Proposal: Proposals Thread: Fix this broken club

[Oil In My Veins]

but the ones that are...really are a piece of work for sure.

I don't want to kick the Canucks while they're down, but holy balls, Gillis....that takes quite an effort to do to Vancouver what you have done.

Garth Snow anyone?

How about this:

Tonight, when the Oilers are playing, count how many times Eberle does his patented fly-by forecheck.

I'll count Yakupovs, then we'll compare notes.

And lets also watch how many times Yak is standing there in either zone looking like he has absolutely no clue what to do but he's ready to go 1000 miles an hour after the play has already moved on.

Then lets see how many times Yak successfully forchecks, backchecks, kills a penalty or is able sustain an offensive cycle of any sort.

IMO Eberle is going be a much more complete player when all is said an done.

 

[Valic]

How big are Krejci and Bergeron, how big are Zetterburg and Datsyuk, to look even further back how about Sakic and Forsberg we can be successful with Nuge and Reinhart down the middle. Size is way overvalued and should never trump actual ability to play the game, what we have too much of is soft skilled one dimensional players, that is not what Reinhart is or what he will develop into. Also Reinhart isn't that slight by the time camp roles around next year Reinhart would be 6'1 and likely a little north of 185lbs if he hits the weight room at all.

I'm not totally against Draisatl he has a big frame and he is quite skilled and I like how active he is with his stick, but I don't see him being on the same level as Reinhart, Reinhart is always directly involved in the play and makes a ton happen out there, he's one of those players that is just a puck magnet, he always in position to contribute to the play and has the innate instinct to be in the right place at the right time. Draisatl despite his size plays the game a lot more passively and is more of an observer than is Reinhart.

This isn't a vacuum. Team building matters.

Bergeron and Krejic have/had Lucic, Chara, Marchand, Iginla, Horton, and a multitude of effective big men on the team.

Datsyuk and Zetterberg have/had Franzen, Holmstrom, Bertuzzi, Erickson. Not to mention Detroit is spiraling down now that all their skilled size has declinded. Plus having the best Defenseman for a decade.

Forsberg was a tank surrounded by Hall of fame talent.

By all means if you are content to wait another 5 years for Reinhart and Nuge to be physically mature enough to defend the likes of the Getzlafs, Kopitars, Thorntons, Backes, etc of the west go ahead, but I don't want to hear a single word from you about lack of fight, success in puck battles or perceived lack of effort from the entire forward core.

When you are weaker it takes more to fight for pucks wearing you out quicker.

Note this whole dont draft Reinhart was based on the premise of a poster wanting to keep all of Hall Ebs Nuge and Yak.

 

[redgrant]

I'm assuming its prospect/draft pick based. They could have interest in Gagner too.

Gagner + Klefbom + pick.

And I hope we do go hard for him. A guy who's 27, has shown top-pairing ability for the last couple of years in a puck possession system, and under a new coach has a down year. He's signed for a while, and has all the tools to flourish with some of our guys. Buy low on a guy who, imo, is a VERY good bet to rebound.

Especially if the Bruins were getting him for Matt Bartkowski + Spooner/Koko + pick iirc at the TDD.

A guy like Erhoff would be a godsend even more than Myers.

 

[ChaoticOrange]

If Ekblad is off the table, try to trade the pick for D.

If no good trade is available, take Bennet.

Sign Niskanen @ 5x6, go as high as 6.5
Sign Greene @ 3x4
Sign Legwand @ 3x5
Sign Smyth @ 1x1
Sign Arcobello 2x1.25

Trade Gagner + 2015 2nd to LA for Nolan+Muzzin (I was so against trading Gagner because of the gaping hole it left at 2c)

Trade Eberle to Philly for Simmonds

extend Petry and Jschultz at 3x3

Extend Lander 2x1
Extend Gazdic 2x.850

Let Lander/Arcobello and Marincin/Nurse duke it out for spots in training camp (roster reflects the oilers keeping Marincin/Lander up. If we need to dress Gazdic Smyth comes out.

PK units of Gordon/Hendricks and Legwand/Lander

PP1 Hall-RNH-Yak-Simmonds-Niskanen
PP2 Perron-Legwand-Smyth-J.Schultz-Petry

Team carries 13F-7D

Hall (6.0) -RNH (6.0) -Yak (3.75)
Perron (3.825) Legwand (5.0) Simmonds (3.975)
Hendricks (1.85) Gordon (3.0) Nolan (700K)
Smyth (1.0) Lander (1.0) Pitlick (888333)
Gazdic (850k)

Niskanen(6)-Petry(3)
J.Schultz(3)-Greene(4)
Ference(3.25)-Muzzin(1.0)
Marincin(730K)

Scrivens (2.3)
Fasth (2.9)

Team Salary - 64.01833 Million, leaving about 4 mil space on the projected 68 million dollar cap.

Not a cup winner by any stretch but much harder to play against and I think a legitimate playoff threat.

 

[Oil In My Veins]

A guy like Erhoff would be a godsend even more than Myers.

Couldn't agree more.

Myers could completely backfire, especially given the cost to get him.

Ehrhoff, as unlikely as it is that he'd come here, is the guy I'd want from the Sabres.

 

[Groucho]

Josh Rimer ‏@JoshRimerHockey 55m
And from what I'm hearing there will b a fire sale in Vancouver at the draft. Kesler, Edler, Bieksa must go. What does that mean for Sedins?


I go VERY hard after Edler. I know we'd pay more because we're in their 'division', but he'd fit in here so well. We could actually have a weaker opponent next season in terms of Van though, if their firesale goes for picks/prospects.

Gillis has already demonstrated an unwillingness to deal with the Oilers.
He's not going to trade a valuable asset to the Oilers for market price, it will take a stiff overpay.

See: Schneider.

 

[Groucho]

And lets also watch how many times Yak is standing there in either zone looking like he has absolutely no clue what to do but he's ready to go 1000 miles an hour after the play has already moved on.

Then lets see how many times Yak successfully forchecks, backchecks, kills a penalty or is able sustain an offensive cycle of any sort.

IMO Eberle is going be a much more complete player when all is said an done.

This here is video evidence of Yakupov backchecking.
Pay close attention here and you'll see Yak go to the boards and try and dig the puck out. Eberle notices this, flies the zone, and then DOESN'T come back to pick up the 4th man in and watches his check score.

You were saying?

 

[Up the Irons]

Or we could just use one of those three pieces to get a D-man we know is going to help us? Instead of something that could totally backfire....

I'd target teams that have surpluses of D who could move one. Buffalo isn't great, mainly because Ehrhoff probably wouldn't waive for us, Myers is a project, and everyone else is a prospect D-man.

Now, not many teams have surplus D, and we know this because Edmonton hasn't been rumored to be on a D-man since Coburn. Our best bet is probably the Coyotes, Canucks or Jets.

All are in-conference, so that sucks. If I look at the Canucks, I'm targeting Alex Edler. If I look at the Coyotes, I'm targeting Yandle, although they may want a D-man back for the present until Gormley can definitely step in. If I look at the Jets, who have some overrated D-men (Bogosian and Stuart), I'm looking at Byfuglien (who I'd also have interest in as a forward), Enstrom or Trouba.

I agree if you are moving Ebs, you want more of sure thing because Ebs is already a proven top line winger.

Yak is the good one to trade for Myers. risk for risk. both have a very high ceiling, but both might not reach it. If Buffalo would do it, you make the move yesterday. To me, Myers is worth the risk. I don't think it can completely backfire; no way is he going to be a total bum, he has too much in the toolbox for that to happen. His low end is a 2nd pairing horse D. His ceiling is the next Chara. that's a bet i take

 

[OnTheBrink]

I agree if you are moving Ebs, you want more of sure thing because Ebs is already a proven top line winger.

Yak is the good one to trade for Myers. risk for risk. both have a very high ceiling, but both might not reach it. If Buffalo would do it, you make the move yesterday. To me, Myers is worth the risk. I don't think it can completely backfire; no way is he going to be a total bum, he has too much in the toolbox for that to happen. His low end is a 2nd pairing horse D. His ceiling is the next Chara. that's a bet i take

Couldn't agree more, have watched maybe 10 sabres games since Xmas and Myers has looked like a top pairing in all but 2. I would buy now on him of one could. He is at worst a minute logging number 3, but IMO is much more likely to be a stud #1, to have has size and wheels is a rare combo.

 

[Oilerz]

They have to lead when they are ready to take on the mantle of leaders. Hall being out and about around town every night after games shows that he is definitely not ready for that responsibility. Our team benches the guys that stay home after games if they are playing bad, but the guys that go out and party seem to suffer no repercussions for any of their play.

A guy like Ferrence is perfect to show Hall and co. how a captain should conduct himself in his city. You should be better known by the school teachers and charity organizers then you are by the local bar sloots.

I agree somewhat, but if it's left to you, that time will never come. It's like having a baby, in that if you are waiting for the perfect time, it's going to be a wait. When it (leadership)is thrust upon you and you have to grab it or lose it, thats when the men step up I think.

 

[Oil In My Veins]

This here is video evidence of Yakupov backchecking.
Pay close attention here and you'll see Yak go to the boards and try and dig the puck out. Eberle notices this, flies the zone, and then DOESN'T come back to pick up the 4th man in and watches his check score.

You were saying?

This is what I was saying:

"And lets also watch how many times Yak is standing there in either zone looking like he has absolutely no clue what to do but he's ready to go 1000 miles an hour after the play has already moved on.

Then lets see how many times Yak successfully forchecks, backchecks, kills a penalty or is able sustain an offensive cycle of any sort.

IMO Eberle is going be a much more complete player when all is said an done."​

Ok, what I saw there:

Yak taking a long reach/swipe at the puck.

Then both Eberle AND Yakupov start to leave the zone looking for the outlet pass, Eberle up along the boards further ahead and Yak up the middle.

IMO both guys were cheating a bit and should have been closer in for a short pass option.

Then I see the puck get turned over along the boards with both players turning back, Yakupov gets sucked in down low while watching the puck instead of turning around to pick up the trailer.

Tanev then fires it in as Yak lies down in desperation the block the shot from his man.

IMO, as soon as Yakupov saw both D had things covered he should have turned around to find any one who might be open, but he doesn't.

Any other examples?


Edit: the real question I have is, why are those two guys out together as the two forwards in OT?

 

[Soundwave]

Fire Lowe. Fire Eakins. Fire all assistants.

Hire Peter Laviolette or Andy Murray. Make sure one of the assistants is a powerplay expert.

Hire 2-3 full-time bodybuilding/crossfit (whatever) trainers and a full-time chef to work with all kids from now on. No longer will we be the weakest team (physically) in the NHL. That ends now, you want to play for the Oilers, you will train and eat like a beast. End of discussion.

No more special treatment for Hall, RNH, or Eberle ... if they are dogging it or not backchecking, they are benched. No more picking solely on Yakupov.

Take a risk on Tyler Myers ... unless we get Ekblad in the draft we are likely ages away from having any young d-man project to a be a no.1 ... Myers at least gives us some one to groom for that role back there outside of Nurse who is years away from top pairing minutes.

I'd kick the tires on Adam Larsson too ... the Oilers need to look a d-men like this, at buy-low phase, because you're never going to get them after they break out.

Throw a lot of money at Andrei Markov on a 2-3 year term on July 5th if he's available.

 

[Burnt Biscuits]

This isn't a vacuum. Team building matters.

Bergeron and Krejic have/had Lucic, Chara, Marchand, Iginla, Horton, and a multitude of effective big men on the team.

Datsyuk and Zetterberg have/had Franzen, Holmstrom, Bertuzzi, Erickson. Not to mention Detroit is spiraling down now that all their skilled size has declinded. Plus having the best Defenseman for a decade.

Forsberg was a tank surrounded by Hall of fame talent.

By all means if you are content to wait another 5 years for Reinhart and Nuge to be physically mature enough to defend the likes of the Getzlafs, Kopitars, Thorntons, Backes, etc of the west go ahead, but I don't want to hear a single word from you about lack of fight, success in puck battles or perceived lack of effort from the entire forward core.

When you are weaker it takes more to fight for pucks wearing you out quicker.

Note this whole dont draft Reinhart was based on the premise of a poster wanting to keep all of Hall Ebs Nuge and Yak.

Team building does matter I would never argue the opposite. It won't take Nuge and Reinhart 5 years to be able to lock horns on an even footing with the best in the west they will both come along a lot faster then that.

When you are smaller you do have to work harder to fight for pucks and beat bigger men, but even better than working harder is working smarter and both Nuge and Reinhart are capable of that. A lot of it depends on positioning and just having an active stick and knowing the proper angle and timing for engaging a bigger opponent, you don't go out there and have a test of might you have to be smart about it. There are plenty of smaller men who do take a beating to win the puck battles, but if you have the fortitude and desire with the right amount of skill you can make it work. I can't even count the number of times I've seen Marty St. Louis thrown around and abused out there, but he never quits.

If we aren't able to acquire a big center to start the year I want Eberle gone. In general I feel the time is overdue and we need to cash in on him, I'd like to move Gagner as well, but with him the return is going to be so dissapointing I almost want to hold onto him a bit longer to just push his value up a bit higher, but it might be one of those times its just better to swallow the pill regardless of how bitter it might be.

 

[Oil In My Veins]

Fire Lowe. Fire Eakins. Fire all assistants.

Hire Peter Laviolette or Andy Murray. Make sure one of the assistants is a powerplay expert.

Hire 2-3 full-time bodybuilding/crossfit (whatever) trainers and a full-time chef to work with all kids from now on. No longer will we be the weakest team (physically) in the NHL. That ends now, you want to play for the Oilers, you will train and eat like a beast. End of discussion.

No more special treatment for Hall, RNH, or Eberle ... if they are dogging it or not backchecking, they are benched. No more picking solely on Yakupov.

Take a risk on Tyler Myers ... unless we get Ekblad in the draft we are likely ages away from having any young d-man project to a be a no.1 ... Myers at least gives us some one to groom for that role back there outside of Nurse who is years away from top pairing minutes.

I'd kick the tires on Adam Larsson too ... the Oilers need to look a d-men like this, at buy-low phase, because you're never going to get them after they break out.

Throw a lot of money at Andrei Markov on a 2-3 year term on July 5th if he's available.

I agree with pretty much everything except the bolded part.

If Myers was free he might be worth taking a look at but not if we have to give up an Eberle or Yakupov to 'find out' if he's going to turn into a player or not.

Like others have said, if we're trading any of the big pieces away it HAS to be for a player we KNOW can step in and help right away.

Otherwise I think it's too big of a risk and we should just hold on to our guys.

 

[OnTheBrink]

I agree with pretty much everything except the bolded part.

If Myers was free he might be worth taking a look at but not if we have to give up an Eberle or Yakupov to 'find out' if he's going to turn into a player or not.

Like others have said, if we're trading any of the big pieces away it HAS to be for a player we KNOW can step in and help right away.

Otherwise I think it's too big of a risk and we should just hold on to our guys.

That is why I think we trade our 2014 1st rounder if Ekblad is gone, there is always risk with draft picks and I would argue more then with Myers. Don't take anyone away from line up, but add a top pairing dman, right now!! Enough waiting!!! If they still suck next year... Then u tank and pick your center.

 

[SchultzSquared*]

Gillis has already demonstrated an unwillingness to deal with the Oilers.
He's not going to trade a valuable asset to the Oilers for market price, it will take a stiff overpay.

See: Schneider.

Then Gillis needs to lose his job... in fact if and when he is fired... it will be because of this exact reason... he has failed to get full value in any trade... just one rough ride after another from opposing GMs

It comes down to this.. even if MacT ran over his dog and ****ed his wife.. if the Oilers are offering the best package for something it behooves Gillis to take it... "rivalry" be damned... the two teams are riding opposite waves any way... while the Oil (ideally) push for the playoffs and contention the Nucks will be on their way down and playing for high picks... the fight for 3 point games will be irrelevant

To that end...

Yak + EDM 1st for Kesler, Edler, Hansen

Sign Moss (3 years $9.75M)
Sign Diaz (2 years $3M)

Resign Smyth (1 year $1.25M)
Resign Jones (1 year $1M)
Resign J. Schultz (2 years $7M)
Resign Petry (4 years $14M)
Resign Gazdic (2 years $1.6M)

Hall-RNH-Eberle
Perron-Kesler-Gagner
Hansen-Gordon-Moss
Smyth-Hendricks-Jones
Joensuu Gazdic

Edler-J. Schultz
Marincin-Petry
Ference-Diaz
Klefbom

Scrivens
Fasth

 

[McSuper]

No much point in this . You are going to get smart a$$ answers . Or you going to get idiots trades like Yakupov for the Schenn,s and Couturier + .


The simple answer is add more grit , physical players and defence . Getting the pieces we need is the question .

 

[Up the Irons]

I agree with pretty much everything except the bolded part.

If Myers was free he might be worth taking a look at but not if we have to give up an Eberle or Yakupov to 'find out' if he's going to turn into a player or not.

Like others have said, if we're trading any of the big pieces away it HAS to be for a player we KNOW can step in and help right away.

Otherwise I think it's too big of a risk and we should just hold on to our guys.

but Eberle and Yak, even at their best, can only be so impactful because they are only wingers. for a winger, unless the are in the Iginla mold, they are not very impactful. Eberle is basically another Alex Tanguay. Would you say he is a good as Cammaleri? Maybe, at best. Yak, somewhere between Kovalchuk and Samsonov, but closer to Samsonov. worth the risk, because Myers is going to be at least a #3.

 

[McOvechking]

No much point in this . You are going to get smart a$$ answers . Or you going to get idiots trades like Yakupov for the Schenn,s and Couturier + .


The simple answer is add more grit , physical players and defence . Getting the pieces we need is the question .

Frankly, the simple answer is leadership and captaincy. Ference is an absolutely horrible leader. It's clear that he doesn't have the respect of his teammates.

Trade him, make Hall captain. No trades required.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

but Eberle and Yak, even at their best, can only be so impactful because they are only wingers. for a winger, unless the are in the Iginla mold, they are not very impactful. Eberle is basically another Alex Tanguay. Would you say he is a good as Cammaleri? Maybe, at best. Yak, somewhere between Kovalchuk and Samsonov, but closer to Samsonov. worth the risk, because Myers is going to be at least a #3.

You think/hope.

Defending against Patrice Bergeron is one thing.

Defending against Getzlaf, Thornton, and Kopitar is another.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

Frankly, the simple answer is leadership and captaincy. Ference is an absolutely horrible leader. It's clear that he doesn't have the respect of his teammates.

Trade him, make Hall captain. No trades required.

What has Hall shown that makes him captain material?

 

[rasarhdasd]

What has Hall shown that makes him captain material?

I'd rather have Hall captain, instead of bottom-pairing defensemen.

 

[KeithIsActuallyBad]

I'd rather have Hall captain, instead of bottom-pairing defensemen.

That doesn't answer the question. What has he shown that makes him captain material?

 

[Paralyzer008]

Proposal: Perron for Captain.

 

[StoveTopStauffer]

Proposal: Perron for Captain.

Gordon for captain, only guy who shows up on a consistent basis.