Speculation: Roster Building Thread DCLXXXV: July 1st Is Coming...

[duhmetreE]

From what I remember hearing/reading, Smith was a vocal leader in the locker room... can anyone confirm?

 

[GregSirico]

Since 2006, the 8th seed has made it beyond the 1st round 5 times.

the 7th seed has done it 9 times.

6th seed has done it 11 times.

See a pattern?

Again, 8th seeds are almost always teams that are the best of a group of mediocre to horrible teams. Nashville was an exception, they got off to a horrible start and had a ton of injuries early IIRC and had to play catch up basically the entire year. LA was destined to miss the playoffs until their coaching change in 2012. Occasionally, you'll see a team go on some weird ass cinderella run like Montreal in 2009 and Edmonton in 2006 (IIRC, both teams missed the playoffs the following season.)

So yes, you can be a good team as an 8th seed, but more often than not you're just there for 5-6 games before gearing up for the summer.

I don't really see what JG can do to get his team to that level this summer.


Also, your list of players you expect to progress positively from last year is a wee bit optimistic.

Look at the teams that have won the cup in the last 10 years. What do they have in common?

 

[Mac n Gs]

Let's give Shattenkirk 6yrs, $39M.

The Wade Redden contract just because I want to watch the world burn.

 

[DanielBrassard]

I'd give him 7 with the compliance buyouts after the 2021 lockout. Get the AAV down.

 

[GregSirico]

Let's give Shattenkirk 6yrs, $39M.

The Wade Redden contract just because I want to watch the world burn.

Please don't mention his name again. I almost had a panic attack. Now I need a beer.

 

[offdacrossbar]

See, I told you he'd have a stroke Just messing with ya, bud.

I'm still gonna keep pumping Nash to Florida. Why did Tallon move out Reilly Smith, and what is he planning with all of that cap space?

all good

im happy it sounds like they are moving forward with brendan smith. i want him to return and 4 year 4.5 works for me.

if he resigns i tell shattenkirk we are all set unless he does a 3-4 yr deal. no more than 4 though.

 

[GregSirico]

But do you wear those amazing red turtlenecks ?

No

 

[RGY]

Either:

7 years, $5.750 AAV totaling $40.25 mil

Or

6 years, $6.150 AAV totaling $36.40

For Shatty

 

[Mac n Gs]

all good

im happy it sounds like they are moving forward with brendan smith. i want him to return and 4 year 4.5 works for me.

if he resigns i tell shattenkirk we are all set unless he does a 3-4 yr deal. no more than 4 though.

Getting Deangelo made you change your tune on Shatty that much? FWIW, I always thought Smith was important to retain.

 

[effen]

Since 2006, the 8th seed has made it beyond the 1st round 5 times.

the 7th seed has done it 9 times.

6th seed has done it 11 times.

See a pattern?

Again, 8th seeds are almost always teams that are the best of a group of mediocre to horrible teams. Nashville was an exception, they got off to a horrible start and had a ton of injuries early IIRC and had to play catch up basically the entire year. LA was destined to miss the playoffs until their coaching change in 2012. Occasionally, you'll see a team go on some weird ass cinderella run like Montreal in 2009 and Edmonton in 2006 (IIRC, both teams missed the playoffs the following season.)

So yes, you can be a good team as an 8th seed, but more often than not you're just there for 5-6 games before gearing up for the summer.

I don't really see what JG can do to get his team to that level this summer.


Also, your list of players you expect to progress positively from last year is a wee bit optimistic.

So 25% of 8 seeds, 45% of 7s, and 55% of 6s?

Pretty good odds all things considered tbh.

Right, now throw 2 of the guys who should progress into holding even, and make 2 of them have down years and regress, and for fun, Holden can repeat his 11g 23a season from the regression category for some randomness.

It's still a roster that in isolation should be a fair amt better, and that's without a Shattenkirk.

 

[Maximus]

I think there's a middle ground between these two schools of thought that can still have this team primed to be better in 2-3 years than they were these past few seasons. There's a lot of underlying fsctors though: we need Buch to develop into a top-line winger, along with Hayes (seriously wake up bub), Mika, Miller, and Skjei, and Vesey taking the next steps. I think we need one move shake-up move to add a young talent (like Galchenyuk who you've mentioned although I'm iffy on him) and Gorton will have created his new young nucleus moving forward. Those guys above will be hitting their prime and then we can add in guys like Andersson, Chytil, Shesty, Graves/Day/Zboro. It looks promising going forward.

IMO Gorton's main focus is 2-3 years down the road. Shattenkirk or Smith will still be effective then, so I'm not too worried about their contracts if that's the way he wants to go. There's a much bigger picture being painted here, and I'm excited to see what it looks like when all is said and done.

Good stuff Mac and another good read. Damn Ranger Nation has been entertaining tonight...woo hoo...lol

Seriously, you make some very good points especially the parts of some of our young guns taking the next step. That is crucial to the "retool" or "rebuild"...whatever we want to call it as it's purely semantics. We are retooling a bit differently than other teams have because we've simply been too good the past decade or more to get any high picks. And yes we made some ill fated trades to "go for it" like the Staal deal and yet we made some good one's like the St.Louis deal which ended up being a good one.

I don't envy Gorton not at all. But he certainly seems like the man for the job. I'm nothing but impressed with his acuman and eval skills. Seriously, I think we are very luck to have him. Sather did some good thing while here at the end of his tenor. His best one was hiring Gorton.

Let's see how this plays out...good stuff Mac

 

[GregSirico]

One thing I love about Smith, he sticks up for his teammates. Goes to war for them. Good character to have in the lockerroom.

 

[GregSirico]

Good stuff Mac and another good read. Damn Ranger Nation has been entertaining tonight...woo hoo...lol

Seriously, you make some very good points especially the parts of some of our young guns taking the next step. That is crucial to the "retool" or "rebuild"...whatever we want to call it as it's purely semantics. We are retooling a bit differently than other teams have because we've simply been too good the past decade or more to get any high picks. And yes we made some ill fated trades to "go for it" like the Staal deal and yet we made some good one's like the St.Louis deal which ended up being a good one.

I don't envy Gorton not at all. But he certainly seems like the man for the job. I'm nothing but impressed with his acuman and eval skills. Seriously, I think we are very luck to have him. Sather did some good thing while here at the end of his tenor. His best one was hiring Gorton.

Let's see how this plays out...good stuff Mac

I think I'm sort of in the same page with both of you. I just think if we are ever going to take that next step to win a cup we need that top line center. It's been my thinking for years.

 

[Irishguy42]

Nilsson will be a good back up if we get him.

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

There are so many Ranger fans so scared to give out long term deals because of what happened with Staal and Girardi...

Let me guess, because of the Richards deal, next year if Tavares were to hit FA, those same people wouldn't want to give him 7 years either because the Richards deal blew up in our face?

sounds absurd to me. (and this is not for anyone in particular, just a ton of Ranger fans I'm hearing from).

Staal and Girardi could never really skate, and were ABUSED in the shot blocking system of Torts and it's ultimately broken them (combined with not really being able to skate fast to begin with), Shattenkirk plays defense nothing like them, He plays defense like the new NHL, not the 90s.

 

[Maximus]

JT is going FA. Bank on it.

Well as I said a few nights ago that is the "miracle on the Hudson" move we need to happen that will answer all of our desires.

This would be this generations "Messier Moment" like some of us oldie Ranger fans experienced back in '91 when out of the blue we found out Messier was coming here to bring the Cup to town. Man what a great great day that was. I remember it like yesterday. Felt so much pride being a part of Ranger Nation. One of the best days of my fandom actually was the day we all found out Messier was coming here.

As fatalistic and pessmistic most Ranger fans are, even the most pessimistic fan knew this was a true game changer. This wasn't Guy Lafleur or Marcel Dionne coming to Broadway in their last hurrahs. This was Mark ****ing Messier in his prime coming to here to lead the troops. Oh man...what a day.

OK enough waxing poetic. Getting Tavares would close to the equal of us getting Messier. He's that good and he'd still be firmly in his prime. We just have to hope he doesn't sign with the Islanders. It's doubtful he'll be available but if he is, we should get prepared for him to come to Broadway tho Toronto would likely be our main competition for him. Still a year or so before this truly comes into focus but if JT was here, I think a Cup or two would on the horizon...he'd be EXACTLY what this team needs.

 

[I Eat Crow]

I hate that I have to listen to Montreal radio for hockey (I've given up on ny sports radio). They called Zibby a third line center . They said we currently have no 1 or 2 center lol

They're ******** after Game 5.

I'd give him 7 with the compliance buyouts after the 2021 lockout. Get the AAV down.

Which is why I'm not afraid to jump on the Shattenkirk train. There's going to be another lockout in 3 years and another round of compliance buyouts.

 

[HatTrick Swayze]

Why are people so fanatical about "maximizing value"?

Sometimes there's more value in just having a near 60 point winger for two years as opposed to the mystery box. Most times, in fact.

I get feeling this way. But feeling this way and supporting the Stepan trade is completely hypocritical.

Half measures are ****. Pick a direction and go all in.

 

[GoAwayPanarin]

So 25% of 8 seeds, 45% of 7s, and 55% of 6s?

Pretty good odds all things considered tbh.

Right, now throw 2 of the guys who should progress into holding even, and make 2 of them have down years and regress, and for fun, Holden can repeat his 11g 23a season from the regression category for some randomness.

It's still a roster that in isolation should be a fair amt better, and that's without a Shattenkirk.

Its closer to 21% of 8th seeds.

But the breakdown of those teams is basically

2 cinderella teams that basically came out of no where (Edmonton and Montreal, the latter won 2 rounds on the back of their goalie and a white hot Cammaleri.)

2 teams that finished 8th but were actually good (LA and Nashville)

1 team that lost in the 2nd round (Anaheim.)

I can't agree that this team is better than last year with out Stepan. They can easily make the defense much better just by throwing money at people if they so choose, but I don't think they're going to spend big time in the FA market.

I can see Smith coming back for 4-4.5 for 4, but that would likely be the biggest contract they give out. Sounds like he would like to say, but there was a ton of agent speak in the Brooks article, which was basically "He would like to stay, but we're listening to/waiting on other offers."

Nothing exactly earth shattering.

 

[mas0764]

I think Montreal would take a D man for Gally.

Staal! Make it happen!

 

[Kovalev27]

We can't defendike we used to because we just don't have the goaltending. Hank has barely been an average goalie now since November of 2015.

So we need possession we need to be on the attack. Girardi out

Shattenkirk smith DeAngelo in. Pretty clear to me

 

[LaffyTaffyNYR]

I'm not discounting Stepan... however, against Ottawa we scored 22 goals.. and lost the series.. I think our top 6 scored maybe 4 of them?

 

[mas0764]

I mean, we are pretty sure the Rangers tried to trade for Shattenkirk at the beginning of the season, yes? How can they not make a run at him now?

Any news about him?

 

[Maximus]

lol

some of you just cant let go.

dylan mcilrath is a border line fringe nhl 7th dman.

i was right the day he was drafted after a junior career where he made exactly zero allstar games on talent and was never once chosen to any national team ever and the one allstar game he did play in picked a fight. lol. you cant make this stuff up.

and i was right when he couldn't stand out in hartford. i was right when he couldn't keep a job here- even when most of the defense was injured. i was right when florida laughed him outa town and i was right when detroit acquired him and immediately sent him to grand rapids- and the wings were bad last year. like real bad.

and now that he's back in the A, where he will continue to percolate until he eventually ends up exactly where i predicted he would end up back in 2010.

as a 7th man who punches faces and does his best work without having to move his skates.

im sorry, that ship hasn't sailed. it sunk.

This post made me laugh...really hard.

Well played...lol

 

[TheBloodyNine]

If we traded for Gally I would take a flyer on his old linemate Yak