Speculation: *Rifai vs. Liljegren. Rifai Clears. Liljegren healthy scratch.

[Roo]

Well Timmins has only played 50 games with the leafs the past two yrs and has 24 pts and a plus 10

Maybe we shouldn’t write him off so quick as a suitable 5th/6th D

Lilly has been given more opportunities here. Even tho he filled in nicely when Rielly was hurt he just hasn’t taken the next step.

They’re not writing him off, but his injury history is concerning. At some point, you’re deemed too injury prone and not trustworthy in that regard.

Liljegren is just one perfect examples of a player that has the tools but hasn’t put it together. To me, he needs to up the pace and urgency in his game. He won’t be a physical defenseman. Buy the opposition target him as a weak link in the chain in the playoffs. Anticipate faster, get to pucks faster, use your skating to get pucks out more. He can do all those things. The puck needs to be moving the other way before the forecheckers start laying the body on him.

 

[DarkKnight]

Don’t forget too Berube was an analyst during the playoffs, he saw Lil get manhandled. I suspect camp reinforced his concerns.

 

[ULF_55]

They’re not writing him off, but his injury history is concerning. At some point, you’re deemed too injury prone and not trustworthy in that regard.

Liljegren is just one perfect examples of a player that has the tools but hasn’t put it together. To me, he needs to up the pace and urgency in his game. He won’t be a physical defenseman. Buy the opposition target him as a weak link in the chain in the playoffs. Anticipate faster, get to pucks faster, use your skating to get pucks out more. He can do all those things. The puck needs to be moving the other way before the forecheckers start laying the body on him.

I'd be fine if they traded him for draft capital.

He'll probably take the next steps at his new location, but what would be so strange about that?

 

[Roo]

I'd be fine if they traded him for draft capital.

He'll probably take the next steps at his new location, but what would be so strange about that?

Nothing would be strange about it. We don’t have to look outside our own division to see examples of similar defensemen at his age, who were expendable, only to thrive somewhere else. We just want it to be here. And its very likely the reason why he's with us as opposed to depth D who showed well in the preseason.

 

[hamzarocks]

Don’t forget too Berube was an analyst during the playoffs, he saw Lil get manhandled. I suspect camp reinforced his concerns.

Berube should have let Treliving know in that case it will be tough for lilijgren to break the squad with his style being not tuned with Berube system/approach

We should have dealt him as an RFA at the draft vs giving him 3M x 2 which makes him a cap dump if berube doesnt play him consistently

 

[DarkKnight]

Berube should have let Treliving know in that case it will be tough for lilijgren to break the squad with his style being not tuned with Berube system/approach

We should have dealt him as an RFA at the draft vs giving him 3M x 2 which makes him a cap dump if berube doesnt play him consistently

I could see some GM wanting him, he's still intriguing.

 

[hamzarocks]

I could see some GM wanting him, he's still intriguing.

HOpefully

I feel we could have gotten a 2nd + 4th at the draft for liligren without his current deal

Feel we missed a chance to add picks this draft

Jarnkrok for a 3rd or 4th and 5th

Kampf for a 3rd or 4th and 5th

Lilijgrem for a 2nd amd 4th or 2 3rds

Would have given us more capspace (~7.5M capspace that group takes up) while giving 3-4 solid picks to use at this deadline or to draft for high ceiling longshot prospects

Guess we will see if the three can stick to the team and be useful

 

[Kurtz]

HOpefully

I feel we could have gotten a 2nd + 4th at the draft for liligren without his current deal

Feel we missed a chance to add picks this draft

Jarnkrok for a 3rd or 4th and 5th

Kampf for a 3rd or 4th and 5th

Lilijgrem for a 2nd amd 4th or 2 3rds

Would have given us more capspace (~7.5M capspace that group takes up) while giving 3-4 solid picks to use at this deadline or to draft for high ceiling longshot prospects

Guess we will see if the three can stick to the team and be useful

His deal is pretty reasonable though. I don't think it diminishes his trade value compared to what it'd be if he was still RFA.

 

[hamzarocks]

His deal is pretty reasonable though. I don't think it diminishes his trade value compared to what it'd be if he was still RFA.

His deal would he reasonable if we play him and give him 19-20 mins and time to shows hes a good #4D with #3 potential

At 3M if hes our 6-8D I dont know if another team will have interest giving solid assets (2nd or good B prospect with potential based deal)

We won't be able to get a Sandin type return sadly, as we held to long and committed seemingly to him but withdrew committment potentially right after.

Lilijgren should have been moved at the 2024 draft if we didnt see a top4 RHD under Berubes system or have told Berube to give him a leesh and a long look as we want to see him become a 5-6M player for us in 2 years.

 

[Menzinger]

His deal would he reasonable if we play him and give him 19-20 mins and time to shows hes a good #4D with #3 potential

At 3M if hes our 6-8D I dont know if another team will have interest giving solid assets (2nd or good B prospect with potential based deal)

We won't be able to get a Sandin type return sadly, as we held to long and committed seemingly to him but withdrew committment potentially right after.

Lilijgren should have been moved at the 2024 draft if we didnt see a top4 RHD under Berubes system or have told Berube to give him a leesh and a long look as we want to see him become a 5-6M player for us in 2 years.

Yep. The problem is he's locked into the second pairing with that salary if they have any plan/hope to move him.

Now if Lily takes the next step and makes us all look foolish, then management made the right call. Problem of course is even the front office seems skeptical about him

 

[Mikey Leaf]

The only reason why Lily played in the playoffs last year was because he was right handed...they were really short of these last year.

 

[hockeywiz542]

 

[notbias]

Good thing they didn't just overpay him.

 

[PromisedLand]

yea just saw this on twitter and came to post this

 

[Buds17]

I'm not sure how or why things might have went sour here? I'm quite honestly still hoping that they haven't.

 

[PanniniClaus]

I am assuming Berube has chosen Timmins size and abject lack of skill , over Lilly. Well if that's the case then find a trade partner.

 

[arso40]

I'm not sure how or why things might have went sour here? I'm quite honestly still hoping that they haven't.

we got a former 4th line coach that prioritizes compete and hard work over skill lily hasnt shown the compete he wants but hes still better than 3 of our defencemen even when he doesnt do that so i understand the coach but i dont same person who benched mcmann solid two forward for a scoring winger who didnt score man i guess every coach has pros and cons hope things work out is all ill say

 

[mapleleaf979]

Liljegren is a major liability. He has below average hockey sense. It wont change. He is very good at backward skating, thats it. He cant make plays, he isnt winning battles. He isnt smart enough to think with other NHL players. Ive said that for years now, the contract signing at 3 million per, was baffling to me. Leafs have paid him 1.4 million in signing bonus already. So 4.6 million over 2 years is his cost to a team that wants to reach the salary floor and save 1.4 million in real money. Thats the only team that would take him.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

 

[GQS]

This really sucks. I was hoping a new coach would give him a legit shot at being an important piece on this team which is something he's never had a chance under Keefe. Instead it seems like they just want to kick him out the door.

 

[Maplebeasts]

Honestly just trade him at this point. If we're seriously at the point where this GM and coach think Timmins is a better option (LMAO) then what are we even doing? This Dcore is f***ed in 2 years when our right side is comprised of a geriatric Tanev, rookie/sophomore Niemela and the obligatory #6/7 who is big and can't actually play hockey, and that's IF Niemela ever gets a chance either. If you don't like Liljegren in your top 4 fine but he puts up inarguably elite results on the bottom pair and better than average results in the rare occasion he has been able to play top 4 minutes.

 

[Macallan18]

Honestly just trade him at this point. If we're seriously at the point where this GM and coach think Timmins is a better option (LMAO) then what are we even doing? This Dcore is f***ed in 2 years when our right side is comprised of a geriatric Tanev, rookie/sophomore Niemela and the obligatory #6/7 who is big and can't actually play hockey, and that's IF Niemela ever gets a chance either. If you don't like Liljegren in your top 4 fine but he puts up inarguably elite results on the bottom pair and better than average results in the rare occasion he has been able to play top 4 minutes.

ahhh, stop confusing the issues with facts.
We are cursed with old time coaching and an idiot gm.
We may get lucky with decent goaltending, but man, it will be painful this season.

 

[The Management]

Yeah, I'm sort of baffled at how they've handled this player, giving him an extension with a salary that reflected some faith in him taking a step forward, only to scratch him on opening night and now they're trying to find a "landing spot" for him? Dressing Timmins in his place?

I don't know. I didn't love the Sandin trade at the time, but I could understand it. The way they've handled Liljegren makes far less sense to me.

 

[DarkKnight]

Lil was going to arbitration and his numbers supported that money, anyone saying we over paid him is, well….

Just trade him, someone will see value. Sucker.

Yeah, I'm sort of baffled at how they've handled this player, giving him an extension with a salary that reflected some faith in him taking a step forward, only to scratch him on opening night and now they're trying to find a "landing spot" for him? Dressing Timmins in his place?

I don't know. I didn't love the Sandin trade at the time, but I could understand it. The way they've handled Liljegren makes far less sense to me.

I would have kept Sandin over Lil, at least he’s outstanding in some areas of the game.

 

[Ianturnedbull]

Honestly just trade him at this point. If we're seriously at the point where this GM and coach think Timmins is a better option (LMAO) then what are we even doing? This Dcore is f***ed in 2 years when our right side is comprised of a geriatric Tanev, rookie/sophomore Niemela and the obligatory #6/7 who is big and can't actually play hockey, and that's IF Niemela ever gets a chance either. If you don't like Liljegren in your top 4 fine but he puts up inarguably elite results on the bottom pair and better than average results in the rare occasion he has been able to play top 4 minutes.

I like your use of the word "elite".