Re-tooling For One More Run With This Core

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Matthews signed a 5 year deal
He may want to win something in his career.
It's not out of the realm of possibility that he decides to move on from this shit show
If he shows no interest in re-signing and the Leafs trade him by June 30, 2023 before his NMC kicks in, so be it. But I don't see it.
See last summer we went into re-tooling and identified Hyman, Bogosian, Thornton and Freddy Andersen etc as the problem the core didn't win, and replaced them with Bunting, Kase, Nick Ritchie (who became Ilya Lyubushkin) and Petr Mrazek and got the same result. While the players they deemed expendable are still playing and on rosters now in the second round with their new teams.

Hyman for example who has 4-2-6 playoff points, has as many goals as Auston (4) and more than Marner (2), Nylander (3) and Tavares(3) of Leafs core in this years playoffs. He was blamed because he couldn't put Matthews and Marner over the top, and into round #2 last year, but not the case getting McDavid and Draisaitl moving on.

Hyman wanted a raise so Leafs replaced him cap wise with Bunting, Kase and Ritchie thinking 3 for 1 was better for the goal of longer term playoff success. Ritchie already long gone, Kase an RFA with multiple injury filled season and questionable to return, while Bunting took Hyman's spot on the top line beside AM & MM and while he had a good regular season his 1 goal playoff resulted in the same 1st round loss for the team.

Bogosian goes from TB (Stanley Cup) to ---> Toronto (out in round #1) --> back to Tampa (Stanley Cup ? TBD)

Freddy Andersen for $4.5 mil cap puts up 35 wins in reg season helping Carolina to 1st in the Metro, his replacement Mrazek for $3.8 mil saving $750k cap plays in 20 games and wins 12 for Toronto and now Leafs want out of that contract. Freddy Andersen deemed the problem in Toronto in game #7's the reason Leafs didn't advance in prior years, so his playoff replacement Jack Campbell also now 0-2 in series clinching games the 2nd best goalie in the game.

So this years Hyman, Thornton, Bogosian and Andersen appear to be identified as Mikheyev, Spezza, Lyubushkin and Jack Campbell all UFA and deemed expendable so Leafs can bring back the same core group again swapping out a few spare parts and run it back..

Lets hope this year's big trade like Kadri for Kerfoot and Barrie turns out more successful than last one for Leafs. Where Kadri blamed for past playoff losses, and now Kerfoot and Barrie more recent ones. Of course ex-Leafs Kadri and Barrie are now still playing in round #2, while the current one Kerfoot directly responsible and can be pinpointed to for a loss and exit, and earmarked to GO in trade this year,

After rinsing and repeating this process now for the past 4 unsuccessful years, Leafs current management trifecta, believe lucky #5 is the charm, and plan once again to tinker & re-tool around the edges with the process, when apparently its not the players being swapped out, but rather the players and management team staying that is the constant denominator in the Leafs losing in round #1. Pretty obvious you can't blame Hyman nor Kadri nor Barrie nor Freddy Andersen for the Leafs struggles in this years playoffs. :wg:
How was this 2021 "re-tooling" different from the multi-player turnover most teams go through every off-season due to free agency, trades, retirements, performance, cap issues, etc?
We rushed everything after the Washington series. We should have traded away all the upcoming UFA's and loaded up even more talent. Instead Lou and then Dubas decided we were very close and went the other way. So much for a patient rebuild scenario.
How many playoff teams/likely playoff teams do that? Most try to add at the deadline. GMs are notoriously greedy for success. Why would ours be any different?

Anyone tell Tie Domi and Darcy Tucker they were too short to play tough?
Domi -- probably not after his rookie year.
Tucker -- probably a lot. He wasn't feared like Domi was.
 
How many playoff teams/likely playoff teams do that? Most try to add at the deadline. GMs are notoriously greedy for success. Why would ours be any different?
I'd love to hear the "WE SHOULD HAVE KEPT TANKING!" crowd explain how exactly we were going to keep tanking after Matthews and Marner joined the team. Only likely way it happens is if the Leafs intentionally leave both of them in the minors for another couple of years just to actively make their team worse...
 
I'd love to hear the "WE SHOULD HAVE KEPT TANKING!" crowd explain how exactly we were going to keep tanking after Matthews and Marner joined the team. Only likely way it happens is if the Leafs intentionally leave both of them in the minors for another couple of years just to actively make their team worse...
It's not deliberate tanking we wanted. We just knew the chances of them bucking the trend and winning within a few years of getting those players was highly improbable. We wanted Lou to trade JVR and Bozy along with any other upcoming UFA's for some more capital to build with. If we still managed to make hay in the playoffs...great...but we would have been set much better down the road had we done that. The ONLY caveat on my take is that Hunter was still in charge of the draft at that point and would have mucked it up in all likely hood.
 
I'd love to hear the "WE SHOULD HAVE KEPT TANKING!" crowd explain how exactly we were going to keep tanking after Matthews and Marner joined the team. Only likely way it happens is if the Leafs intentionally leave both of them in the minors for another couple of years just to actively make their team worse...

I don't think Babcock or Lou would have wanted to 'let air out of the tires' on that 2016-17 playoff team but I suppose they could have quietly phased out JVR, Bozak before the season started. That's all in hindsight though, there was a lot of excitement with that build and I don't think anyone would have wanted to throw cold water on what looked like Chicago Blackhawks.
 
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Two trades to help the leafs.

To
Toronto
2022 1st 13th overall
Wahlstrom
Mayfield

Islanders
Nylander
Sandin

To
Toronto
Gibson
Comtois

Ducks
2022 1st 26th-28th overall
Robertson
2024 2nd
Kerfoot
Mrazek
 
I'd love to hear the "WE SHOULD HAVE KEPT TANKING!" crowd explain how exactly we were going to keep tanking after Matthews and Marner joined the team. Only likely way it happens is if the Leafs intentionally leave both of them in the minors for another couple of years just to actively make their team worse...

It’s not that they should have tried to tank, but instead realize that they were still building. Trade JvR, Bozak, Gardiner… don’t acquire Plekanec, Boyle, etc.
 
The oilers had two goals called back with one being even worse then Holl setting an absolutely idiotic pick.

What did they do? They scored 5 more. Maybe we need to stop making excuses and grow a set
I sure wish we were playing the LA Kings...and not the two time stanley cup champs who are now favored to hit the finals...
 
Two trades to help the leafs.

To
Toronto
2022 1st 13th overall
Wahlstrom
Mayfield

Islanders
Nylander
Sandin

To
Toronto
Gibson
Comtois

Ducks
2022 1st 26th-28th overall
Robertson
2024 2nd
Kerfoot
Mrazek
I think the Ducks GM would be fired if he made that trade. Robertson hasn’t proven anything at the NHL level yet, Kerfoot is overpaid, and Mrazek can’t stay healthy.
 
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I sure wish we were playing the LA Kings...and not the two time stanley cup champs who are now favored to hit the finals...
Depends on what your goal is. If all you want to do is win one playoff round, then I suppose your concept has some merit.

If you want to go deep in the playoffs, or win a Cup, then you are going to have to beat some really good teams anyhow.

You got to beat the best to be the best.
 
I sure wish we were playing the LA Kings...and not the two time stanley cup champs who are now favored to hit the finals...
I see you’re still drinking the Dubas koolaid. There always seems to be an excuse for this group. Against Columbus it was losing Muzzin, against Montreal it was losing JT even though we won 3 games without him. This year it was having to play the 2x defending Cup champs. It will be interesting to see the excuses, should we go out in the 1st round again, for next season.
 
I sure wish we were playing the LA Kings...and not the two time stanley cup champs who are now favored to hit the finals...
Curious of your thoughts on last year when Leafs played a team Montreal they finished +18 points better and was ranked #16 entering the playoffs, including holding a 3-1 series lead. Every playoff qualifying team wanted Montreal last year if they wanted to be favoured to win.

The Kings have won two Stanley Cup titles (2012 and 2014) in the Salary Cap Era. Kopitar, Doughty, Quick their Cup winning core is still all there.

Leafs haven't won a single playoff round since 2004, before the Salary Cap even existed, and have have the longest playoff drought in the NHL, including 6 straight years with this core player group.

You know that saying about Stones and Glasses house? .. I wonder how many other teams fan bases wished they played the Toronto Maple Leafs in the playoffs, knowing their chances of advancing are greater against the team with the worst playoff record? The Leafs organization wished they had the LA KIngs level of failure, with just 2 Cups in the past 10 years. :wg:

Do Leafs fans ever view their own team through the lenses of the opposition, because it must be those Leafs fans that do, that are the most critical of their own teams lack of progress and success that desire change.
 
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Interesting that the highest scoring team since the mid nineties, The Florida Panthers, are being neutralized in the playoffs. Their PP is oh for 20+ and Barkov and Huberdeau have been MEH in their 8 games.

Tampa without Point is up 2-0 on the #1 team in the East winning two away games in an arena where Panthers seldom lose. Team is made up of winners and an elite coach. They want to win B2B2B and go down in history as one of the best teams. Meanwhile we just want to win a round.
 
We already had the easy set up scenario last year when the format was revised due to COVID. We did nothing with that opportunity.

I sure hope the players don't think that winning just round is the goal. It's alright if the fans have that loser mentality, but its a problem if the players, coaches and management think that way.
 
Interesting that the highest scoring team since the mid nineties, The Florida Panthers, are being neutralized in the playoffs. Their PP is oh for 20+ and Barkov and Huberdeau have been MEH in their 8 games.

Tampa without Point is up 2-0 on the #1 team in the East winning two away games in an arena where Panthers seldom lose. Team is made up of winners and an elite coach. They want to win B2B2B and go down in history as one of the best teams. Meanwhile we just want to win a round.
Don't forget be respected in the handshake line
 
Interesting that the highest scoring team since the mid nineties, The Florida Panthers, are being neutralized in the playoffs. Their PP is oh for 20+ and Barkov and Huberdeau have been MEH in their 8 games.

Tampa without Point is up 2-0 on the #1 team in the East winning two away games in an arena where Panthers seldom lose. Team is made up of winners and an elite coach. They want to win B2B2B and go down in history as one of the best teams. Meanwhile we just want to win a round.
Florida hasn't made the adjustments to their PP scheme, so the PK defense strategy that the Bolts have deployed has been effective. I think that unless the Panthers make some adjustments, their PP will be neutered.
 
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Depends on what your goal is. If all you want to do is win one playoff round, then I suppose your concept has some merit.

If you want to go deep in the playoffs, or win a Cup, then you are going to have to beat some really good teams anyhow.

You got to beat the best to be the best.
Its with regards to comparing our post season success this year to that of the Oilers...which was brought up.

duh.

I see you’re still drinking the Dubas koolaid. There always seems to be an excuse for this group. Against Columbus it was losing Muzzin, against Montreal it was losing JT even though we won 3 games without him. This year it was having to play the 2x defending Cup champs. It will be interesting to see the excuses, should we go out in the 1st round again, for next season.
Dubas is the smartest GM we've had in my lifetime who seems to have managed to make us consistently better year after year...

Beyond his ability to negotiate smartly around the salary cap...(which is a HUGE plus in this era of cap management) You are willfully ignoring his getting Bunting, Campbell, Gio, Brodie, Lybushkin, Kampf, Kase all had sound impacts on an improved Leaf season this year. He has missed the mark specifically on Marchment but no GM wins them all.

Which GM is better? Whom would you replace him with? Or are you one of them "I'm sad so we need to burn it down" temper tantrum kind of fan?
 
Its with regards to comparing our post season success this year to that of the Oilers...which was brought up.

duh.


Dubas is the smartest GM we've had who seems to have managed to make us consistently better year after year...

Which GM is better? Whom would you fire him to go get?
Comparing to the Oilers is yet another waste of time and the domain of losers imho. And, at least the Oilers have won a few playoff rounds in our timeframe of futility.

I don't care about the Oilers. It just seems so petty and silly to worry about them, and they are not in our Division or Conference even. Just win baby & the rest is noise including worrying about crap like that.

I also see a lot of blaming the refs - sound familiar? More excuses & silly, futile crap.
 
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I think having Hyman still in our lineup might have been the difference needed to get by Tampa.

Should have dumped Kerfoot and Holl and kept Hyman. Hyman has made a real difference with the Oilers, while Kerfoot's mistakes, and Holl's brain farts, did our Leafs in !!!

JMHO !!!
 

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