Gurglesons
Registered User
40-50 points a season NHLer was my thought, that's all
Yeah, I think that's like he hits everything we absolutely could want from him.
40-50 points a season NHLer was my thought, that's all
Koivunen seems like he realistically tops out as a 3rd liner. Pickering seems like he realistically tops out as a middle pairing guy. Flip a coin pretty much, imo.
I mean, he might. But looking at his recent season in Liiga compared to say, Bryan Rust at a similar age, what's Rust showing that Koivunen isn't?Koivunen seems like he realistically tops out as a 3rd liner. Pickering seems like he realistically tops out as a middle pairing guy. Flip a coin pretty much, imo.
Winger yes, center no. I’m a firm believer of building down the middle. I would like to see Koivunen play a little more of the North American before putting him ahead of Pickering.I take a middle pairing guy over a third liner every day.
Skating, tenacity, overall athleticism. 1 and 3 are a pretty large part of evaluation.I mean, he might. But looking at his recent season in Liiga compared to say, Bryan Rust at a similar age, what's Rust showing that Koivunen isn't?
I very specifically remember people complaining about Rust when we drafted him, because his ceiling was perceived to be as a third liner. Might as well take swings for boom or bust prospects in round 3 instead of drafting a guy who peaks out as a 3rd line plugger. He proved those opinions wrong. Koivunen might too.I mean, he might. But looking at his recent season in Liiga compared to say, Bryan Rust at a similar age, what's Rust showing that Koivunen isn't?
I guess I don't get why people think his ceiling is a 3rd liner. Seems like a masochist pessimism viewpoint.
All I ever remember about Rust was speed. I don't recall anyone ranting and raving about tenacity or athleticism during his junior year at ND.Skating, tenacity, overall athleticism. 1 and 3 are a pretty large part of evaluation.
All I ever remember about Rust was speed. I don't recall anyone ranting and raving about tenacity or athleticism during his junior year at ND.
And this wasn't meant to shit on Rust, I'm just saying that at 21 after a PPG season and PPG playoff in Liiga, suggesting that he tops out as a 3rd liner is a little odd. Not saying he's a bonafide 1st line blue chipper but I think there are reasons to be optimistic.
Pono over Koivunen?I think it's fair to say Pickering has won this slot.
Next up is Ponomarev
He's after Pono. IMHOPono over Koivunen?
bolded- but that doesn’t mean it wasn’t there?All I ever remember about Rust was speed. I don't recall anyone ranting and raving about tenacity or athleticism during his junior year at ND.
And this wasn't meant to shit on Rust, I'm just saying that at 21 after a PPG season and PPG playoff in Liiga, suggesting that he tops out as a 3rd liner is a little odd. Not saying he's a bonafide 1st line blue chipper but I think there are reasons to be optimistic.
Ponomarevs AHL stats are meh. This team has really acquired a lot mid prospects.
He's 21.bolded- but that doesn’t mean it wasn’t there?
I don’t agree that if you were able to run a 1000 simulations, Koivunen’s best year(s) are as a 3rd liner. I do agree that his profile needs to score, and do so at an efficient/high rate, to be valuable. I also agree Liiga is really bad these days. And scoring consistently in the national league is the hardest thing to do in hockey so it’s hard to be highly confident in a player like this. Especially when knocks on him are size, skating, strength, athleticism. And his previous AHL stint did not go well.
He’s a legit prospect but there’s not a multitude of things he can be in the NHL, at least not from what I’ve seen. It’s good scoring winger if he hits. Not going to be a Brandon Tanev type. So middle 6 points guy that lacks physical tools and needs the right linemates to not be an empty calorie scorer feels like a safe middle ground… and what is that worth?
Hence that knocks him down below Pickering, Ponomarev for me. Neither absolutely have to rely on production to have some value, or at least that’s how they profile at this juncture.
He's 21.
Ponomarevs AHL stats are meh. This team has really acquired a lot mid prospects.
Thanks for ignoring my post. Pickering is 20 btwHe's 21.
Yes, how many times do you think Sully muttered to himself, "If only I had a team full of Harkins, Porters, and Nietos . . . "Yes.
But there are a LOT of them, you see!