JESSEWENEEDTOCOOK
Twenty f*ckin years
- Oct 8, 2010
- 80,070
- 17,710
Same.
I don't think he's as bad as some make him out to be myself, though. I don't dislike him. I just don't really like him, either. I am pretty ambivalent about him.
Confirmed with Link: Rangers sign Dan Boyle - 2 yrs / $9M ($4.5AAV)
- Thread starter silverfish
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Same.
I don't think he's as bad as some make him out to be myself, though. I don't dislike him. I just don't really like him, either. I am pretty ambivalent about him.
Zil
Shrug
- Feb 9, 2006
- 5,559
- 43
Second best. Don't put words in my mouth. If you want a cursory explanation for why Klein sucks, here it is:
When Klein is on the ice, the opposition takes 54.5% of the shots. If you're giving up an elevated number of shots your opponent doesn't need a very high shooting percentage for the goals to pile up. Even though Klein rarely makes the one big gaff that your eyes are likely to pick up on, you're still getting burned on the percentages. Remember, every shot against is a chance for the puck to take any number of crazy bounces and wind up in the back of the net.
It's similar to baseball and defensive metrics. The guy with superior range who makes a few extra errors is way more valuable than a guy with poor range and sure hands. The rangier guy gets to way more balls which turns into way fewer hits given up even if he makes a few more errors.
TheTakedown
Puck is Life
- Jul 11, 2012
- 13,694
- 1,493
And to put his play in his own end and the truth about his offense in perspective:
Joe Pavelski F: 41g +23
Joe Thornton F: 76p +20
Patrick Marleau F: 33g
Logan Couture F: 54p +21
Brent Burns D: 22g +26
Tommy Wingles F: +11
Jason Demers D: +14
Vlasic D: +31
Havlat F: +14
Irwin D: +5
Braun D: +19
Dan Boyle D: 12g 36p -8
The only defenseman on the team to be a minus player.
+/- is not the best indicator, but sometimes it can paint a picture.
His offense was inflated playing with that group. And it isn't enough to make up for the play in his own end.
Sharks fans all mention his decline, and yet, it seems most Rangers fans are in denial.
Don't listen to the ones who watch him play 82+ games per season, judge him by youtube videos.
Don't listen to the ones who watch him play 82+ games per season, judge him by youtube videos.
Boyle isn't what he used to be but he can still play. The Rangers aren't paying him almost $7M which Boyle made in San Jose. Its $4.5M. He will add offense to their blue line. He is a right handed shot for the PP. Vigneault and Arniel got more out of the power play than the previous coaching staff did with the same personnel. They like the righty shots on the PP. The Rangers had one righty shot. Stepan. The Canucks defense under AV generated points. The Rangers need offense from their back end. Where are the Rangers finding that player? AV likes 3 lefties and 3 righties. He isn't crazy about players playing their opposite side. Its a 2 year commitment. Detroit offered Boyle 3 years and $12.5M.
The Rangers could have 3 defensemen add offense. McDonagh,Boyle and Moore. A full year of Moore with Klein.
The Rangers have been after Boyle since 2008 when TB had him on the market. TB signed him and then Koules/Barrie strong armed him to accepting a trade to San Jose later that summer.
Marty St.Louis isn't what he used to be but he is still an effective player.
The Rangers could have 3 defensemen add offense. McDonagh,Boyle and Moore. A full year of Moore with Klein.
The Rangers have been after Boyle since 2008 when TB had him on the market. TB signed him and then Koules/Barrie strong armed him to accepting a trade to San Jose later that summer.
Marty St.Louis isn't what he used to be but he is still an effective player.
Amazing Kreiderman
Registered User
- Apr 11, 2011
- 45,070
- 40,920
Ovechkin finished the season with a +/- of -35. I would still love him on my team. +/- is a useless stat
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
EC, I don't think any of us are in denial about his decline. That statement from RB sums up the thought perfectly. No one expects him to play a 1st pair type of game. We aren't expecting 50-60 points. And he's not getting paid to do so.
Also, the common assessment of players on HFNYR has been completely wrong enough times for me to question the common assessment of any other team board on here.
There always are biases. Good and bad. You summed up what RB summed up perfectly. Guess also, I'm trying to be more of a fan these days instead of an armchair GM and criticize what I see, recognizing there's a ton of moving parts when putting together this team, especially now with the cap and being constrained by the cap. My initial reaction was, great, seen this move before, but this is a different time and there is a base. If he doesn't light the world on fire, I don't think it will be as noticeable as it was in the past. Getting that puck up ice to generate odd man rushes and scoring chances is what this offense is about. He helps the PP - although I do think there's also a problem up front with the PP, but considering it was in the middle- of-the-pack with Richards and Boyle should be an improvement over him, I'm excited to see what it can be. Think many in the anti-Boyle movement were pro Stralman and a bit negative on Staal, which is fine, since I'm opposite that sentiment.
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
What's interesting is that, looking at their depth chart, I'm wouldn't be all that shocked to see him on the 3rd pair next season. On the right side, Garrison could easily slot ahead of him. If Gudas takes another step forward, Stralman could end up seeing less time.
I'm not saying that it will happen. Stralman seems to be pencilled in on the pair with Hedman. I'm not saying it to denigrate the player, either. I am saying it to point out that Tampa's defensive depth is suddenly really, really good.
Ail
Based and Rangerspilled.
Kinda like that team from NYC last year. That's no longer a certainty unfortunately.
If I'm not mistaken Boyle rushed back from a concussion and it really affected his play recently. I don't know if that was still an issue and I'm not saying I'm expecting him to rebound to his peak performances, but for example take a look at this article:
http://www.mercurynews.com/sharks/c...boyle-reveals-details-about-lingering-effects
He was hit from behind by Lapierre early in the season, October 15th, and he missed 7 games, came back too early, and his play suffered because of it a lot.
On the other hand, his point totals during the lockout season weren't great, though it was mainly his assists that were down. A bit hard to judge on that season since not every player stayed in great shape, etc.
Ultimately though I'm saying he was bad for a long stretch last season because he was still suffering through concussion issues. I wouldn't use that as a true measuring stick and I think we'll get a bit of a different Dan Boyle than we saw last season.
http://www.mercurynews.com/sharks/c...boyle-reveals-details-about-lingering-effects
He was hit from behind by Lapierre early in the season, October 15th, and he missed 7 games, came back too early, and his play suffered because of it a lot.
On the other hand, his point totals during the lockout season weren't great, though it was mainly his assists that were down. A bit hard to judge on that season since not every player stayed in great shape, etc.
Ultimately though I'm saying he was bad for a long stretch last season because he was still suffering through concussion issues. I wouldn't use that as a true measuring stick and I think we'll get a bit of a different Dan Boyle than we saw last season.
Tawnos
A guy with a bass
I read somewhere that he also rolled into the Olympic break with a broken thumb. Then again, he's an older player. Injuries can catch up to a guy.
undoubtably Boyle will be the whipping boy next next when we go through the ups and downs of the regular season. the writing is clearly on the wall already and is only intensified by the butt-hurt about Stralman's departure.
Nonetheless, i think it was a solid move. While obviously in decline, he's a solid veteran that can comfortably replace richard's on the PP and contribute in a 2nd/3rd pairing role on even strength.
Ideally he'll be playing 3rd pairing & 1st PP minutes through the regular season. This will likely depend on the progression of Klien and/or a solid performance from a rookie in camp thus making J. Moore expendable.
Nonetheless, i think it was a solid move. While obviously in decline, he's a solid veteran that can comfortably replace richard's on the PP and contribute in a 2nd/3rd pairing role on even strength.
Ideally he'll be playing 3rd pairing & 1st PP minutes through the regular season. This will likely depend on the progression of Klien and/or a solid performance from a rookie in camp thus making J. Moore expendable.
Tomas Sandstrom 28
Registered User
- Aug 3, 2005
- 669
- 13
And in 09-10 Stralman was -17, the worst +/- on the entire Columbus team. And the year after, he was -11, 2nd worst among Dmen (Tyutin was worse at -12). Different teams, different dynamics. Boyle can score goals, Stralman doesn't.
I'm good with this signing, oddly in part because of the recent draft. I know some have said 'we downgraded from Stralman' or 'same old Rangers grabbing old timers,' but I don't think that's our M.O. any more. You look at us draft goalies and see Clark saying, "They are 4-5-6 years away from being at the NHL level and that fits in pretty good for us."
This isn't the old Slats show. The team has gotten deep into the playoffs with decent consistency and now seems more managed by committee. Gorton yesterday, for instance, was asked about the potential loss of UFA players: "A lot of these guys we brought in. We have a good scouting staff that have found players and if holes are created because guys leave for more money or more term somewhere else, we have a lot of confidence in the room that we will be able to find those players again."
And when asked about Dan Boyle: "In any player that you sign you are looking at different factors: age, price and what they can do for you. We went through all of that. He turned down significantly more money and another year from other places and I don't think a lot of people around the league are worried about where he is as a player. We are not concerned, we think he can do it for us. He's a dimension we haven't had and a player like that who wants to come here is important too."
There's a bigger picture in play these days and a collective set of minds at work. Fact is, we've been to the Conference Final twice in the last three years and once to the Final. I don't think that's happenstance and I think the mgmt team is focused on trying to keep it rolling, while focused on the future, as well. Considering they are managing to succeed, even through roster turnover, maybe we should have a little faith.
This isn't the old Slats show. The team has gotten deep into the playoffs with decent consistency and now seems more managed by committee. Gorton yesterday, for instance, was asked about the potential loss of UFA players: "A lot of these guys we brought in. We have a good scouting staff that have found players and if holes are created because guys leave for more money or more term somewhere else, we have a lot of confidence in the room that we will be able to find those players again."
And when asked about Dan Boyle: "In any player that you sign you are looking at different factors: age, price and what they can do for you. We went through all of that. He turned down significantly more money and another year from other places and I don't think a lot of people around the league are worried about where he is as a player. We are not concerned, we think he can do it for us. He's a dimension we haven't had and a player like that who wants to come here is important too."
There's a bigger picture in play these days and a collective set of minds at work. Fact is, we've been to the Conference Final twice in the last three years and once to the Final. I don't think that's happenstance and I think the mgmt team is focused on trying to keep it rolling, while focused on the future, as well. Considering they are managing to succeed, even through roster turnover, maybe we should have a little faith.
Ice Hockey
Registered User
Another thought on Stralman, and maybe this is a question since I'm not up on the Rangers' depth, but could the Rangers staff be thinking someone within the organization takes Stralman's place in a couple seasons as a top four defender and thus why lock him up to that kind of money, and a NMC, when they may have a formidable top four and don't want to pay a guy on the third pair, chipping in not much on offense, and now can't move him? Boyle helps one issue and is gone in two years. Perhaps there are other scenarios they are looking at (other than bring in any old guy to man the PP). This may have been a move that looks two years out while looking at today. We don't know what goes on behind closed doors, and of course we aren't going to always agree with their final moves, but a lot goes into it other than the end result, and not everyone is available at the right price.
TheTakedown
Puck is Life
- Jul 11, 2012
- 13,694
- 1,493
TollefsenFan
Registered User
Don't get some of the hate towards this move. He adds offense from the blueline, replaces Richie as PP QB, and adds a shot from the point that NYR has been missing. Is he old and probably declining? Sure, could be. But it isn't like he's being paid $6-7 mil per like Richie was or like even he was last season. Guy took less term/$ to come to NY, so it isn't like Sather got him by throwing $$$ at him. Guy wants another shot at a cup. I will agree that compared to Stralman, I don't think his defensive game will be up to snuff, but there's hope the offense helps make up for that. And playing him with a solid defender like Staal could help some compared to his pairing options in SJS.
I haven't read the whole thread, so sorry if this has already been said: All of this is not to mention considering other d-men on the team and waiting in the wings. If you sign Stralman instead of Boyle, you get a player for 5+ rather than 2 years. And you make it somewhat tough to keep Staal. Personally, I'd take Staal over Stralman. Then there are the kids. Having Boyle on a 2 yr contract vs Stralman on a 5 yr gives guys like McIlrath and Skjei the time to develop and ease their ways into the lineup. Better than signing Stralman, struggling to sign Staal, and if successful at signing both -- blocking the young, cheaper guys from making the lineup.
I haven't read the whole thread, so sorry if this has already been said: All of this is not to mention considering other d-men on the team and waiting in the wings. If you sign Stralman instead of Boyle, you get a player for 5+ rather than 2 years. And you make it somewhat tough to keep Staal. Personally, I'd take Staal over Stralman. Then there are the kids. Having Boyle on a 2 yr contract vs Stralman on a 5 yr gives guys like McIlrath and Skjei the time to develop and ease their ways into the lineup. Better than signing Stralman, struggling to sign Staal, and if successful at signing both -- blocking the young, cheaper guys from making the lineup.
