.

 

[Machinehead]

Nobody would be complaining about Miller if he didn't have to play with Trouba. He makes boneheaded plays but every good defenseman makes boneheaded plays, and he's basically playing both LD and RD when Trouba goes for a stroll.

You would be crazy to move Miller. He would break out somewhere else and we would just ruin his replacement by putting his replacement with Trouba.

I do agree that Miller struggles passing the puck. If only we had a RD on this team who is exceptional at passing the puck but sometimes needs help carrying it. Wonder where we can find one of those.

 

[SnowblindNYR]

He thinks Trouba is better than Fox. Neither pair of good right now, but the idea of it annoys me more than the results.

Maybe he thinks Miller is better than Lindgren?

 

[hardnosed]

Maybe he thinks Miller is better than Lindgren?

Neither Miller or Trouba plays on the PP. We get 3,4 PPs and that's 5 extra minutes for Fox. Plus, late in games earlier in the season when we were leading late, Trouba gets a lot of extra minutes. Last week when trailing late, Fox played the last 3,4 minutes. 4 on 4, that's Fox time. Seems they have a Plan to balance it out. It's a long season. I would start getting concerned in April.

 

[Machinehead]

Maybe he thinks Miller is better than Lindgren?

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Nobody would be complaining about Miller if he didn't have to play with Trouba. He makes boneheaded plays but every good defenseman makes boneheaded plays, and he's basically playing both LD and RD when Trouba goes for a stroll.

You would be crazy to move Miller. He would break out somewhere else and we would just ruin his replacement by putting his replacement with Trouba.

I do agree that Miller struggles passing the puck. If only we had a RD on this team who is exceptional at passing the puck but sometimes needs help carrying it. Wonder where we can find one of those.

Nope, playing him with Fox would hinder his development and no one except Lindgren on the team can play that role!

 

[Machinehead]

Neither Miller or Trouba plays on the PP. We get 3,4 PPs and that's 5 extra minutes for Fox. Plus, late in games earlier in the season when we were leading late, Trouba gets a lot of extra minutes. Last week when trailing late, Fox played the last 3,4 minutes. 4 on 4, that's Fox time. Seems they have a Plan to balance it out. It's a long season. I would start getting concerned in April.

I'm taking this as permission to be as obnoxious as possible when Trouba plays more minutes in the playoffs.

 

[hardnosed]

I'm taking this as permission to be as obnoxious as possible when Trouba plays more minutes in the playoffs.

Lol
Yea. I wrote that trying to be optimistic as possible but deep down I'm as worried as you.

 

[NYR Viper]

If the organization thinks long term (2-3 years), they trade Lindgren, sign a veteran (Edmundson or other) for 2 years, re-sign Gustafsson for 2 years and then sign Schneider to a 2 year extension. Gustafsson-Schneider are a pairing for the next 2 years. Gustafsson is on PP2 and insurance for PP1 in case Fox needs time off.

Miller-Fox
Edmundson-Trouba
Gustafsson-Schneider


If they can make the $$ work, I'd throw a long term deal at Hanifan if he hits UFA. Otherwise, it's veteran bargain bin shopping for a year or two until someone long term becomes available.

Also, Drury needs to find a way to get some picks that he can use on d-men. The prospect pool is pretty barren. Fortescue and Mancini are the only 2 of note outside of Robertson and Scanlin who are both nearing the point where they need to develop or it's time to cut bait.

 

[duhmetreE]

You have to get out of Trouba's contract next off-season. He'd be entering his age 30 season. When people talk about 'slowing down', around that age, the alarm bells are going off for me.

I know 'toughness' and 'grit' but if we can somehow replace Trouba and/or Lindgren for the top4, that'd be great. We'd have around 5-6M for each replacement. I know it's not happening but they will be hinderances to our cup aspirations.

 

[Lindberg Cheese]

yes to a Lot of the above. We need a decent LD to provide lineup options and coverage. This and a legit 3C or whatever nomenclature should be our priorities. When Chytil comes back for the playoffs, I’d like to see him at RW pushing some folks down or out..

Question is, who are these people and what will they cost. Looking at pending UFAs, assumes Hanifin resigns

Center - Henrique, Monahan, Roslovic
LD - not looking great - Edmundson, Scandella, I’m missing more garbage

Who else?

 

[Ail]

You have to get out of Trouba's contract next off-season. He'd be entering his age 30 season. When people talk about 'slowing down', around that age, the alarm bells are going off for me.

I know 'toughness' and 'grit' but if we can somehow replace Trouba and/or Lindgren for the top4, that'd be great. We'd have around 5-6M for each replacement. I know it's not happening but they will be hinderances to our cup aspirations.

View attachment 805054

You may not like it, but this is what peak defensive metrics look like.

 

[duhmetreE]

KAM Fox
Chychrun Scheids
Gus Tanev

dont @ me.

You may not like it, but this is what peak defensive metrics look like.

put them together and we get a Bonino

 

[Boris Zubov]

KAM Fox
Chychrun Scheids
Gus Tanev

dont @ me.


put them together and we get a Bonino

Not that I'm against it, but is Ottawa really trading Chychrun so soon?

 

[Kovalev27]

There are two moves I’d make to win the Cup

Id trade lindgren to bring in chychrun somehow. And separate miller and trouba

I expect chytil back but I want some protection against injury. So I want a center that can play wing. Gourde Monahan Lindholm.

Ideal state. That guy slots on RW on third line. But incase chytil gets hurt again that guy moves to center. We can probably survive finding a bottom 6 wing in house at that point.

That’s all this team needs to do. Drury needs to be brave enough to trade a “friend” in lindgren who he cannot resign. He has to bring in a real top 4 dman.

 

[duhmetreE]

Not that I'm against it, but is Ottawa really trading Chychrun so soon?

It'd make sense for them to recoup some of their costs.

The team has been an absolute failure. They traded for him with Playoffs asipirations last season... They'd have to gauge if he wants to re-sign but they commited heavily to Sanderson and Chabot already.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I’d trade for Hanafin and sign him.

Cychrun gets hurt too often to really rely on. At his best he is certainly a fit the fit doesn’t matter if he is physically unable to play.

Hes having a pretty meh year but playing for Ottawa certainly has something to do with that.

 

[NYR Viper]

yes to a Lot of the above. We need a decent LD to provide lineup options and coverage. This and a legit 3C or whatever nomenclature should be our priorities. When Chytil comes back for the playoffs, I’d like to see him at RW pushing some folks down or out..

Question is, who are these people and what will they cost. Looking at pending UFAs, assumes Hanifin resigns

Center - Henrique, Monahan, Roslovic
LD - not looking great - Edmundson, Scandella, I’m missing more garbage

Who else?

I think if they're looking for a center, I'd be on the lookout for a trade scenario. Pinto has been floated. Boone Jenner is another one. If the Pens fall out of the playoff race, which they may, Lars Eller is another one.

In terms of UFA's, I think the sights have to be on a lower level guy who can provide some depth and add something. I'd be looking at what guys like Stephenson, Roslovic, Blueger, Novak and Wennberg are looking for.

For example, if you throw someone like Wennberg on a line with say Chytil and Cuylle, two guys who like shooting the puck, that may be an effective line. I also don't think Wennberg will break the bank in terms of his next contract.

I’d trade for Hanafin and sign him.

Cychrun gets hurt too often to really rely on. At his best he is certainly a fit the fit doesn’t matter if he is physically unable to play.

Hes having a pretty meh year but playing for Ottawa certainly has something to do with that.

Hanifan is my target on defense if the cost isn't exorbitant, although I'm also happy taking the low key approach and signing a couple of veteran guys if needed

 

[Machinehead]

KAM Fox
Chychrun Scheids
Gus Tanev

dont @ me.


put them together and we get a Bonino

If you put the good bars together, you get Will Cuylle!

 

[bbny]

Lindgren has 4 full seasons before this with respectable xG numbers saying he's better than the first half of this season. His body of work as a whole says he's a quality 2nd pairing defensive defenseman. He's been a good partner for Fox through the early years, but it's also a good point that it may have run it's course and it's time to see if you can get even more out of Fox w/ a different partner. That doesn't mean Lindgren is easily discardable and easily replaceable with the same cap number he's going to get, which might wind up being cheaper than anyone expects. We'll see. Zero chance he's traded in-season btw.

 

[Machinehead]

I think if they're looking for a center, I'd be on the lookout for a trade scenario. Pinto has been floated. Boone Jenner is another one. If the Pens fall out of the playoff race, which they may, Lars Eller is another one.

In terms of UFA's, I think the sights have to be on a lower level guy who can provide some depth and add something. I'd be looking at what guys like Stephenson, Roslovic, Blueger, Novak and Wennberg are looking for.

For example, if you throw someone like Wennberg on a line with say Chytil and Cuylle, two guys who like shooting the puck, that may be an effective line. I also don't think Wennberg will break the bank in terms of his next contract.



Hanifan is my target on defense if the cost isn't exorbitant, although I'm also happy taking the low key approach and signing a couple of veteran guys if needed

Wennberg might be the worst penalty killer of all-time which I just think is funny, but he's a net positive at even strength.

I wouldn't mind a line of Cuylle-Chtyil-Wennberg but we have to be careful of the tendency we have to bin "top six guys" and "bottom six guys." The Rangers have been very guilty of that since the Gorton years. It leads to too much pond hockey at the top, not enough scoring at the bottom, and generally useless 4th lines. I would love to see them start not doing that by giving Vesey a real role but we can't have nice things.

 

[NYR Viper]

View attachment 805066
Wennberg might be the worst penalty killer of all-time which I just think is funny, but he's a net positive at even strength.

I wouldn't mind a line of Cuylle-Chtyil-Wennberg but we have to be careful of the tendency we have to bin "top six guys" and "bottom six guys." The Rangers have been very guilty of that since the Gorton years. It leads to too much pond hockey at the top, not enough scoring at the bottom, and generally useless 4th lines. I would love to see them start not doing that by giving Vesey a real role but we can't have nice things.

Just spitballing but if the lines were:

Panarin-Trochek-Lafreniere
Kreider-Zibanejad-Kakko
Cuylle-Wennberg-Chytil

That would leave Vesey, likely someone like Edstrom and maybe someone like Berard on the 4th line.

Berard-Edstrom-Vesey

Or go get a solid veteran who can play 4C and slide Edstrom over to wing.

I think, if they make smart choices with Goodrow and Lindgren and go for a low-key LD in lieu of Hanifan (although I would go HAnifan if he hits UFA and was willing to come to NY), then they should have money to find the right player who could start the year on the 4th line, but be more of a 3rd line type. Maybe someone like William Carrier or Yakov Trenin or Sam Lafferty.

To be clear, I'm not paying out the nose for anyone but they should have some money where they could find the right guy and start him on the 4th line knowing that he would play higher if an injury occurred.