Ranking Dubas' worst transactions - #2

[andora]

It is actually mind blowing he had such ferocious support from a part of the fanbase. It was death by a thousand cuts and some people absolutely loved it and defended it. Crazy.

Yes to death by a thousand cuts 100%. Little thing after little thing just so frustrating

 

[Peasy]

The Marner contract leading is either telling you how good of a GM he is or how dumb this fanbase is.

Marner was slightly overpaid at the time and is well worth his contract now.

Compared to all his comparable, he was highly over paid lol.

 

[Notsince67]

Compared to all his comparable, he was highly over paid lol.

Which comparables were those?

 

[ACC1224]

When you consider Marner could have been had for 8.5 it’s a pretty valid mistake even if he is only slightly overpaid.

 

[ULF_55]

Tough crowd.

Tavares level players hitting the market never happens and when one from the area did and he chose us and actually didn't suck, he maintained his play and should for the next two seasons. He didn't come in and bomb, but he's the worst move I guess. All of those terrible moves the franchise has made in just Dubas time frame and JT who will statistically go down may be 15 top in scoring for the organization all-time inside his 1st contract, the one we are discussing, is his worst move as GM.

He was UFA, and people may be comparing him to RFA's who have no leverage except to accept offersheets or sit out.

Tavares was signed before the world wide pandemic.

 

[ULF_55]

It’s like a sort of anti-resume.

I wonder how it stacks up against guys like Burke/Nonis/Ferguson.

That would actually be a very interesting summer thread. Too bad I’m too lazy to put that much thought/effort into it.

Now that's funny.

Kind of like comparing him to Ballard era.

Leafs haven't had a good GM since Quinn who was more coach/GM before the Cap.

(Lamoriello didn't prove much in Toronto ... drafting Matthews 90% of fans would have done, marner was Hunter, Lou did not turn the team around. None of their core players are Lamoriello acquisitions are they?)

 

[notbias]

Compared to all his comparable, he was highly over paid lol.

which are?

 

[TorMapleJays]

I want to set this up on Bremner St and see the reactions lol

 

[BrannigansLaw]

Now that's funny.

Kind of like comparing him to Ballard era.

Leafs haven't had a good GM since Quinn who was more coach/GM before the Cap.

(Lamoriello didn't prove much in Toronto ... drafting Matthews 90% of fans would have done, marner was Hunter, Lou did not turn the team around. None of their core players are Lamoriello acquisitions are they?)

I completely forgot about Lou somehow. You can throw Fletcher into that list too. That Steen trade was a big time stinker from what I remember

 

[Dekes For Days]

The Marner contract leading is either telling you how good of a GM he is or how dumb this fanbase is.

If the two worst moves a GM makes over 5 years is signing an elite player in free agency and re-signing a franchise-caliber talent to a post-ELC contract consistent with history, then you've got a pretty good GM. And somehow, this thread doesn't realize what it's actually proving.

 

[Mess]

Compared to all his comparable, he was highly over paid lol.

People that believe his contract is fair don't understand the difference between RFA cost controllable years and UFA free agent years.

Marner's contract coming out of his ELC was 6 year term of which the first 4 years were RFA years and last 2 at UFA prices.

Matthews even worst still with 4 X RFA years and only 1X UFA years.

Matthews offered the Leafs his RFA years @$9 mil (and that amount was unheard of at the time as outrageous) but still FAR better than Dubas eventually served up for Matthews and Marner.

I'd love for anyone who thinks these contracts are normal to explain the Marner and Matthews contracts RFA rate and UFA rate paid by Toronto.

The only way they make remote sense if the term was 8 years on both deals where you have 4 X cheap RFA years and 4 X expensive UFA years and the average over 8 years = current AAVs.

Matthews current deal should be entering year #1 of UFA status this year with 3 more years still locked up after that at $11.634 mil & not Matthews trying to get $13.5 mil now on a 3-4 year deal.

 

[Jozay]

The Murray deal. Really bad stuff from Dubas in that one.

 

[Dekes For Days]

People that believe his contract is fair don't understand the difference between RFA cost controllable years and UFA free agent years.
Marner's contract coming out of his ELC was 6 year term of which the first 4 years were RFA years and last 2 at UFA prices.
Matthews even worst still with 4 X RFA years and only 1X UFA years.

View attachment 730564

Matthews offered the Leafs his RFA years @$9 mil (and that amount was unheard of at the time as outrageous) but still FAR better than Dubas eventually served up for Matthews and Marner.
I'd love for anyone who thinks these contracts are normal to explain the Marner and Matthews contracts RFA rate and UFA rate paid.

The people that know that his contract is fair understand the difference between RFA and UFA perfectly well.
They know that there is no singular "RFA rate" and "UFA rate". Compensation adjusts with a number of factors, including age and contract status, with the value of a season rising throughout a player's 20s, peaking in the later 20s UFA years, and then declining throughout a player's 30s.
They also know that a weird picture of a deleted tweet from a no-name twitter account claiming year-outdated negotiation rumours that were obviously incorrect (and wouldn't be relevant to the later in-season negotiation either way) is not something that should be treated as fact.

 

[Buds17]

If the two worst moves a GM makes over 5 years is signing an elite player in free agency and re-signing a franchise-caliber talent to a post-ELC contract consistent with history, then you've got a pretty good GM. And somehow, this thread doesn't realize what it's actually proving.

I can only agree with "pretty good" so much because of the majority of items that make up this thread. Aside from that, re-signing Marner and signing Tavares would actually comprise two-thirds of the bottom 3 on my list of The Worst Of Dubas as Leaf GM.

 

[TMLBlueandWhite]

Giving him a verbal NTC was dumb, but at least non-binding. Considering that Nylander was the one of the four big signings who actually played to the value of the contract, the verbal promise didn't hurt us at all.

Thanks for the response.

That stupid promise prevented Dubas from re-balancing the roster. He should have traded Nylander and signed one of the big name UFA defensemen. Instead he kept the friendship circle holding hands.

Proving, in spectacular fashion, that a soft, no hit, top heavy, all offense team can't win in the playoffs.

 

[mikeyz]

Jeeze didn’t realize how much he f’d up

He’s arguably just as bad as JFJ.

 

[Racer88]

If the two worst moves a GM makes over 5 years is signing an elite player in free agency and re-signing a franchise-caliber talent to a post-ELC contract consistent with history, then you've got a pretty good GM. And somehow, this thread doesn't realize what it's actually proving.

This thread is only on number 2, we could go into the double digits and each one would be just as bad. Mrazek and Murray are 2 more easy ones that come to mind. Let’s throw in some Foligno for added spice…….and Keefe.

 

[Arzak]

The people that know that his contract is fair understand the difference between RFA and UFA perfectly well.
They know that there is no singular "RFA rate" and "UFA rate". Compensation adjusts with a number of factors, including age and contract status, with the value of a season rising throughout a player's 20s, peaking in the later 20s UFA years, and then declining throughout a player's 30s.
They also know that a weird picture of a deleted tweet from a no-name twitter account claiming year-outdated negotiation rumours that were obviously incorrect (and wouldn't be relevant to the later in-season negotiation either way) is not something that should be treated as fact.

Wow that's a whole paragraph of you proving you don't understand the difference. But it made me chuckle, thank you

To keep it hockey related, unlike your post. The biggest difference you happened to omit is your ability to sign with a single team vs all of them (yes non-existing offer sheets and teams lining up to overpay Mitch and lose their draft capital at the same time) .

 

[DarkKnight]

The Murray deal. Really bad stuff from Dubas in that one.

Especially after he already just doled out a first for the Mrazek debacle. Murray was pure panic mode, I said it at the time and all the Dubists argued it was some master plan, he scrambled and got burned, zero surprise there.

 

[Mess]

The NHL Network (owned by the NHL) just put out their recent prospect rankings that placed the Leafs 25th out of 32 teams for Dubas body of work for selections and the damage inflicted on Leafs future by spending future capital to try and win now which produced 5 wins in a single playoff season over 5 years of draft pick abuse.

Our poor Leafs team haven't even faced the full impact of this yet as Dubas has traded away high picks like 1st and 2nd rounders years into the future.

No team in the NHL made less entry draft selections than Toronto past 3 years.

 

[weems]

It's pretty crazy when you see all these moves listed and then think...

0 Presidents trophies won during his tenure
0 Atlantic division titles won during his tenure
0 Long playoff runs during his tenure

This was for a group that was once heralded as having multiple stanley cup upside.

After all this some team actually gave this guy 40 million dollars

 

[Havoc]

Trading for Bostons 1st rounder when they're 100 points ahead of second place was hilarious.

 

[Mess]

This thread is only on number 2, we could go into the double digits and each one would be just as bad. Mrazek and Murray are 2 more easy ones that come to mind. Let’s throw in some Foligno for added spice…….and Keefe.

When your GM runs out there and signs UFAs for Free of asset loss and then turns around and gives away draft picks to undo his own damage inflicted is another level of BAD.

Signing Nick Ritchie for 2 years as UFA and then giving away a 2nd round future pick to remove him before year #1 is even completed a perfect example of gross incompetence.

 

[Anthrax442]

Not gonna lie, I endorsed several of those "bad" transactions: protecting RHD Holl instead of protecting more forwards, acquiring Foligno (the price was higher than it should've been), taking a flyer on Murray (although there should've been more retention and a larger sweetening). I wouldn't have traded Kadri, I think he should've been a Leaf lifer, but at the time Kerfoot and Barrie seemed like a decent return, maybe Dubas should've flipped Barrie immediately or at least moved him mid-season as it was evident that he did not fit into the team's system and structure. And most damning of all: I posted the rhetorical question long before the Marleau deal "Would you trade our 1st round pick in order to retain both Kapanen and Johnsson?"

What am I saying? Maybe I also should not be the GM of the Toronto Maple Leafs.

The Zaitsev/Brown deal wasn't fantastic either. Also the Par Lindholm-Nic Petan was an odd decision to deal center depth for a project player on the cusp of the NHL playoffs.

Leafs fans talked about getting Barrie for a few years. When Leafs got him, it was a win, because the Leafs right side of D was complete trash. Who knew he was so terrible defensively.

Sandin trade should be up there too. Still think he was too young to give up on.

 

[socko]

I've never played an easier game than ranking Dubas blunders. There are so many of them to choose and each of them is a good answer.