Speculation: Roster Building Thread IV (2021 Offseason) - Bob Dylan turns 80 & "The times they are a changing!"

[IDvsEGO]

I’m wondering if they could store a player for another team for a pick. Team A trades Defenseman to the Rangers with a pick for future considerations. After expansion draft, Rangers flip the player back to that other team for future considerations as well. Any rules against that?

that would likely be circumvention. nhl would prob come down hard on that one.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

The best trade the rangers have made maybe in the last 20 years was for a young center that a team that saw itself as a contender was unhappy with.

Ok and that automatically means that this one is going to work out? I think you’d find more often than not that most of these types of “we aren’t happy with the way this guy is playing trade” turns out not the way you want it to. These things don’t happen in a vacuum. And I certainly am not trading the farm for a guy like this either.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

that would likely be circumvention. nhl would prob come down hard on that one.

I mean, is it written in the rules? It’s not like the other team and us won’t be compliant with what needs to be exposed to Seattle? Why would they care how it’s done just as long as teams are exposing players still. Unless there’s a specific rule against it I don’t see why it can’t be done.

 

[pld459666]

Panarin, Zib etc can and like to shoot the puck. So do Laf and Kakko. Kreider has a pretty handy wrister, Buch scores a few, as does Strome. Chytil likes to shoot. Otherwise, trade for Laine

I'm more interested in having a strong cycle game, a couple of strong two-way centers behind Zib, better overall structure and zone exits/entries etc. Scoring/shooting is the least of this teams problems. Tampa, Colorado, Florida, Toronto, Carolina, Winnipeg etc hardly play a prototypical shoot first game. Even Boston's first line doesn't. Montreal do, but their offense sucks unsurprisingly. The good teams don't play that kind of hockey anymore.

I checked the Blues forum - apparently Thomas has been checked out since the bubble last year. They do talk about his high upside but something is not right there. Maybe a change of scenery is what's needed. Could be a case of buy low for high reward, I wouldn't overpay for him though.

Buch still tries to force passes where the best play is to shoot.

I also see both Laf and Kakko defer on shots for passes and while that could be youth deferring to vets, that's a mistake as both have good shots.

Even CK passes more than he should but thats a low Hockey IQ issue more than anything.

Strome I expect it from, but our wingers, I expect to see more shots from.

 

[pld459666]

If you think EDM is shitty because of McDavid than I'm not sure what to tell you. I would much rather have McDavid at 12.5 than Zib at 10 or whatever he'll command.

That's not, and never is, the math.

Its id rather have McDavid over Mika and whoever else is making up the salary difference and with Panarin here, its not some 3rd liner.

The dynamic of this roster is changed drastically with Connor in place of Mika.

 

[TheDirtyH]

Ok and that automatically means that this one is going to work out? I think you’d find more often than not that most of these types of “we aren’t happy with the way this guy is playing trade” turns out not the way you want it to. These things don’t happen in a vacuum. And I certainly am not trading the farm for a guy like this either.

Trades don't always work out?

I'm not proposing trading the farm for Thomas, I'm proposing trading Buchnevich straight up for Thomas. I said Buch + with some irony mainly to emphasize that 1) I'm not sure STL would consider Buch enough for Thomas and 2) I'm proposing Buchnevich straight up because, obviously, I'm betting that we win that trade. I think Thomas is a better fit on our roster now and in the future and I think he'll be the better player over the time he's with us and the time Buch is with STL.

 

[Jaromir Jagr]

That's not, and never is, the math.

Its id rather have McDavid over Mika and whoever else is making up the salary difference and with Panarin here, its not some 3rd liner.

The dynamic of this roster is changed drastically with Connor in place of Mika.

Mika and whatever you spend that 2.5 mm on is not going to convince me. We have more spent than that on buyouts over the next two years. There are players you outlay money for and there are ones you don't. McDavid at 24 over Mika at 28 is not even a question.

McDavid is the best player the NHL has seen since perhaps Lemieux and Gretzky. If EDM is dumb enough to entertain him, or if he forces his way out, you do whatever you can to get him here.

 

[bobbop]

Thomas and Kyrou for Buchnevich would be my offer and I love Buchnevich as a player

St. Louis is not going to trade two young guys for one older player who is a year away from UFA. They are looking for help on the back end. We can help there.

 

[bobbop]

His age, at 21 years old, and his playing style would seem to fit this team like a glove. He would also be under contract for a while.

42 points in 66 games last year as a 20 year old is pretty alluring in only 14:34 average TOI per game. 46 takeaways to 30 giveaways last year is also a pretty positive stat for a 20 year old center.

His shot totals are way down this year for sure (like almost half of what he did last year if you extrapolate out)

This is the Thomas I am interested. He won a OHL championship in Hamilton and was great in the 2019 playoffs. I don’t know what happened this year but if there was ever a buy low candidate, this is the guy.

 

[TheDirtyH]

This is the Thomas I am interested. He won a OHL championship in Hamilton and was great in the 2019 playoffs. I don’t know what happened this year but if there was ever a buy low candidate, this is the guy.

Frankly, the fact that you can buy him at all is probably as low as it gets from Thomas.

 

[bbny]

The best trade the rangers have made maybe in the last 20 years was for a young center that a team that saw itself as a contender was unhappy with.

Not sure if you mean Brassard for Zibanejad or Spooner for Strome hmm

 

[huerter]

Buch still tries to force passes where the best play is to shoot.

I also see both Laf and Kakko defer on shots for passes and while that could be youth deferring to vets, that's a mistake as both have good shots.

Even CK passes more than he should but thats a low Hockey IQ issue more than anything.

Strome I expect it from, but our wingers, I expect to see more shots from.

There is a big correlation between Rangers tattoo guys and shoot the puck guys.

 

[TheDirtyH]

Not sure if you mean Brassard for Zibanejad or Spooner for Strome hmm

Obviously I mean Gaborik for Brassard.

 

[Fitzy]

St. Louis is not going to trade two young guys for one older player who is a year away from UFA. They are looking for help on the back end. We can help there.

Any team trading for Buchnevich is going to do so with the intention of giving him a long term extension.

 

[TheBloodyNine]

Trades don't always work out?

I'm not proposing trading the farm for Thomas, I'm proposing trading Buchnevich straight up for Thomas. I said Buch + with some irony mainly to emphasize that 1) I'm not sure STL would consider Buch enough for Thomas and 2) I'm proposing Buchnevich straight up because, obviously, I'm betting that we win that trade. I think Thomas is a better fit on our roster now and in the future and I think he'll be the better player over the time he's with us and the time Buch is with STL.

Buch straight up would be wildly inappropriate asset management in this situation, especially for a player that’s team has apparently run out of patience with so quickly and clearly regressed this season. Not trading a guy who is not only a better player but trending upwards on a gamble. Sorry.

 

[LokiDog]

That's not, and never is, the math.

Its id rather have McDavid over Mika and whoever else is making up the salary difference and with Panarin here, its not some 3rd liner.

The dynamic of this roster is changed drastically with Connor in place of Mika.

Well it’s also Mika @10 PLUS Laf/KK/Krav/Miller/Lundkvist/Robertson/1st etc. because that’s what it would cost to make it happen. So say Mika at 9.5M (I don’t think he actually gets that much) plus all of those pieces versus McDavid at 12.5M minus all of those pieces. Draisaitl only makes 8.5M and his game translates to the post season. It Edmonton were willing to move McDavid, they’d likely be willing to move Drai instead and I’d personally rather have him and the 4M extra cap space.

 

[pld459666]

Mika and whatever you spend that 2.5 mm on is not going to convince me. We have more spent than that on buyouts over the next two years. There are players you outlay money for and there are ones you don't. McDavid at 24 over Mika at 28 is not even a question.

McDavid is the best player the NHL has seen since perhaps Lemieux and Gretzky. If EDM is dumb enough to entertain him, or if he forces his way out, you do whatever you can to get him here.

Lets be honest, it's going to be more than that as Buch needs a new deal as well as others coming up.

Having two guys making almost 30% of your cap is stupid, stupid stupid

 

[pld459666]

There is a big correlation between Rangers tattoo guys and shoot the puck guys.

who else has a Rangers Tattoo?

 

[SRHRangers]

Worst owner in sports? Might be some homer bias.

When you compare other owners that have dismantled teams after championships.
Refused to field competent teams to save salary.
Blacked out home games on tv to "force you to attend home games"
Being a downright racist and/or mysogonist
Pretending like you are the smartest person in the room and declare yourself GM and can't get out of your own way then hire family members in other managerial positions with zero experience.

Should I go on? Dolan is bad...maybe top 5 bad...but there are far worse owners out there.

I agree with this. Dolan unlike a ton of owners, writes checks and doesn't care about money, which is half the battle.

Dolans biggest issue is that he is basically a 60 year old trust fund frat boy, who has never worked a single day in his life.

Now, Dolan might be the biggest POS on a human level in comparison to other owners.

 

[duhmetreE]

Buch still tries to force passes where the best play is to shoot.

I also see both Laf and Kakko defer on shots for passes and while that could be youth deferring to vets, that's a mistake as both have good shots.

Even CK passes more than he should but thats a low Hockey IQ issue more than anything.

Strome I expect it from, but our wingers, I expect to see more shots from.

Laf has 40+ goal potential.

He was a sniper before he went the Panarin route. I'm hoping he gets some of that back...

but if he emulates Panarin (stylistically), as frustrating as it is to watch them defer, can we really complain?

 

[MrAlmost]

Would St.Louis move Sanford? He seems to be a good 20 point guy that plays a heavy game and is still young and would be both cheap to acquire and cheap to sign. Could be just the kind of guy for the 4th line. He is RFA. Him and Thomas? Him and Dunn? Barbashev? St. Louis is in a very interesting Expansion Draft position. No NMCs, but a lot of guys you think they would want to protect. hard choices ahead for sure.

 

[Ola]

Buch still tries to force passes where the best play is to shoot.

I also see both Laf and Kakko defer on shots for passes and while that could be youth deferring to vets, that's a mistake as both have good shots.

Even CK passes more than he should but thats a low Hockey IQ issue more than anything.

Strome I expect it from, but our wingers, I expect to see more shots from.

I don’t know, are you sure that it’s better to shoot than pass in those situations?

 

[Pidto Files]

I know it's likely just a lot of hand-wringing because EDM shit the bed. But if they are dumb enough to even pick up the phone the Rangers should put together a giant offer.

For whom??

 

[Savant]

who else has a Rangers Tattoo?

I have a Statue of Liberty but it’s more modeled after the older NY license plates than it is the Rangers.

 

[eco's bones]

Not sure what the fascination with Thomas is. Doesn’t shoot the puck. Doesn’t really have a physical game and is another bad at face-offs center. Not going to help much on special teams either. He’s coming off a 12 point season.