Speculation: Roster Building Thread DCLXXVII: Derek Stepan Trade-A-Palooza
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There is a crew that are really fierce when it comes to trashing posters wishing that Gorton should test the market for Stepan. I think a lot of that sentiment stems from older debates. With all due respect to Bern I guess, my opinion is that things have changed. I have also shaken my head at suggestions that we should tear the team apart 2-3 years ago. It's so easy to be a back seat driver and claim that any year you did not win, things should have been teared apart instead. Vets dumped and what not.
Facts of a matter is that it has been very obvious that we don't quite have the intanglibles to win a Cup on the roster. We very much lack a killer instinct offensively. We are very flat in terms of emotions. Very few hairy chests on this team. Hank is getting older and doesn't have it in him to carry a team all the way anymore. He is 35 now. We have many far from ideal contracts, and a big buy out on the books.
No matter who was right or wrong 3 or 5 or 8 years ago about a certain player -- it's a new situation today and the present/future is all that matters now. It's not about if it has been Stepans fault or if Stepan was very good or not very good in 2014. How do we build the best possible team 2-3 years down the line? That is the question. I think it's a bit aggressive to trash people raising the possibility of Gorts exploring an option in which Stepan is traded for a younger asset. JMHO.
Facts of a matter is that it has been very obvious that we don't quite have the intanglibles to win a Cup on the roster. We very much lack a killer instinct offensively. We are very flat in terms of emotions. Very few hairy chests on this team. Hank is getting older and doesn't have it in him to carry a team all the way anymore. He is 35 now. We have many far from ideal contracts, and a big buy out on the books.
No matter who was right or wrong 3 or 5 or 8 years ago about a certain player -- it's a new situation today and the present/future is all that matters now. It's not about if it has been Stepans fault or if Stepan was very good or not very good in 2014. How do we build the best possible team 2-3 years down the line? That is the question. I think it's a bit aggressive to trash people raising the possibility of Gorts exploring an option in which Stepan is traded for a younger asset. JMHO.
KREIDER
thanks to glorious leader coach AV. Kreider is told to press on the Wing too often, and wait around the net.
That's fine a proportionate amount of time, but not nearly every play.
Too predictable.
Allows teams to double up.
Of course, nobody other than Kreider can actually handle being up front.
Conclusion, CK was a good team player and did as told, right or wrong.
When all the bs AV pulled was proven wrong, and Coach was finally forced to de facto admit he was wrong, and forced to bend, buckle and break, only then did he 'let Kreider be Kreider'.
And while no one can exert that much energy for an inordinate number of minutes per game, we see the result.
Kreider unrestrained = domination.
Dump AV
get a coach who understands not making a gazillion changes on line shifts
let Kreider play with Zib which = increased synergy + dominance
use the best C with them, not another Stepan leadfoot, presumably JT
As IS PROVEN you give my guy the chance, and he delivers...
Let's tell it like it is.
thanks to glorious leader coach AV. Kreider is told to press on the Wing too often, and wait around the net.
That's fine a proportionate amount of time, but not nearly every play.
Too predictable.
Allows teams to double up.
Of course, nobody other than Kreider can actually handle being up front.
Conclusion, CK was a good team player and did as told, right or wrong.
When all the bs AV pulled was proven wrong, and Coach was finally forced to de facto admit he was wrong, and forced to bend, buckle and break, only then did he 'let Kreider be Kreider'.
And while no one can exert that much energy for an inordinate number of minutes per game, we see the result.
Kreider unrestrained = domination.
Dump AV
get a coach who understands not making a gazillion changes on line shifts
let Kreider play with Zib which = increased synergy + dominance
use the best C with them, not another Stepan leadfoot, presumably JT
As IS PROVEN you give my guy the chance, and he delivers...
Not so, so says me and...
... this guy.
So now the fact that he can play defense is going to be held against him?
Jesus talk about grasping at straws to fulfill an agenda
Fun fact! Derek Stepan outscored Patrice Bergeron last year! Bergeron played the bulk of his minutes with Marchand and Pasternak who both broke the 70 point mark. Can we dock some points against him?Because if there is a player who actually showed some signs of decline (and its not farfetched, hes played a ton of hockey and has gotten dinged up a ton over the last 14 years), it was PB.
Color me skeptical about Wennberg too. At the same age, Stepan went 44 in 48 and thats only because Bettman is an *******.
Irishguy42
Mr. Preachy
Once 3pm ET hits, we can sort of relax. Until then, it's full steam ahead with the anxiety and whatnot.
Full relaxation hits after the NHL Awards are done.
JT Kreider
FIRE GORDIE CLARK
JT Kreider
FIRE GORDIE CLARK
So now the fact that he can play defense is going to be held against him?
Jesus talk about grasping at straws to fulfill an agenda
Fun fact! Derek Stepan outscored Patrice Bergeron last year! Bergeron played the bulk of his minutes with Marchand and Pasternak who both broke the 70 point mark. Can we dock some points against him?Because if there is a player who actually showed some signs of decline (and its not farfetched, hes played a ton of hockey and has gotten dinged up a ton over the last 14 years), it was PB.
Color me skeptical about Wennberg too. At the same age, Stepan went 44 in 48 and thats only because Bettman is an *******.
Bergeron played the entire season with a major injury.
Zibanejbread
Rebuilding.
I'd give
Zib 5-6 years at $5 - $6 MM, easy.
Lindberg (preferably) or Fast 3 years at ~$1.5 - $1.75 MM
Smith 3-4 years at $4 - $4.25 MM tops
Zib 5-6 years at $5 - $6 MM, easy.
Lindberg (preferably) or Fast 3 years at ~$1.5 - $1.75 MM
Smith 3-4 years at $4 - $4.25 MM tops
LaffyTaffyNYR
Registered User
- Feb 25, 2012
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I love how people are bringing up Stepan's playoffs (this year) and Kreider's and both have had some success overall and scored some big goals.
While ignoring JT Miller's career playoffs... 41 games, 1 goal.
While ignoring JT Miller's career playoffs... 41 games, 1 goal.
Disagree.
Like I said, let Kreider be kreider, then we can talk about hockey sense.
People are moaning about replacing Stepan when we have depth.
We have no dominant force on the level of Kreider. No one.
Sports Hernia isn't a major injury. People play through it all the time.
It's uncomfortable, but hes been more productive playing through tougher stuff.
And I highly doubt it was the entire season.
silverfish
got perma'd
As HFNYR-proclaimed Miller hater #1, I think it's a very unfair thing to do to add up small sample sizes across four different seasons to portray a narrative.
However, that does not mean we should ignore how awful he was in the playoffs this year. But we do, because people like complaining about things that don't need to be complained about, like Derek Stepan.
Every year I await the JT Miller shooting % crumble, and it took me 'til this season to realize that it does happen, just in the playoffs.
I trade Miller way before I trade Stepan or Hayes, that's for sure (bet no one saw that coming
)The hole at {edit correct typo} C is imagined.
Sure, there is a loss of depth if another C is not coming back, that is both obvious and mathematical. You have a specific C one day and do not the next. But that does NOT mean the existing, residual depth you still have would = 'a hole', let alone a huge one.
We need cap flexibility.
Even if/when we drop the other wonder twin and Nash, we still have Hank's 8.5 on the books.
Beyond this reality is the principle of the thing!
I don't mind working w/a player if possible to make him comfy w/a relocation.
However, whether it is actual NMC, or defacto NTC caused by excess, this bs from the Slats era has to stop.
Stepan was made to take what he was given
He had the upper hand in the last deal, and presumably insisted on this clause.
Now he has to bend, buckle, and break and accept the consequences.
Gorton will not be stupid and let this guy control us for any period of time.
PERIOD.
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JT Kreider
FIRE GORDIE CLARK
He suffered it during the WCH. He also was 3rd overall in shot attempts and had the best Corsi in the league.
I'm not holding Stepan being a defensive center against him. That would be great if there was a center who produced at an elite level in front of him.
LaffyTaffyNYR
Registered User
- Feb 25, 2012
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As HFNYR-proclaimed Miller hater #1, I think it's a very unfair thing to do to add up small sample sizes across four different seasons to portray a narrative.
However, that does not mean we should ignore how awful he was in the playoffs this year. But we do, because people like complaining about things that don't need to be complained about, like Derek Stepan.
Every year I await the JT Miller shooting % crumble, and it took me 'til this season to realize that it does happen, just in the playoffs.
I trade Miller way before I trade Stepan or Hayes, that's for sure (bet no one saw that coming
I like Miller, but you can replace a wing much easier than you can replace a center, and Milller because of age/ RFA status and his cheap contract this year could net you a better defenseman.
- Nov 2, 2011
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RangerBlues
Registered User
Competitive rebuild. Cup contender in 3-5 years.
Party is over.
Buying out G was the white flag.
Party is over.
Buying out G was the white flag.
silverfish
got perma'd
LaffyTaffyNYR
Registered User
- Feb 25, 2012
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in that case, they should trade zucc, Nash, Henrik, mcdonagh. pretty much anyone over 25.
https://www.sny.tv/rangers/news/the-rangers-have-a-very-high-price-for-derek-stepan/236832908
Matt Tkachuk went 6th to Calgary.
Clayton Keller went 7th to Arizona.
Did the Rangers want Tkachuk who was a plug in and play player from his rookie season?
JT Kreider
FIRE GORDIE CLARK
Stepan is better, for now. But of course he is, Larkin has played 2 seasons in the league and isn't even 21 yet.
In a trade though I take Larkin all day long.
JT Kreider
FIRE GORDIE CLARK
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