Confirmed with Link: Rangers name Alain Vigneault head coach - Part II

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This team has no PP QB to speak of, not a single LW that can consistently provide offense, and center depth that isn't exactly scaring anyone around the league.

My suggestion to you is take a look at the past Stanley Cup champions and reassess your "experience and knowledge," because its completely out of whack with reality.

:laugh: My suggestion to you is not be an internet tough guy and at least attempt at having a respectable debate/conversation on this topic.

You act as if you need an all-star team to win the cup. You don't. The Devils made the cup last year with WHAT talent?

I don't need to assess anything. I've been watching long enough to know the formula to winning a cup or any other championship for that matter is to get hot at the right time.
 
It's sad that he doesn't even understand how much that statement has to do with his record the last 20 years.

Then it's even sadder when you realize that HE is just realizing this now about the NHL and coaching.

And even sadder than that ? He was ready to keep Torts until the players woke him the **** up !

I don't find a whole lot of this to be factual. You have no basis for the attack on Sather's self realization. Don't really see the relevance either. Either has been cognizant of the current game, and he has attempted to match his team and staff to the trend. I take issue with his reactionary approach. Be bold, be innovative. Have conviction. He wanted to be tough when Anaheim won. Now he wants puck possession. Too flimsy. Work to the strength of your core.

You don't know what happened with torts. Coaches became available. Torts could have refused to adjust. And why bash glen for listening to players? I prefer him to be hands off during the season. I hate GMs inserting themselves in the locker room ala jerry Jones/bobby clarke
 
That's on the coaching. If you think coaching doesn't matter, that's your prerogative, but I doubt you'll find many people who agree with you.

You are correct. Not sure anyone I know agrees with me on this point. However, no one I have ever met can point to a coach who is better than the others once you toss out the obvious morons.

I'm exaggerating slightly about coaches being interchangeable, but just slightly. More importantly, a coach can win a Cup one year and finish out of the playoffs the following year.

Assuming that their coaching acumen has not greatly changed over the course of one season, the only logical conclusion is that the personnel is responsible for a coach's success.

By the time a player gets to the NHL, there isn't all that much you can teach them, except for some defensive responsibility, because most NHL players were so good at lower levels that defensive responsibility may not have been necessary to their game.

What else can a coach give to his players, besides defensive responsibility? They all practice very similar strategies.

How do you determine that one coach is better than another?
 
Assuming that their coaching acumen has not greatly changed over the course of one season, the only logical conclusion is that the personnel is responsible for a coach's success.

But that isn't the only logical conclusion. Of course the players play a huge part in the success of the team. But what if the talent level improved from year 1 to year 2, and the new players weren't effective within the same system? Isn't it incumbent upon the coach to adjust his system to better fit his personnel?

Last year's team was overall much better at playing within Tort's system. This year's team wasn't as good at it and Torts didn't make the necessary adjustments.

By the time a player gets to the NHL, there isn't all that much you can teach them, except for some defensive responsibility, because most NHL players were so good at lower levels that defensive responsibility may not have been necessary to their game.

What else can a coach give to his players, besides defensive responsibility? They all practice very similar strategies.

That's just not true. Every coach employs their own strategies and those stategies can vary much more than you think.

If you are watching the finals, just watch how boston plays in their own zone. They pressure the points more than we do. They use the middle of the ice much more than we do. They have much better breakouts than we do. We haven't had an effective transition game in years. We generate almost all of our offense off the forecheck. Because we have no transition game, we struggle with our offensive zone entries and have to dump and chase a lot.

How do you determine that one coach is better than another?

Comparing one coach to another is difficult. I don't watch other teams as much, so I don't get a good feel for how those coaches operate. I can't tell you that AV will be a better coach for us than Torts was. When I watch our team, I see where the problems are and I judge the coach based on how he adjusts to those problems.

How many times did we get trapped in our own zone for long stretches this year? Time and time again the puck would go around to the half-boards and the other team would easily beat us to the puck. The points were almost always open. We played very passively in the defensive zone.

Torts did nothing to address this problem. His only solution seemed to be to tell his players to play better. Torey Krug killed us in the boston series. Why didn't we have someone in his face every time he got the puck?

Torts came in with the mantra of "Safe is death", yet for 4 years we played the safest system imaginable in front of one of the best goaltenders in the league. As long as it was working, fine, but it wasn't working this year. It was time for a change and Torts didn't seem like he was willing to change.
 
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In the NY Post, Glen Sather spoke with Larry Brooks and said that he isn’t sure what the future holds for Mark Messier in the Rangers organization.

Sather said that Messier was disappointed to learn that Sather chose Alain Vigneault to become head coach and that he would take a few days to ponder his future.

Sather said that he and Messier have not spoken since that call.

http://snyrangersblog.com/


Grow the hell up Messier. Its been so hard to try to keep liking this guy anymore.
 
Can someone show me the quotes that people are reacting to that shows that Messier is entitled and thought that he deserved the job?

kthnxbye.
 
Can someone show me the quotes that people are reacting to that shows that Messier is entitled and thought that he deserved the job?

kthnxbye.

From Sather's quote. the fact that he'd even apply for the job AND is disappointed he didn't get it? Seriously? Oops, this article points out he coached Team Canada in a Deutschland Cup and Spengler Cup in 2010. Excuse my arrogance but what the hell is a Deustchland Cup even? (Yes, it's obviously some sort of German tourney I've never heard of)

kthxgojumpoffaboat

http://sports.yahoo.com/blogs/nhl-puck-daddy/mark-messier-figuring-future-ny-rangers-head-coaching-164052391.html
 
I'd like to see if this comes out or if its true: that it WAS Messier's job and Messier was insistent that he hire Leetch and someone else <unnamed> that Messier wanted. Sather insisted that Messier hire someone with legitimate NHL coaching experience and Messier wouldnt budge. With that, Vigneault was offered the job. Has anyone seen Messier around since last Monday?
 
I'd like to see if this comes out or if its true: that it WAS Messier's job and Messier was insistent that he hire Leetch and someone else <unnamed> that Messier wanted. Sather insisted that Messier hire someone with legitimate NHL coaching experience and Messier wouldnt budge. With that, Vigneault was offered the job. Has anyone seen Messier around since last Monday?

I think it's just more likely Sather wasn't completely incompetent.
 
From Sather's quote. the fact that he'd even apply for the job AND is disappointed he didn't get it?
Disappointed, to me, doesn't say anything about his expectations. I get disappointed when the Rangers lose, even when not I'm expecting them to win.
 
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I'd like to see if this comes out or if its true: that it WAS Messier's job and Messier was insistent that he hire Leetch and someone else <unnamed> that Messier wanted. Sather insisted that Messier hire someone with legitimate NHL coaching experience and Messier wouldnt budge. With that, Vigneault was offered the job. Has anyone seen Messier around since last Monday?

I must have missed this rumor, what was this about?
 
Disappointed, to me, doesn't say anything about his expectations. I get disappointed when the Rangers lose, even when not I'm expecting them to win.

Time will tell. If he leaves the organization over those, I dont know how else you can view it other than he felt slighted due to a strange sense of entitlement.

"I brought you the Cup in '94 as a player, so I should be able to learn on the job as a coach" isnt exactly a strong hand to play
 
I must have missed this rumor, what was this about?
"I'd like to see if this comes out or if its true:" - Seems like abev is speculating.

Time will tell. If he leaves the organization over those, I dont know how else you can view it other than he felt slighted due to a strange sense of entitlement.
What if he leaves to take an assistant coach/AHL coaching job?
 
Why's everyone still talking about Messier? :laugh:
I know it's the offseason, but I would like to forget the bullet we dodged with that situation.

I'm getting slightly more exciting about AV, but maybe that's just longing for the hockey season. Or maybe it's just the relief of not hiring Messier.
 
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i know fans are gonna hate this but i bet Pyatt will play on a line with Nash or Stepan. he played on the 2ed line under Vigneault as Canucks coach and had some good years for them... had 2 37 pt seasons for them and one 20 goal season where he had 23 goals only 3rd behind Naslund 24 and Daniel Sedin 36 in 06-07 season.....
 
i know fans are gonna hate this but i bet Pyatt will play on a line with Nash or Stepan. he played on the 2ed line under Vigneault as Canucks coach and had some good years for them... had 2 37 pt seasons for them and one 20 goal season where he had 23 goals only 3rd behind Naslund 24 and Daniel Sedin 36 in 06-07 season.....

Don't get your hopes up then, lol.
 
i know fans are gonna hate this but i bet Pyatt will play on a line with Nash or Stepan. he played on the 2ed line under Vigneault as Canucks coach and had some good years for them... had 2 37 pt seasons for them and one 20 goal season where he had 23 goals only 3rd behind Naslund 24 and Daniel Sedin 36 in 06-07 season.....
Pyatt was 7th in forwards ice time per game in his last season under Vigneault.
 
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