Speculation: Roster Building Thread LXXXVIII: 3-2-1 TDL almost here!

[NYSPORTS]

I dont know man.

He isn't McDavid, Crosby, Ovechkin level talent. I dont care what his eye test is. The numbers on him do not add up to that level of return. I'd even say, his salary is too high as well. Add in his commitment and attitude?

Not saying I wouldn't love to add him to the stable. But the Cons outweigh the Pros. And frankly, a guy like him isn't Captain material. He needs an established, strong willed vet in front of him. Kids ego is too much and the know-how isn't there to lead others.

Maybe he respects Quinn? IDK their BU relationship.

Karlsson, Stone returns IMO are ballpark what to expect. I dont value his contract term in the "Pros" column, for the many reasons I stated above.

i don’t want him either. Especially with this Covid cap. Zibby is back and he will cost a fortune. Can’t lock up so many players and then expect to pay Fox, Laf and Kakko in the future. Not to mention all these other kids.

I’d rather trade or over pay prospect wise for a less talented and less costly player. Literally a Strome type not on the edge of a larger contract. Would love to sell Strome high but if that means bringing in Eichel for a fortune i’ll ride Strome’s contract into the ground.

 

[Oscar Lindberg]

The problem I see with a Strome trade is you look at his numbers and think he could bring back something useful long term. But then when you go to other teams for offers they don’t reflect that

I think if you’re lucky he could bring back a mid/late round first in this years draft. And with this draft being pretty weak I’m not sure how appealing that is.

I don’t know it’s a tough situation. I definitely would be against committing to him long term though

 

[RGY]

Rangers will 100% be going for a cup this decade. They're still in the convo with Panarin missing 10+ Games in the toughest division. Youngest team in the league 2 years in a row. They have had a top 3 prospect pool for 2 years now. The cupboards are stacked to the brim. It's an embarrassment of riches. The current kids will get older and mature next year. This team isn't far off.

If you want to be in a perpetual rebuild and constantly trade solid NHL players in there prime for picks and prospects I'd suggest the Sabres board.

They. Are. Not. Cup. Contenders. This. Year.

Even if Panarin did not miss time and Zibanejad had a better start they were not going to be cup contenders. And they very likely wont be next year either.

Trading one veteran who has an expiring contract next year and has a strong possibility of not being a longterm piece is not advocating being in a perpetual rebuild. Please be less dramatic. Thanks.

 

[EpicDing]

I’m not sure how much we do now vs. during the offseason.

I think getting the vaccine yesterday was extremely risky as it might seriously impact their play today. If we lose 2 of the next 3 and Boston wins at least 2 of their next 3, I think we have to be Pete. We’re already facing an uphill battle and this season was always meant to be a rebuilding year. Maybe a team might seriously overpay for our assets.

The players' long term health comes before winning.

I can't believe we're questioning the decision to get the team vaccinated.

 

[MysticLeviathan]

The players' long term health comes before winning.

I can't believe we're questioning the decision to get the team vaccinated.

you don’t do it the day before a game. you do it when you have 2 days between a game, like this past Sunday. Have Monday as a recovery day, then you bet set for Tuesday.

 

[Flan the incredible]

Who said trade Strome for “next to nothing”? A 1st and a quality prospect is not nothing in the grand scheme of a rebuild and when the team has no Center depth in their prospect system.

The message it sends? Its a young team that has a bigger picture longterm. Its a message to someone like Chytil to step up. Let the kids make the push for the playoffs, they are the future.

The Rangers are 5 points behind Boston. Boston has 2 games in hand and arent even 100% right now. They have quite a few games against Buffalo and Philly upcoming. I think its a false sense of hope to think the Rangers will make the playoffs. And IF they just barely get in, they still have too many holes. They arent taking down the top teams in the East. They are weak down the middle. They have an awful 3rd pair. Their bottom 6 has been mediocre, in part due to inexperience, line combos, and ice time. Strome isn’t propelling this team any further than its destined to be. But the longterm benefits could be impactful in what you get for Strome.

5 behind Boston, with 18 games remaining.

9 behind Pittsburgh.

I dont see the complete collapse happening for those teams. Rangers would have to go on the best hot streak of any team this season.

There was literally posts before this season started and in the beginning of the season for a 2nd round pick. Fans of this team and on this board wanted him gone. You had some fans here say to not even sign him.

The Ranger front office signed Panarin and Kreider for what? So we can have a prospect at every position? It's not reality. I know this site values prospects and picks over good NHL players but its a pipe dream to think Rangers are trading almost a PPG center in a position that you even admit is weak for a late 1st and a prospect. You are dreaming

As for the playoffs who knows if they make it or not. If they go on a hotstreak anything is possible I guess. Whats our record vs Washington? I been watching hockey way too long to know and to say whats going to happen. Am I saying they will win the cup absolutely not. Can they still get in? Yes sure. Can they win a round sure who knows. The fact this board thinks they know is hysterical.

 

[Flan the incredible]

One of the weirder things I've seen was someone complaining about Strome having a point scoring streak because "he doesn't deserve it."

The hate that this board has for its own players is amazing. Other teams inflate their players values this board destroys them. Nothing will ever compare to the hate Hank got but the Strome and Kreider hate on here is and has been getting ridiculous.

 

[EpicDing]

you don’t do it the day before a game. you do it when you have 2 days between a game, like this past Sunday. Have Monday as a recovery day, then you bet set for Tuesday.

You do it when you can secure vaccines.

 

[NYR Viper]

The players' long term health comes before winning.

I can't believe we're questioning the decision to get the team vaccinated.

You do it when you can secure vaccines.

I am not sure how smart it is for an entire organization to get them simultaneously though. Perhaps half this week and half next week?

I mean if I owned a business and had 20 senior techs required for my business to run, I think I would probably space out the vaccines a bit just to make sure I don't end up with 20 guys out at the same time and my business shutting down.

Although I could see the opposite where would you rather be down and out for 3 days or at half speed for 6...

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Looking at it objectively, I struggle to see how the NYR are going to provide the types of opportunities players like Kakko, Lafreniere, perhaps Kravtsov, and perhaps Chytil are going to rightly deserve - hopefully over the next ~season or so - without moving out some bodies.

All these kids need to work on their games, but if we are being objective they are also quite blocked on the depth chart. And the vast majority of coaches are going to defer to giving opportunity to the veteran players.

PP1 - Panarin, Kreider, Zibanejad or his replacement, Fox are locked in here. That's one spot open over the short/medium term, meaning likely that at most one of Kakko/Lafreniere get an opportunity. Then factor in Strome and Buchnevich still being on the roster. Sure, maybe Kakko could take Kreider's spot, and Lafreniere could take Strome's spot...but then they are paying Kreider/Strome based on production that includes more PP time than they would currently be getting. I.e. diminished value both on the trade market and to the org in terms of $ / point production. I.e. Trouba.

In an ideal world Buchnevich should be the guy they keep, and Kreider should be moved due to the relative depth between LW/RW. But that's not really realistic for obvious reasons. I fully expect Buch to be the odd man out. They need to free up the depth chart a bit, and paying Buch based on peak production in this short season when we know he is not going to be on PP1 anytime soon seems like bad $ allocation. Some team should offer something really good for him. NYR will have a really good "story" when shopping him - he's a great player.

 

[Kocur Dill]

i don’t want him either. Especially with this Covid cap. Zibby is back and he will cost a fortune. Can’t lock up so many players and then expect to pay Fox, Laf and Kakko in the future. Not to mention all these other kids.

I’d rather trade or over pay prospect wise for a less talented and less costly player. Literally a Strome type not on the edge of a larger contract. Would love to sell Strome high but if that means bringing in Eichel for a fortune i’ll ride Strome’s contract into the ground.

With our assets depth, there is no reason to put all our eggs in the Eichel basket, when we could target and call up a team with a 2c that plays all 3 zones, gets FO wins, and can pot 50+pts with room to grow and plant him behind Zibanejad for the near term. And that player would cost far less than Eichel.

We have the wing talent and the D and Goaltending are our strength. Get us winning draws to control the zone,, and defensively strong in the middle, to utilize and unbridle the speed and talent we have on the wings.

I get the sense Lindholm is off the table, but there has to be like wise players out there and a team that could use a few of the chips we have.

 

[LORDE]

IDK about that, but also consider that some people (even healthy people) get reactions to the shot. Seems like younger, healthier people get more of a reaction because of their active immune systems.

Your post mentioned arms... side effects? After 2nd shot? Maybe. But looks like they received the J&J which is one and done.

I was referring to the "pain" in the arm.

Everyone I know (self and fiancee included) who got Moderna felt it in the arm for sure a few hrs later... but again, I am not Mr. Tough guy and I could've played hockey that night no prob... mowed the lawn in fact.

This isn't to say everyone is the same but pro athletes can certainly play through the pain.

 

[eco's bones]

Strome and Panarin work well together and it’s very questionable to me whether Chytil is ready to move up to 2C. Whatever one thinks about the Rangers chances of contending by next year the time will be up as far as our being a non-playoff team. Next year that will be unacceptable. We have an elite player in Panarin and one who may be getting there in Fox. We have enough quality vets and some of the best young players in the game including two lottery picks. We have a seriously good starting goaltender and an improving defense. The excuses run out at the end of this season. I would not advocate for selling or trading off our own top draft picks but we should not be moving productive players for futures at this point and certainly not for picks in an underwhelming draft year.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Your post mentioned arms... side effects? After 2nd shot? Maybe. But looks like they received the J&J which is one and done.

I was referring to the "pain" in the arm.

Everyone I know (self and fiancee included) who got Moderna felt it in the arm for sure a few hrs later... but again, I am not Mr. Tough guy and I could've played hockey that night no prob... mowed there lawn in fact.

This isn't to say everyone is the same but pro athletes can certainly play through the pain.

A simple dose of Tylenol will do the trick for anyone who has significant arm pain.

 

[EpicDing]

I am not sure how smart it is for an entire organization to get them simultaneously though. Perhaps half this week and half next week?

I mean if I owned a business and had 20 senior techs required for my business to run, I think I would probably space out the vaccines a bit just to make sure I don't end up with 20 guys out at the same time and my business shutting down.

Although I could see the opposite where would you rather be down and out for 3 days or at half speed for 6...

I wholeheartedly disagree. The sooner everyone is vaccinated, hockey players or no, the better.

 

[LORDE]

Here's the thing about Strome & Buch...

Are they pieces you win a cup with? If yes... you keep them. If no, you deal them.

Of course $ factors in, but honestly not that much.

I am not advocating a trade for Eichel here... or a trade at all for that matter... you don't just deal them for the sake of it.

The Kreider contract (term, $ and clauses) really forces our hand on one of them tho... and probably the one who isn't a center (read between the lines here)

 

[GAGLine]

If we move Strome, we need an actionable plan in place to provide us with another option at center, an option not named Chytil. I'm all for giving Chytil a shot at 2C to see what he can do with it, but I don't want to put all our eggs in that basket.

Whether that means we trade Strome for a center, or we have another deal in the works to acquire one, I don't care. But we need to bring in someone if we are moving Strome out.

More than likely, we aren't bringing in his replacement at the deadline, which means he more than likely isn't getting traded at the deadline. It makes more sense all around to do something like that post expansion draft, when other teams don't have to worry about protection slots.

 

[frozenrubber]

I am not sure how smart it is for an entire organization to get them simultaneously though. Perhaps half this week and half next week?

I mean if I owned a business and had 20 senior techs required for my business to run, I think I would probably space out the vaccines a bit just to make sure I don't end up with 20 guys out at the same time and my business shutting down.

Although I could see the opposite where would you rather be down and out for 3 days or at half speed for 6...

It's better to get all the players vaccinated in a single batch. The risks of leaving players unvaccinated overwhelms all upside of a delayed distribution table. Also, losing a single game 10-0 is better than losing two+ games 3-2.

Obviously a small sample size of two in my household, but experienced noticeable malaise for 1-2 days in both the mRNA and the J&J vaccine.

There is a good chance we may be looking at a 'flu' game tonight where the team may be lethargic. But I burn a single game anytime opposed to the nightmare of where it's easier to list who DOESN'T have COVID in Vancouver than who does.

Bonus value in selling a vaccinated Smith to a Canadian division team

 

[IDvsEGO]

I am not sure how smart it is for an entire organization to get them simultaneously though. Perhaps half this week and half next week?

I mean if I owned a business and had 20 senior techs required for my business to run, I think I would probably space out the vaccines a bit just to make sure I don't end up with 20 guys out at the same time and my business shutting down.

Although I could see the opposite where would you rather be down and out for 3 days or at half speed for 6...

So you tell 5 of your team to get vaccinated on Monday, and even though you’ve secured 20 shots, you’re making a decision as to who gets the shot earlier, which could open a private business to liability. you’re also failing to account for the fact that those individuals who don’t get the shot can still get Covid while waiting on the vaccine.

Far better to remove that risk, get the vaccine and deal with the side effects for a single game, than risk long term consequences.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

If we move Strome, we need an actionable plan in place to provide us with another option at center, an option not named Chytil. I'm all for giving Chytil a shot at 2C to see what he can do with it, but I don't want to put all our eggs in that basket.

Whether that means we trade Strome for a center, or we have another deal in the works to acquire one, I don't care. But we need to bring in someone if we are moving Strome out.

More than likely, we aren't bringing in his replacement at the deadline, which means he more than likely isn't getting traded at the deadline. It makes more sense all around to do something like that post expansion draft, when other teams don't have to worry about protection slots.

If they move Strome, I don't think they should, it might not return his immediate replacement. Maybe they give Chytil the rest of the year as 2C, which should give them enough time to evaluate him. If it doesn't look like he's the guy, they can make a move this summer, they'll have plenty of ammo to do so (including whatever assets they get back from Strome).

 

[cheech70]

If they move Strome, I don't think they should, it might not return his immediate replacement. Maybe they give Chytil the rest of the year as 2C, which should give them enough time to evaluate him. If it doesn't look like he's the guy, they can make a move this summer, they'll have plenty of ammo to do so (including whatever assets they get back from Strome).

If Strome is willing to stay at average of 5-6 mil for 4-5 yrs he may be a valuable top 9. The logjam is on the right wing. Its weird but the trade that stands out is Kakko. I keep Buch who has figured it out. I really like Vitaly and I think Gauthier is a player. So Kakko has the pedigree to satisfy a blockbuster.

 

[GAGLine]

If they move Strome, I don't think they should, it might not return his immediate replacement. Maybe they give Chytil the rest of the year as 2C, which should give them enough time to evaluate him. If it doesn't look like he's the guy, they can make a move this summer, they'll have plenty of ammo to do so (including whatever assets they get back from Strome).

I wouldn't expect Strome to bring back his replacement. He doesn't have that kind of value. Nor would I expect that whatever assets we get back in a Strome trade would be sufficient to pry his replacement away from a 3rd team. More than likely, we will have to use other assets to get the deal done. That said, I don't want to move Strome without having some plan in place for replacing him. We could move him for a late 1st + B prospect, then not be able to swing a deal to replace him, and end up with even less options at center than we have now. I don't want the Rangers to be forced into a bad deal, or into grabbing a different stopgap player.

I get the desire to trade him now, because his value is high, but between Covid and the looming expansion draft, I don't see many teams making moves. We have also seen that it is a buyer's market right now, so the return on Strome probably won't be that great anyway. Post expansion draft is the best time to figure this all out, IMO.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

There is really no need to make decision on Buch or Strome now.

Personally, I don't think either guys are players you get through the playoffs with, particularly Strome. If they extend both, then the FO should really trade the kids for trusty vets that Quinn loves so much. They'll never get the opportunity to fully develop here and if your goal is to win now, players who will actually play and fill roles will give you a better chance than talented players who won't get a chance to and don't necessarily do certain things as well.

Now I think Buch and Strome should be used to return those type of players, but if they're going to commit to them, that means someone else has to go out.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

I wouldn't expect Strome to bring back his replacement. He doesn't have that kind of value. Nor would I expect that whatever assets we get back in a Strome trade would be sufficient to pry his replacement away from a 3rd team. More than likely, we will have to use other assets to get the deal done. That said, I don't want to move Strome without having some plan in place for replacing him. We could move him for a late 1st + B prospect, then not be able to swing a deal to replace him, and end up with even less options at center than we have now. I don't want the Rangers to be forced into a bad deal, or into grabbing a different stopgap player.

I get the desire to trade him now, because his value is high, but between Covid and the looming expansion draft, I don't see many teams making moves. We have also seen that it is a buyer's market right now, so the return on Strome probably won't be that great anyway. Post expansion draft is the best time to figure this all out, IMO.

It's going to be difficult to trade that kind of production away, you'll never get equal value back. Especially from a guy that plays so well with the team's best forward.

 

[cheech70]

It's going to be difficult to trade that kind of production away, you'll never get equal value back. Especially from a guy that plays so well with the team's best forward.

And to think that you can throw anyone next to Artemi and get the same results is false. K2 and Bread haven't meshed. Strome and Bread as a pair are pretty elite.