Speculation: Roster Building Thread: New Season Edition

[Clark Kellogg]

Id be assuming we get the 4m bump to the cap. Which would give us 22 million before a goodrow buyout.

An alternative would be to trade him at a deadline. He is a playoff warrior and all NHL G.M. covet guys like him. He should bring back an very good return and if we are willing to retain some salary maybe an excellent return.
NOT saying this would happen but a crazy scenario would be (god forbid) we are out-of-the-money come trade deadline and Seattle somehow keeps rolling and is going to be in, there could be a deal involving a #4OA coming back. Say Blais and Barclay for Othmann’s best bud as a foundation for for a deal.

 

[SA16]

An alternative would be to trade him at a deadline. He is a playoff warrior and all NHL G.M. covet guys like him. He should bring back an very good return and if we are willing to retain some salary maybe an excellent return.
NOT saying this would happen but a crazy scenario would be (god forbid) we are out-of-the-money come trade deadline and Seattle somehow keeps rolling and is going to be in, there could be a deal involving a #4OA coming back. Say Blais and Barclay for Othmann’s best bud as a foundation for for a deal.

He most likely has negative value with his contract.

 

[IDvsEGO]

An alternative would be to trade him at a deadline. He is a playoff warrior and all NHL G.M. covet guys like him. He should bring back an very good return and if we are willing to retain some salary maybe an excellent return.
NOT saying this would happen but a crazy scenario would be (god forbid) we are out-of-the-money come trade deadline and Seattle somehow keeps rolling and is going to be in, there could be a deal involving a #4OA coming back. Say Blais and Barclay for Othmann’s best bud as a foundation for for a deal.

Moving someone like goodrow at the deadline is a bad move for a team thats in contention.
Thats a morale killer.

Also Why the F are we adding wright to this lineup?
Where are we adding wright to this lineup?

Seattle isn't trading wright (a potential foundation piece), for goodrow, during a midseason run. Even if he's not playing for them now.

I get that this is HF and everyone's all about futures, but we just had "we didnt play them in the top 6 and let them suck and then get better", with kakko and laf, and now theyre looking good after 3 years. I'd rather not do that all over again with Wright.

We don't need someone like wright with Chytil showing he's probably a middle 6 now (potentially topping out as a 1c if he takes one more step).

The roster we have, is likely going to be the roster we run with into the playoffs, and goodrow is moved/bought out maybe after the season.
Also remember goodrow has a modified 15 team no trade clause. So he has to approve a move. Likely he would not want to move during the season and would wait till after the season.

 

[NYR Viper]

The concern, for me, isn't Goodrow. He is being used all over the place with guys who are underachieving. Scour the free agent bin for a couple of guys who can skate well and get in on the forecheck and pair them with Goodrow.

No more buyouts.

 

[Avery16]

We shouldn’t be looking to improve the 4th line. If Goodrow can’t produce with Blais and Gauthier, then that’s an indictment of all three and Goodrow at the least should go for a cheaper alternative.

 

[IDvsEGO]

We shouldn’t be looking to improve the 4th line. If Goodrow can’t produce with Blais and Gauthier, then that’s an indictment of all three and Goodrow at the least should go for a cheaper alternative.

Why are we looking for "production" from our fourth line. That feels like a misunderstanding of a fourth line.
I dont care if the fourth line puts up 0 goals for 82 games. The point is to pin the other team in their zone, and wear down their d pairs.
You get some goals from exhausted defenseman in those scenario's but theyre secondary. because it opens up scoring for your next 3 lines.

 

[IDvsEGO]

Then show me the math behind that. I'd like to see your numbers on Chytil, Miller, and LaF deals @ 6-8 years. I'm thinking your numbers are going to be unrealistically low for those terms and you still need to sign an additional (bare minimum) 6 players beyond that including Kravtsov and Jones. Those deals at those terms don't get done without someone waiving an NMC.

Capfriendly is bugging on me and not letting me add another C or goalie, but ive got 1.9M to add both.
At league min those deals would still give us a tiny amount of cap room.

Laf got 8x8
Chytil got 4.5 x 6 (a smaller version of the pasta deal - considering he put up nowhere near pasta's numbers)
and miller got the skjei deal - 5.25 x 5

It gives us cap flexibility as the cap rises, we extend kakko similarly.
We then have the ability to add to the roster after 1-2 cap jumps.

 

[Avery16]

Why are we looking for "production" from our fourth line. That feels like a misunderstanding of a fourth line.
I dont care if the fourth line puts up 0 goals for 82 games. The point is to pin the other team in their zone, and wear down their d pairs.
You get some goals from exhausted defenseman in those scenario's but theyre secondary. because it opens up scoring for your next 3 lines.

Okay… if Goodrow can’t do that with players like Blais and Gauthier, each with physical attributes but also offense projections, then maybe we should move on from Goodrow.

But if your 4th line is putting up 0 goals in 82 games, you aren’t contending for anything.

 

[IDvsEGO]

Okay… if Goodrow can’t do that with players like Blais and Gauthier, each with physical attributes but also offense projections, then maybe we should move on from Goodrow.

But if your 4th line is putting up 0 goals in 82 games, you aren’t contending for anything.

I don’t disagree with the last point. But goals from that line are secondary to possession itself, or forcing turnovers. Which the line did in spades last night.

 

[MrAlmost]

Goodrow will not be traded or bought out. Let's see if the line last night can keep it up.

 

[MrAlmost]

View attachment 606513


Capfriendly is bugging on me and not letting me add another C or goalie, but ive got 1.9M to add both.
At league min those deals would still give us a tiny amount of cap room.

Laf got 8x8
Chytil got 4.5 x 6 (a smaller version of the pasta deal - considering he put up nowhere near pasta's numbers)
and miller got the skjei deal - 5.25 x 5

It gives us cap flexibility as the cap rises, we extend kakko similarly.
We then have the ability to add to the roster after 1-2 cap jumps.

That isn't 1.9m for both. That's 1.9m for a 4th line center, a 13th forward, a 7th D and a backup goalie.

Also, why on earth would anyone give Laf 8x8? Did I miss a PPG season or something? If he gets a bigger contract, it is likely in the Mackinnon neighborhood and even then that's only if he absolutely erupts for the rest of the year. Otherwise, most nights he is a non-factor.

I like the Miller deal, but if he doesn't put up any points this year we can probably sign him for less. Chytil needs to stay healthy, but if he does that would probably be a good contract too.

 

[haohmaru]

View attachment 606513


Capfriendly is bugging on me and not letting me add another C or goalie, but ive got 1.9M to add both.
At league min those deals would still give us a tiny amount of cap room.

Laf got 8x8
Chytil got 4.5 x 6 (a smaller version of the pasta deal - considering he put up nowhere near pasta's numbers)
and miller got the skjei deal - 5.25 x 5

It gives us cap flexibility as the cap rises, we extend kakko similarly.
We then have the ability to add to the roster after 1-2 cap jumps.

Yeah, it works if you have 3-5 guys who have never played an NHL game on your roster and no plan for them if they crash and burn. You need to sign a backup G (1M), another forward (750K at least) and a depth forward (750K at least) and a 7th D (another 750K at minimum). That's fringe NHL players, 1.3M above your numbers, and unrealistic. The Rangers aren't going into a contending season with 6+ fringe players/rookies in their lineup.

They are in a heck of a pickle unless they bridge and make verbal promises for later.

Like I said, the only realistic way to sign all of these guys to long term 6+ year contracts is to get one of the NMC's to waive. If the escrow isn't paid, though, that takes 3M out of the equation and makes everything even more difficult.

I think you're being generous with the LaF contract - I think that would be less unless he really explodes this season. Miller is fair. Chytil might be low (if he stays healthy, he'll command more than that IMHO).

I'd love to retain everyone, but this might be a Buch situation where one of these guys gets moved because there isn't enough $ there to retain them all.

 

[Rangers in 7]

the obsession on this board to get rid of goodrow is hilarious....if the cap goes up 4 mil hes not getting moved, if the cap doesn't go up 4 mil hes not getting moved

lets just get over this moving of Barclay, ESPECIALLY during the season. the rangers are going to be pushing for a playoff spot and should be in. we are not trading a player that can play all over the lineup, kill penalties, win faceoffs, and is a leader

 

[SA16]

Goodrow can not play all over the lineup.

 

[Clark Kellogg]

Moving someone like goodrow at the deadline is a bad move for a team thats in contention.
Thats a morale killer.

Also Why the F are we adding wright to this lineup?
Where are we adding wright to this lineup?

Seattle isn't trading wright (a potential foundation piece), for goodrow, during a midseason run. Even if he's not playing for them now.

I get that this is HF and everyone's all about futures, but we just had "we didnt play them in the top 6 and let them suck and then get better", with kakko and laf, and now theyre looking good after 3 years. I'd rather not do that all over again with Wright.

We don't need someone like wright with Chytil showing he's probably a middle 6 now (potentially topping out as a 1c if he takes one more step).

The roster we have, is likely going to be the roster we run with into the playoffs, and goodrow is moved/bought out maybe after the season.
Also remember goodrow has a modified 15 team no trade clause. So he has to approve a move. Likely he would not want to move during the season and would wait till after the season.

I emphasized “NOT”.
Responding to a post that said to “buy out Goodrow”
I don’t want to buy out Goodrow, I’m happy he is a Ranger and love his game and his impact on his teammates. He had a career year last season.
If we did trade for Wright (who appears to be having adjustment issues or maybe he’s not ready) I would return him to Kingston and have him start next season in Hartford on a line with Othmann.
Barclay Goodrow’s no trade team list was already registered with the league back in July, that’s how it works. So he only has to approve a trade if one of the teams that the Rangers want to trade him to is on that list.

 

[Boris Zubov]

I emphasized “NOT”.
Responding to a post that said to “buy out Goodrow”
I don’t want to buy out Goodrow, I’m happy he is a Ranger and love his game and his impact on his teammates. He had a career year last season.
If we did trade for Wright (who appears to be having adjustment issues or maybe he’s not ready) I would return him to Kingston and have him start next season in Hartford on a line with Othmann.
Barclay Goodrow’s no trade team list was already registered with the league back in July, that’s how it works. So he only has to approve a trade if one of the teams that the Rangers want to trade him to is on that list.

That's not how a NTC works...They need him to waive in order to send him to a team he has on his "No" list. They can trade him to any team that's not on that list without his approval.

 

[tlk]

So jealous of Vegas bc of Eichel

he's really giving it to the "experts"

 

[Boris Zubov]

So jealous of Vegas bc of Eichel

he's really giving it to the "experts"

He's playing with two excellent linemates that really suit his game.

 

[tlk]

He's playing with two excellent linemates that really suit his game.

imagine a centre spine of Zib - Eich - Fil
impossible I know((

 

[DanielBrassard]

View attachment 606513


Capfriendly is bugging on me and not letting me add another C or goalie, but ive got 1.9M to add both.
At league min those deals would still give us a tiny amount of cap room.

Laf got 8x8
Chytil got 4.5 x 6 (a smaller version of the pasta deal - considering he put up nowhere near pasta's numbers)
and miller got the skjei deal - 5.25 x 5

It gives us cap flexibility as the cap rises, we extend kakko similarly.
We then have the ability to add to the roster after 1-2 cap jumps.

Won't have to worry about giving Lafreniere anywhere close to 8M, so they would have more than enough space to fill out the roster in your scenario.

 

[Profet]

Every team needs 4th liners that actually have the skill to be plugged into the top 9 when needed.

Dominic Moore comes to mind.

Quote is from the GDT but with that closed, I'll respond here.

This is 100% true. But this isn't 4th liners plugging into the top 6 when needed... This is a fourth liner playing on the top line with a 100% healthy team.

Let's not confuse someone temporarily playing above their position due to roster injuries with someone playing above their position because of a lack of depth at that position.

 

[Avery16]

So jealous of Vegas bc of Eichel

he's really giving it to the "experts"

Look, who exactly knew that hockey could be played without a neck?

 

[Fitzy]

Quote is from the GDT but with that closed, I'll respond here.

This is 100% true. But this isn't 4th liners plugging into the top 6 when needed... This is a fourth liner playing on the top line with a 100% healthy team.

Let's not confuse someone temporarily playing above their position due to roster injuries with someone playing above their position because of a lack of depth at that position.

For sure.

I think the issue for us is that NYR were hoping one of Goodrow/Blais could be in the top 9 consistently to keep Vesey on the 4th, but Blais has not shown us anything.

Even with Kravtsov healthy and playing well we don’t have a “complete” top 9 yet.

 

[IDvsEGO]

I think the issue for us is that NYR were hoping one of Goodrow/Blais could be in the top 9 consistently to keep Vesey on the 4th, but Blais has not shown us anything.

Even with Kravtsov healthy and playing well we don’t have a “complete” top 9 yet.

I mean I understand the point you're trying to make, but then you could also say the maple leafs don't have a complete top 6 with bunting on the first line.
Or Edmonton doesn't have a complete top 6 with Puljujarvi on the first line.

Good teams will have mediocre players in their top 6/9 because they have 2 players capable of still carrying the line and carrying play. We did it with panarin/strome/blackwell, and panarin/strome/goodrow.

Theres literally dozens of examples of mediocre players getting carried on the top line to a championship, then cashing in on a different team.
If Vesey who has a career high of 20 goals (while playing shit D), somehow figures out how to score 20 this year on that line (while playing good D). I'll have absolutely no issue with him there if we keep scoring.

This concept that we need all-stars at every position is missing the forest for the trees. We need a deep team and sometimes you get that by playing someone above their head.

 

[NYR Viper]

People shit on Goodrow but if we recall, he was still recovering from some sort of injury at the beginning of training camp and he had 33 points in 79 games last year. He has 7 points in 15 games this year while playing ~2 1/2 minutes less per game so far. He's not going to put up 60 points but if he hovers around 30-35 points and slots around the lineup as well as being a primary PKer, he's doing his job.

The issue I am seeing is not the Vesey's or Goodrow's, it's that the team is hoping Blais will round into form as he gains more strength in his legs and is continually counting on Carpenter and Gauthier/Reaves. With Blais clearly not 100% that's an entire line of bottom-6 forwards either spinning their wheels or not capable of better play.

This is also why the occasional good game from Gauthier is so profound because his emergence would allow for the bottom-6 to either have a pretty decent 3rd line or spread out to have (2) good bottom-6 players on each line.