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Terrible? Is your vocabulary this poor that you can’t find a more appropriate descriptive for a full fledged professional league?
Prospect Info: Rangers Prospects Thread (Stats in Post #1; Updated 5.29.18)
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Terrible? Is your vocabulary this poor that you can’t find a more appropriate descriptive for a full fledged professional league?
NYR Viper
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The interesting thing to me was there were a few teams interested in him
- Aug 5, 2010
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Likely “interested” as in exchange for their minor league assets that they don’t have expectations to amount to much.
The Crypto Guy
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...because it's a pro league means what exactly? The Alps Hockey League his a professional hockey league in Italy, am I not allowed to say it's a terrible league too?
It's not a terrible league. It's behind the KHL and SHL in the European hockey hierarchy, but it's hardly terrible. Barkov, Ristolainen, Teravainen, Laine, Aho, etc., they all spent prime development years there and they seem to be doing fine. Pretty much all top Finnish prospects go the Liiga route. Obviously Virta is older and does need to get over to North America to take the next step, but he's in a league where younger players learn plenty about the game and come out pretty polished. The league isn't terrible by any stretch.
It's probably the third-best professional league in Europe. It's not terrible. By any definition of the word terrible.
The Crypto Guy
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That was YEARS ago for some of those players. The league has certainly went downhill. And they were what, 16-17-18 year olds? He's 22. Sure for a 16 year old playing in a pro league there that is great for their development. But that should tell you something about the league if 16-17 year olds are able to thrive in it...
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Top 5-6 professional league in the world at worst. Clearly, the appropriate description is that it is “terrible “.
He turned 22 a month ago. He was 21 for the duration of the season. And as I conceded, yes, he needs to come to North America to take the next step. And come on--Laine was there 2 seasons ago. Same for Aho. Let's not pretend these guys were over there a decade back.
I don't believe the league has gone downhill. To a degree, where maybe once you could argue it was on par with the SHL, and now it's clearly behind it, but that's not "terrible" by any stretch. I have no disagreement with your point that he needs to come over, just with the characterization of Liiga as terrible.
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It’s fully your right to be or not be impressed by Virta’s performance. But this is not what I called you out on.
The Crypto Guy
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Laine was 16-17 years old. Aho was 17-18 years old. For development purposes playing in any of the bigger top pro leagues is great. But you won't see those players playing there at 21-22 year olds.
"Terrible" might have been an exaggeration, but it's still not a league where i'm going to look at highlights and come across very impressed.
That was the point all along.
Virta was 21st in scoring and there was only one player younger than him that had more points, Vesalainen who just went in the first round to Winnipeg. Virta had a nice season, even for someone his age. Whether you are impressed by that is up to you. No one is proclaiming him a star in the making.
Also, I don't know why anyone would be interested in Tambellini on anything other than an AHL deal. There's not much there, other than shot. Admittedly I only watched pieces of a handful of Hartford games this season, but based purely on his stat totals I have a difficult time believing there was a ton of improvement from last season (when I watched him and he sucked) and this season. Maybe I'm wrong, though. Maybe there's some "there" there.
Lion Hound
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Tambellini or Nieves?
Maybe the bloodlines are factoring here for Tambellini. His dad is a scout still I believe for Anaheim.
The article said that Cantlon "can confirm" there are at least three teams interested in Tambellini. It didn't say in a trade, as a free agent, NHL deal, AHL deal, etc. It was kind of a weird statement, honestly.
Nieves I would imagine would have more suitors, but I also suspect the Rangers hold onto him (unless he's requested in a trade or something).
HFsNumber1Heel
FKA Roo Returns...Still A Contrarian Apparently
I don't think either Nieves or Tambo have a future here.
Tambo has put up OK third line numbers at the AHL level. I don't think there's a next step in his development and if that's the case, cut ties and save a contract spot. They hit 2/3rds in that third round. Getting two NHLers from a draft is considered very good to excellent depending on their role/impact, they got 2 NHLers in the third round, that's impressive.
I've mentioned it before but the fact that they called up Beleskey and Fogarty instead of Nieves, or had Holland/Deharnais playing after The Letter and before the TDL where the four callup maximum is allowed, that pretty much gave me all the information I needed to know about their view of Nieves. He's in the Immonen category where he could probably have a decent NHL career, but they don't see anything they particularly love in him. He'll probably end up being a journeyman NHLer and maybe if he's lucky he'll catch on with the right club at the right time and be a 4th liner for a few years.
Tambo has put up OK third line numbers at the AHL level. I don't think there's a next step in his development and if that's the case, cut ties and save a contract spot. They hit 2/3rds in that third round. Getting two NHLers from a draft is considered very good to excellent depending on their role/impact, they got 2 NHLers in the third round, that's impressive.
I've mentioned it before but the fact that they called up Beleskey and Fogarty instead of Nieves, or had Holland/Deharnais playing after The Letter and before the TDL where the four callup maximum is allowed, that pretty much gave me all the information I needed to know about their view of Nieves. He's in the Immonen category where he could probably have a decent NHL career, but they don't see anything they particularly love in him. He'll probably end up being a journeyman NHLer and maybe if he's lucky he'll catch on with the right club at the right time and be a 4th liner for a few years.
Amazing Kreiderman
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Terrible? It's the 3rd best league in Europe after the KHL and SHL. The EBHL is mediocre. The Dutch league is terrible.
If he was putting up these points in the SHL or KHL he wouldn't be a late round pick. But I guess everyone has to be Laine or Ovechkin.
He wouldn't be the first player to make it to the NHL with that history. Liiga is a pretty good league. Better than the ECHL
The Crypto Guy
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Gotcha, so how many 22+ year olds does the Liiga produce to the NHL each year?
Amazing Kreiderman
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Comparables? Joel Arma. Jori Lehtera. Joonas Donskoi. Miikka Salomaki.
Based on production.
Mac n Gs
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Even if Virta is only a successful AHL forward, that’s a win for a 7th round pick.
Virta is a Fast a type of player, at least he is a good hockey player. Can play well at the AHL level and definitely take shifts in the NHL. Unlike say a Lakatos who seems to be so far away.
If Fast becomes too expensive, Virta or Lindqvist might be able to replace him.
If Fast becomes too expensive, Virta or Lindqvist might be able to replace him.
Amazing Kreiderman
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If he becomes a fringe NHL player, that's great. Just because he isn't going to score 30 goals a season, doesn't mean it's automatically a wasted pick.
While I don't fully disagree with your overall point that Nieves might not have a future here, I don't read into the Fogarty/Beleskey transaction. I think they called up Fogarty maybe just to get a quick look, or as a reward for playing hard in the system for a couple years. He has no future with the club (I say that as a Fogarty fan), so it wasn't like they were only calling up guys that were "in the plans." I don't really know why they called up Beleskey other than to take a quick look, but regardless, they know what Nieves is and there'd be no point to bringing him up for a final game when they could take a look at someone else.
I've gone to see the Wolfpack live each of the last three years. Every year I post the notes that I made during the game. And each year I come back and realize I have no notes on Tambellini. Nothing good, nothing bad, just nothing.
Three years with 32, 35 and 32 points is not moving in the right direction. I agree with nyr2k2 that there doesn't seem to be much there. And I agree with White Plains Batman. 2 out of three 3rd round picks turn into NHLers. Let's just accept that success and call it a day. I'm not against resigning him if they need him to fill an AHL roster spot but other than that I don't expect more than we have seen to date.
Three years with 32, 35 and 32 points is not moving in the right direction. I agree with nyr2k2 that there doesn't seem to be much there. And I agree with White Plains Batman. 2 out of three 3rd round picks turn into NHLers. Let's just accept that success and call it a day. I'm not against resigning him if they need him to fill an AHL roster spot but other than that I don't expect more than we have seen to date.
Joey Bones
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Irishguy42
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