Speculation: Roster Building Thread - Off-season Part I

[bleedblue94]

I would not because Zibanejad is on the team and better than him. That will be the case regardless of how good/bad Chytil is on faceoffs.

Also your math is extremely faulty.

Bergeron 13.6 FOW/game
ROR 11.5 FOW/game
Chytil 2.0 FOW/game

So, no, I am not suggesting the difference between those guys and him is two per game. Even if you took Bergeron's total FO with Chytil's FO% it's a difference of 4 per game...and there would be no reason for Chytil to ever take that many.

you literally in your last post suggested that chytil fow percentage would account for .4 more fow per game if his percentage went up. are you going to keep playing so dense that if chytil was better on draws he wouldnt be taking more and as such would be winning more draws per game like the other players mentioned? really? what are playing these kind of dumb games? and if he could take more draws he would get more 5v5 time rather than just hopping out there on a live change while play is going on?

also your comment about zib is better than him at draws is pretty weak based on the fact the team uses zib on his "strong" side for important draws and literally turned to rooney and goodrow as lh centermen to take draws on the otherside of the ice. that isnt a debate, we watched that happen all season and especially in the playoffs. if chytil could win draws at even 50% clip his 5v5 ice time would go up substantially simply bc he would be on the ice more tasked to take faceoffs.

that was the topic of the original post that you replied to that started this: chytil's poor faceoff play affecting his 5v5 ice time deployment based on what the coaching staff did this year.

stop acting like an accountant who only stares at and manipulates numbers and doesnt know something about hockey and deployment...

 

[Thirty One]

Much like back with just corsi, I think treating all faceoffs with the same amount of importance is kind of silly.

That said, I doubt it makes a huge difference in the players stats even if they were broken down by zone, or game score, or whatever.

The other thing, often the faceoff is sort of neutral, the other players come in to get the puck, So without being able to separate the other players ability to do that beyond the person who took the faceoff (like rebound ability in basketball) .. anyway it's nicer to win them than lose them.

One thing I'm kinda shocked that we don't have the data widely available for yet (as far as I know) is left circle vs. right circle faceoffs. I know the Rangers split the faceoffs by side a lot (Kreider/Zibanejad, Copp/Strome). Wondering what the results are.

 

[Thirty One]

stop acting like an accountant who only stares at and manipulates numbers and doesnt know something about hockey and deployment...

I feel attacked.

 

[jerseyjinx94]

Dubois has a career high of 61 points. He scored 28 goals last year (15 on the PP) in a year where scoring was up league wide. He also played nearly 20 mins a game. The year before last, he cried his way out of Columbus and scored 8 goals in 41 games with Winnipeg averaging 15 minutes of ice (similar to Chytil’s numbers). Chytil battled injuries, played zero power play time, and played most of the season with Julien Gauthier and the like.

This hype around Dubois isn’t warranted, honestly. He’s a good player, but give Chytil those minutes and see if he can develop further before giving up on him.

 

[bleedblue94]

I feel attacked.

you know about hockey and provide substance that is related to numbers AND to your knowledge of hockey.

 

[Off Sides]

One thing I'm kinda shocked that we don't have the data widely available for yet (as far as I know) is left circle vs. right circle faceoffs. I know the Rangers split the faceoffs by side a lot (Kreider/Zibanejad, Copp/Strome). Wondering what the results are.

I also wonder, if the Rangers did value faceoffs, why would they not try to do something similar to bringing in someone who could coach them.

When Perreault came in, Shaw was a 44 percent faceoff man, while Kruger was not much better at 46.2 percent.

This year, for the first time Shaw and Kruger joined Toews at over 50 percent. Throw in veterans Brad Richards and Antoine Vermette, both acquired this season, and it’s an area in which Chicago has shown demonstrable improvement since Perreault joined the organization.

 

[bleedblue94]

One thing I'm kinda shocked that we don't have the data widely available for yet (as far as I know) is left circle vs. right circle faceoffs. I know the Rangers split the faceoffs by side a lot (Kreider/Zibanejad, Copp/Strome). Wondering what the results are.

and down the stretch it very much turned into zib or goodrow (4th line) for faceoffs depending which side they were on. they tolerated strome on faceoffs just to get panarin out there. this is why i say chytil's poor faceoof play affected his 5v5 icetime and deployment bc he and his linemates were never going to supersede strome/panarin even if their actual play was better. there was just too much money on the strome line for them not to be force fed minutes.

 

[Off Sides]

So I guess now if there is a video in whatever one is linking, it just adds that to the post?

 

[KirkAlbuquerque]

theres only one move i want the Rangers to make this offseason and that is letting Strome sign with another team.

 

[McRanger92]

Friedman mentioning Malkin to NYR on Rupp’s show. I would take him on a short term reasonable AAV deal. It would allow us to keep the kids. Drury clearly exploring every option

 

[JimmyG89]

I agree with most of this.

I was responding to a poster who says we have “too many top 6” forwards.

We have three top 6 forwards. Panarin. Kreider. Zibanejad. Then we have a bunch of kids who we need to give opportunities to in the top 6. They aren’t top 6 F yet. Instead of being given that chance, they are being thrown into trade proposals for more expensive players, despite the team having very limited cap flexibility for the next two seasons.

100% on this. I'm pretty sure the poster was talking about stylistically being top 6 players. Kakko, Lafreniere and Chytil play to a top 6 type of game. They should be doing that. They are young and they have skill, but they showed they're willing to work the corners in the postseason. Signs of maturity in their game.

Those guys do need that opportunity. At 5v5, Kakko was the one forward during the regular season that did get that time. He was predominantly on a line with Panarin and Strome, especially before he got hurt. Just put him back with Panarin and whoever the center is (hopefully Chytil).

Lafreniere got 3rd line minutes. Excelled with Kreider and Zibanejad. Shouldn't need to re-invent the wheel there.

It really comes down to who the team wants at 2C and if it isn't Chytil, what direction they plan on going. The need for more of a checking center is paramount. We saw what a Cirelli and Jordan Staal can do for you come postseason. Finding that match-up center allows the others to be used freely. If Drury can identify who that player is, you will have a lot of flexibility when it comes to building lines and giving your team the best chance to win.

 

[jerseyjinx94]

Forget linemates and analytics and all of that. Just look at raw numbers alone and it tells you the story.

2020-21 Chytil 21 years old 8 G 14 A 22 pts in 41 GP, ATOI 13:14, 0 power play points.

2020-21 Dubois 22 years old 9 G 12 A 21 pts in 46 GP, ATOI 15:02, 6 PPP

Then in 21-22 Chytil plays 67 games, and somehow averages less time on ice than he did the year before (13:11) and his numbers are identical in 26 more games (8-14-22). He has 1 PPP, an assist. A regression, until the playoffs.

Dubois, on the other hand, increases his ice time by nearly 4 minutes per game to 18:55, scores 15 PPG on WPG's top unit. He goes 28-32-60.

How about instead of trading Chytil PLUS additional assets (or wasting Kakko on Dubois and keeping Chytil at 13 minutes per game), we just give Chytil 18:55 of ice time and some power play usage and see what he does.

Yes, I know Dubois had previous years of 48, 61, and 49 pts - in each of those years, he averaged more than 16:30 of ice per game. There's no way to know what Chytil will do unless he gets the run beyond a couple of games. I just don't understand why we would trade Kakko for a Chytil who gets more ice time...

 

[GAGLine]

Here's hoping, but to me it doesn't sound like the kind of thing the league likes to do.

The possibility has already been collectively bargained by the 2 sides in the MOU:

The parties can agree to increase the Upper Limit in excess of $1 Million in order to allow for a smoother transition into the ‘Lag’ formula.

Parties to discuss and approve detailed mechanics and implementation of the ‘Lag’ formula subject to the following general parameters:
o Introduce the ‘Lag’ formula after the Escrow Balance has been repaid but not earlier than establishing the Upper Limit for 2023/24 League Year.

There are some other parameters, but this is the gist of it. They have already agreed that they may increase the cap by more than 1 mil starting in 2023/24.

I have no idea if they will pay off the debt by the end of next season. I doubt it, but if they are close to paying it off, they might decide that they can increase the cap a bit more anyway.

 

[bleedblue94]

Friedman mentioning Malkin to NYR on Rupp’s show. I would take him on a short term reasonable AAV deal. It would allow us to keep the kids. Drury clearly exploring every option

he reportedly didnt want to take 5x3 in pitt. cant see a reasonable short term contract here. seems liek the annual tie nyr to every high profile name, but who knows.

 

[McRanger92]

he reportedly didnt want to take 5x3 in pitt. cant see a reasonable short term contract here. seems liek the annual tie nyr to every high profile name, but who knows.

Always injured too

 

[Thirty One]

The possibility has already been collectively bargained by the 2 sides in the MOU:





There are some other parameters, but this is the gist of it. They have already agreed that they may increase the cap by more than 1 mil starting in 2023/24.

I have no idea if they will pay off the debt by the end of next season. I doubt it, but if they are close to paying it off, they might decide that they can increase the cap a bit more anyway.

I had no idea about this. Now my hopes are up, great.

 

[EdJovanovski]

Panarin - Malkin - Kravtsov
Lafreniere - Zibanejad - Kakko
Kreider - Chytil - Othmann

 

[Synergy27]

Always injured too

LTIR baby. Let’s get some serious cap circumvention going on here.

Sign Malkin to a high AAV one year deal. Get him surgery on something, I dunno, could be anything since he looks like Frankenstein’s monster anyway.

LTIR. Sign Copp. Malkin back for round 1 of the playoffs.

 

[Trxjw]

Not even close because PLD just turned 24. He's about to hit his prime. Zibanejad was 23 and Brassard was 29 when they were swapped. 6 year age difference and it was clear Brassard had peaked in his prime. There's a 1-2 year age difference between PLD and Chytil/Kakko.

If anything, getting PLD just before his prime is like getting Zibanejad just before his prime.

Age isn't really the point.

 

[Machinehead]

Panarin-Nieves-Kravtsov
Kreider-Zibanejad-Lafreniere
Chytil-Malkin-Kakko

 

[Thirty One]

LTIR baby. Let’s get some serious cap circumvention going on here.

Sign Malkin to a high AAV one year deal. Get him surgery on something, I dunno, could be anything since he looks like Frankenstein’s monster anyway.

LTIR. Sign Copp. Malkin back for round 1 of the playoffs.

"Just open him up and move some stuff around, doc."

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

I can’t ever imagine a situation where Malkin joins the Rangers lol

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Malkin would be worse than PLd

 

[GAGLine]

I had no idea about this. Now my hopes are up, great.

 

[zlev]

just wait for PLD to be available at the trade deadline. we only need him for the playoffs anyway. or maybe we wont even need him.