Speculation: Roster Building Thread LXXXII: Stepping up in a Perfect Storm?

[bl02]

Just asking for this "elite" prospect to get some time on the ice where he has some time and space. This f***ing division is filled with teams that just suffocate you 5 on 5.

 

[bl02]

While Laf’s underlying powerplay numbers surely aren’t inspiring (most likely a by-product of small sample sizes), I do think it’s worth giving him the chance to run that unit through the left circle. Blackwell is probably there to keep the same set-up with Panarin out, but I wonder if we might be better off trying something similar with how TOR uses Matthews and Marner. Matthews is technically their left pointman in their first unit, but he rotates a lot between being above and in the left circle. Marner is used in the same way we use Strome, but I’d rather have Mika there.


That set-up forces a lot of play laterally across the slot, allows us to shift Kreider side-to-side as the net-front screen, and forces us to start shooting from both sides of the ice. Will it happen? Probably not, but it could be an interesting setup until Panarin returns. When he’s back, there’s really no reason they don’t use an umbrella setup with RHS and LHS option at the left and right circle, respectively. Zib can play the bumper and be a mid-slot shot option.

This is what I want when healthy:
Kreider
Panarin-Mika-Buch/Kakko/Laf
Fox

I think this makes total sense but unfortunately if he can't even get pp time over Blackwell he sure isn't gonna get it over Buch/Strome/Blackwell when everyone is healthy.

 

[duhmetreE]

While Laf’s underlying powerplay numbers surely aren’t inspiring (most likely a by-product of small sample sizes), I do think it’s worth giving him the chance to run that unit through the left circle. Blackwell is probably there to keep the same set-up with Panarin out, but I wonder if we might be better off trying something similar with how TOR uses Matthews and Marner. Matthews is technically their left pointman in their first unit, but he rotates a lot between being above and in the left circle. Marner is used in the same way we use Strome, but I’d rather have Mika there.


That set-up forces a lot of play laterally across the slot, allows us to shift Kreider side-to-side as the net-front screen, and forces us to start shooting from both sides of the ice. Will it happen? Probably not, but it could be an interesting setup until Panarin returns. When he’s back, there’s really no reason they don’t use an umbrella setup with RHS and LHS option at the left and right circle, respectively. Zib can play the bumper and be a mid-slot shot option.

This is what I want when healthy:
Kreider
Panarin-Mika-Buch/Kakko/Laf
Fox

That's what I've been clamoring for. Even Miller on the right dot.

I think a player like Laf would excel greatly in the bumper position.. now and long into his future.

 

[NYRangers16]

Don't they know that you could not possibly be more sheltered than powerplay? Your team is going to be getting 85% of the shots.

Like...they don't know this?

Oh I agree completely and it drives me nuts, especially with Panarin out. Instead, Blackwell is on the PP... which if we were actually competetive might be excusable if someone were struggling.

This whole, “let’s compete but also develop the kids” plan is awful. It’s trying to thread a needle at the expense of both.

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

Why not have both? Great that DQ is giving him top line minutes but why not real pp time over two guys who are ok and we already know what they are.

Because maybe that's where they think he's best served at this exact moment. It's clearly not because someone else is blocking him. Maybe they just feel this is better for him right now. I don't know. But people losing their minds over this or convincing themselves they are ruining this prospect is the absolute height of dumbf***ery.

 

[bl02]

Because maybe that's where they think he's best served at this exact moment. It's clearly not because someone else is blocking him. Maybe they just feel this is better for him right now. I don't know. But people losing their minds over this or convincing themselves they are ruining this prospect is the absolute height of dumbf***ery.

I personally never once said ruining him but if you would have told me after getting Lafreniere that he would not even be seeing powerplay time over the likes of Blackwell and Strome then I would say for sure we aren't giving the kid all the opportunities needed to Flourish.

 

[NYRangers16]

No it’s because Tob correctly points out all the reasons why Quinn has not been as successful as you desperately want him to be. I hate to break this to you but Quinn isn’t going to be your friend. He doesn’t know who you are.

Does anyone honestly want him as their friend at this point?

 

[Pawnee Rangers]

I personally never once said ruining him but if you would have told me after getting Lafreniere that he would not even be seeing powerplay time over the likes of Blackwell and Strome then I would say for sure we aren't giving the kid all the opportunities needed to Flourish.

Not saying you specifically, but this place has become page after page of "they're ruining Laf." It's silly. I'm not a Quinn lover, they can fire him tomorrow and I wouldn't care, but that fact that even with all the injuries they still aren't playing him on PP1 indicates, to me at least, that he's not doing something they want him to do or they want him to work on something specific. Hardly the end of the world. Actually, I like that they are taking this approach with him. The kid will get no shortage of opportunities. Would it even shock you to see him on PP1 at some point tonight.

 

[DanielBrassard]

I'm as big a fan of Blackwell as anyone, and even I can't understand the insistence to defend Quinn's decision. Chytil, Panarin, Kakko, and ADA are all out of the lineup and we still can't see the #1 overall draft pick get an opportunity on the top PP unit. That is insane.

 

[bobbop]

I think this team/locker room needs an Alpha-type personality. Unless I am missing someone, I only see Babcock as that type.

I honestly would love a Gallant/Martin combo.

If and when Quinn gets whacked, just remember this will still be a very young team with a mandate to develop young players. Look, I'm intrigued by Gallant because of what happened in Vegas but was that because it was more of a veteran team? I don't know if Gallant is the right coach for that situation.

One guy I think may be considered for a second chance is Jim Montgomery.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

I'm as big a fan of Blackwell as anyone, and even I can't understand the insistence to defend Quinn's decision. Chytil, Panarin, Kakko, and ADA are all out of the lineup and we still can't see the #1 overall draft pick get an opportunity on the top PP unit. That is insane.

He's the new Howden.

Like I said in another thread, at least he's pretty good?

 

[duhmetreE]

If and when Quinn gets whacked, just remember this will still be a very young team with a mandate to develop young players. Look, I'm intrigued by Gallant because of what happened in Vegas but was that because it was more of a veteran team? I don't know if Gallant is the right coach for that situation.

One guy I think may be considered for a second chance is Jim Montgomery.

I love how Montgomery had Dallas playing. I'm all for it. He's young as well.

Vegas was young-ish when Gallant took over and a lot of those 'misfits' had career years. I think Gallant and Martin could be a good duo.

IMO it's a young mans game. It's all about speed and skill.. I think good coaching and structure will be as important as ever, as teams get younger.

 

[RangersFan1994]

He's the new Howden.

Like I said in another thread, at least he's pretty good?

he knows at age 27 it his last chance to be an NHL regular. next year he will be Paul Carey and will most likely be out of the league why does this team continue to force AHL depth players in their Rangers lineup.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

Colin Blackwell is a much better player than Paul Carey and actually belongs in this league.

I wouldn't be giving him PP time over Laf either (that is a Quinn thing if ever there was one) but lets not discredit CB, he's a good player.

 

[GAGLine]

Not sure why playing Blackwell on PP1 and Lafreniere on PP2 is bad for morale. Who's morale? The players? The fans? So far Blackwell has made more shit happen.

Stop trying to confuse people with logic.

 

[UnSandvich]

If and when Quinn gets whacked, just remember this will still be a very young team with a mandate to develop young players. Look, I'm intrigued by Gallant because of what happened in Vegas but was that because it was more of a veteran team? I don't know if Gallant is the right coach for that situation.

One guy I think may be considered for a second chance is Jim Montgomery.

I think the bigger thing with Montgomery is making sure HE is ready for the second chance. Coaching a NY sports team is probably an extremely stressful job, and I don't know that he'd be ready for that stress so immediately. It could potentially cause a relapse, and I'd hate to see something like that happen

EDIT: From a purely hockey standpoint though, I'd be happy with a Montgomery hire though

 

[East Coast Bias]

Laf is gonna come out on the PP1 tonight and everyone will have spent a full day discussing a practice look vince tweeted

 

[True Blue]

No it’s because Tob correctly points out all the reasons why Quinn has not been as successful as you desperately want him to be. I hate to break this to you but Quinn isn’t going to be your friend. He doesn’t know who you are.

Tob pointed out that both Fox and Miller came to the Rangers fully formed. Do you agree?

If yes, then please answer these two very easy quetions:
1) Did you know that at the time of the trade that Fox was already borderline elite level defenseman?
2) Was Miller developed in Wisconsin?

 

[True Blue]

You are all over the place...

The decision/strategy/formula to develop our kids, comes with the directive that they cant play on PP1?? what? How did you come to that conclusion? How would PP1 time hurt their development? Kakko started on PP1 last year. He played well and was taken off for some reason I cant remember. Lafreniere looks much better than Kakko did for the majority of last season.

Panarin is going to be missing for 2 week. Put Laf on PP1. Playing a certain way 5v5 and getting PP1 times are two completely different things. Lafreniere is our best option. He gives the PP the best chance for success, in turn giving the team the best chance to win. Not Blackwell. If they are 'sheltering' Lafreniere from PP1 times.... that just flat out embarrassingly dumb

Are we playing to win as a team? or are we playing to develop individuals? Lafreniere getting PP1 time does both, so I really do not understand your argument.

I am in the same place I always have been.

Do you believe that when it comes to the development of Kakko and Lafreniere that the first and final word belongs to Quinn?

Regarding the PP, can Lafreiere actually dominate on the 2nd pair first?

Individuals are being developed both for their level of play and for the overall team structure.

 

[True Blue]

Not sure why playing Blackwell on PP1 and Lafreniere on PP2 is bad for morale. Who's morale? The players? The fans? So far Blackwell has made more shit happen.

Shhh......don't disturb the narrative

 

[True Blue]

Because maybe that's where they think he's best served at this exact moment. It's clearly not because someone else is blocking him. Maybe they just feel this is better for him right now. I don't know. But people losing their minds over this or convincing themselves they are ruining this prospect is the absolute height of dumbf***ery.

Like I said, the funny thing is that if Lafreniere has 10 points so far, the same people would contort themselves into saying how he came to the Rangers fully developed in the Q.

 

[True Blue]

I personally never once said ruining him but if you would have told me after getting Lafreniere that he would not even be seeing powerplay time over the likes of Blackwell and Strome then I would say for sure we aren't giving the kid all the opportunities needed to Flourish.

Strome? At last check Strome players center. Is that where you want to move Lafreniere?

Have you seen his 5 on 5 time? When compared to other rookies, how do you say with a straight face that he is not being given the opportunities to flourish? Or does that only pertain to PP1 time?

 

[TheBloodyNine]

Tob pointed out that both Fox and Miller came to the Rangers fully formed. Do you agree?

If yes, then please answer these two very easy quetions:
1) Did you know that at the time of the trade that Fox was already borderline elite level defenseman?
2) Was Miller developed in Wisconsin?

I agree with everything Tob said. @Tob gave a fantastic analysis.

 

[True Blue]

I agree with everything Tob said. @Tob gave a fantastic analysis.

So specifically, you believe that the answer to both questions below is an unequivocal "yes".

1) Did you know that at the time of the trade that Fox was already borderline elite level defenseman?
2) Was Miller developed in Wisconsin?​

 

[McRanger]

Tob pointed out that both Fox and Miller came to the Rangers fully formed. Do you agree?

If yes, then please answer these two very easy quetions:
1) Did you know that at the time of the trade that Fox was already borderline elite level defenseman?
2) Was Miller developed in Wisconsin?

I think anyone who followed Fox knew he had the potential to be an elite defenseman. I mean he was the best D in college behind only Makar and the best D for the USA at the WJC. He had accomplished pretty much anything a prospect could at an elite level besides be drafted really high so people are comfortable projecting him to do great things. I even argued against trading for Trouba until we knew what we had in Fox. Because he was just that good.

Did anyone know? I'm not sure if your question is just poorly worded or disingenuous. You never know. Even after seeing a player meet or exceed expectations at the NHL level you don't know. But you can guess, which is probably what the Rangers did and is why they traded two high picks for a guy they could have potentially signed for free a year later.

What exactly is the argument here? That between being awesome outside the NHL and being awesome in the NHL something happened to his development in training camp that made him awesome?